Does floor NEED inaulation

[dalez]

Long term plan is to migrate yes, but I still am going to insulate like crazy so I also have the freedom to travel into Hell or the Artic if something warrants it :P

[dadto5]

Well, right now I'm on a schedule. My wife and kids have 8 weeks this summer. So this is it. My oldest finishes college and we're leaving on our trip before she starts her job.

I'm good with covering and insulating all the side windows that will be blocked by beds anyway. That will be about 1/2. The other 1/2 I would like to leave unobstructed. My bus wasn't a school bus, it was a luxury shuttle bus (not paratransit). The windows are slightly nicer and the 'bus body' is insulated already - I'll just be adding. In addition, the coach has A/C and Heat, but shuttle bus A/C and Heat is notoriously unreliable. I want to try to avoid a roof unit, which is why I thought portable A/C. If that won't do it then maybe roof unit is the way to go. I can't afford a multi-split system at this time.

So back to my original questions. Is rigid foam board flexible enough for ceiling contours? Do you us multiple thin sheets? Just batting of unfaced? Will fumes off spray foam be an issue in the hell that is Texas summers?

Thank you for the input.

[PNW_Steve]

Originally Posted by Geo Jeff

just keep moving until the temp is just right. summer in Texas? C'mon head north come back south in the winter. WE build this freedom to travel to the best places and YOU ALL DRIVE INTO FROZEN AND BURNING TEMPS.

Jeff....... What is the temperature outside your bus today?

[MiLochiNya]

Originally Posted by Buffy D. Bus

I'm with you on the clearance issue. I'm thinking using 1/2 foam, for the little bit of r value and mostly sound deadening, and then 3/4 plywood I'll torch for the "flame" effect and then polyurethane. Just paying for the 3/4 plywood I'm putting back down anyway only to be covering it up with another 1/2 of laminate that I paid for again bothers me. I'm frugal.

Hey, have you done this "torch-painting" yet?? I just bought a bus and have a short clearance (~73"). I plan on doing the floor but need to save as many inches as possible. Could you post a picture of this if you have done it already??

[family wagon]

Originally Posted by Adventure Bus

I am trying very hard not to do a roof raise. Im at 6'5" now before removing stock flooring. Im going to try and see if there is a way I can stay there (or even gain a little). Im 6'4" so very close.

My thought was, what if I did 1/2" of rigid foam on the floor, glue down 1/2 of tongue and groove plywood, then use some sort of sheeting for flooring? like linoleum or vinyl. Then later down the road if we notice its just too much cold or heat coming through the floor doing an exterior bottom spray layer of closed cell foam. Under my bus doesn't seem too much that I would need access to, before spraying I would drop down wires ect and clear it down as much as possible to bare metal then do about 2 inches of spray foam. My main concern with spray foam on the outside is that I have not seen it done, many here speak of it but its just conjecture and hard to find real world examples.

This plan would put the ceiling height within 1/4 inch of where it is now and save me from having to do a roof raise. Or should I just suck it up and do the 18" roof raise and not have to worry about space and do the full 3" of foam... Wonder which of these options would be cheaper.

Some buses have a layer of plywood under the rubber; others have the rubber bonded right to the steel. If yours has the plywood you can remove it and have that 3/4 inch of height back.

The only thing I'd say about the lay-up of 1/2" foam topped with 1/2" plywood is that if you pick relatively high-density foam, it might be good enough to use 3/4" foam topped with 1/4" plywood (luan or similar). Foam dents easily when hit with high pressure like the corner of an object, but when the same weight is spread over a large area it can bear surprisingly well. Maybe you could acquire "cheap enough" samples to test whether a thinner plywood in exchange for thicker foam meets your floor loading needs.

In case you're near the "pay the problem to just go away" point, there's a guy in Denver who does roof raises for hire.

My bus has foam under-floor. I can't find a photo of it at the moment but I'll try to remember to post one. The surface isn't smooth at all; it looks very globbed on.

Originally Posted by dadto5

Well, right now I'm on a schedule. My wife and kids have 8 weeks this summer. So this is it. My oldest finishes college and we're leaving on our trip before she starts her job.

I'm good with covering and insulating all the side windows that will be blocked by beds anyway. That will be about 1/2. The other 1/2 I would like to leave unobstructed. My bus wasn't a school bus, it was a luxury shuttle bus (not paratransit). The windows are slightly nicer and the 'bus body' is insulated already - I'll just be adding. In addition, the coach has A/C and Heat, but shuttle bus A/C and Heat is notoriously unreliable. I want to try to avoid a roof unit, which is why I thought portable A/C. If that won't do it then maybe roof unit is the way to go. I can't afford a multi-split system at this time.

So back to my original questions. Is rigid foam board flexible enough for ceiling contours? Do you us multiple thin sheets? Just batting of unfaced? Will fumes off spray foam be an issue in the hell that is Texas summers?

Thank you for the input.

Depending on where you're heading, maybe a 3000 CFM evaporative cooler is your best choice for this summer. With a bunch of windows open at the other end that'll fully change out all the air in a 40 ft bus about 1.6 times every minute and you'll stay relatively close to outdoor ambient temperature inside the bus, if not a bit cooler from the evaporation. The constant airflow will help your perspiration be more effective too. That's not so unbearable, and arguably better than an A/C that struggles to even make itself noticed. Add to that a thin radiant barrier like reflectix to shield you from the heat radiating off the interior metal of the bus.

The thinner the foam board, the more flexible it'll be. I think 1/2" would be prone to breaking but if you could find 3/8 or even 1/4 maybe they'd be accommodating. It's a thermoplastic so a bit of persuasion with a heat gun might soften the foam enough to make it bend even more before breaking. If you've got headroom to spare you could mount the foam boards to create a vaulted ceiling look rather than following the roof curve. There'd be some dead air space above but the install would be fast and easy and might look more presentable than an arrangement of small pieces fitted to the curve.

[ol trunt]

I was able to get away with 2 layers of 1" foam board without too much of a struggle. The foam I used was good about bending in one direction but when I wanted to insulate a compound curve (see pic) I cut pieces in one direction for the first layer, filled the voids with Great Stuff, then trimmed and cut the second layer in the other direction. I made sure all metal was painted with Rustoleum enamel to help slow the rust problem that would without a doubt ensue due to small entrapped air spaces between the insulation and the metal. I used spray glue (Dupont 77? I think) to help hold the insulation in place until I could reinstall the original metal headliner.

If you choose to heat your material to help it conform to irregular surfaces, do a test panel first. The material I used disappeared like a coffee cup in a bonfire the second I hit it with the heat gun. Jack
.

[superdave]

Originally Posted by dadto5

Well, right now I'm on a schedule. My wife and kids have 8 weeks this summer. So this is it. My oldest finishes college and we're leaving on our trip before she starts her job.

I'm good with covering and insulating all the side windows that will be blocked by beds anyway. That will be about 1/2. The other 1/2 I would like to leave unobstructed. My bus wasn't a school bus, it was a luxury shuttle bus (not paratransit). The windows are slightly nicer and the 'bus body' is insulated already - I'll just be adding. In addition, the coach has A/C and Heat, but shuttle bus A/C and Heat is notoriously unreliable. I want to try to avoid a roof unit, which is why I thought portable A/C. If that won't do it then maybe roof unit is the way to go. I can't afford a multi-split system at this time.

So back to my original questions. Is rigid foam board flexible enough for ceiling contours? Do you us multiple thin sheets? Just batting of unfaced? Will fumes off spray foam be an issue in the hell that is Texas summers?

Thank you for the input.

just watched a special about foam, the gassing only happened when installed improperly. it seems they put it in too thick and it didn't cure. the home use spray kits[ I got mine from ebay] are great. I moved around a lot and put it on in layers. I just filled the 2" rib space with the spray foam and then used 1/2 " poly board over the ribs for a thermal break. http://www.skoolie.net/forums/member...ture14838.html
the poly will form to the curve better and it works better in the cold from what ive read. good luck

[dadto5]

Originally Posted by superdave

just watched a special about foam, the gassing only happened when installed improperly. it seems they put it in too thick and it didn't cure.

A guy in Canada right? I saw that. Scared me - exactly why I'm asking.




I do think I've gotten enough information from here to make an honest attempt at insulating this thing against the heat.

As far as AC vs Swamp cooler vs Roof Air.......I'm going to go talk to a few local RV dealers and see if they have any used roof air units and price out a professional install. I already have a portable AC unit and if that isn't doing the job I can try a swamp unit. And if all else fails put the compass an N and start driving.

[DoubleO7]

When you go shopping for a RV roof ac have them run it for you.
Everyone I have ever heard running, you can't have a conversation with anyone in the RV. They were stupid loud.

[cadillackid]

if you are planning on a roof unit or a portable unit keeping you cool while driving (running a genny).. you will be disappointed.. make you dashboard A/C and heast work right and use good fittings, proper 134A conversion.. clean it all up nice and it wont be unreliable...

for being parked, you'll want your bus to be greatly insulated to even stand a chance in daytime sunshine... at night a poertable unit in your bus will do the job nicely.. or if you are highly shaded...

swamp coolers are great west of the mississippi but not east (even up north).. unless you like a cool Clammy feeling... gulf moisture makes it north and east... dewpoints in the high 50s even are pushing it for a swamp cooler to not make you feel clammy..

in the west they are fantastic where the dewpoint rarely gets into the 50s. unless it rains.. you can get a lot of cooling for vdery little energy use and wont make the bus too clammy inside...

even in ohio. michigan/ new england you'll see fairly humid conditions in spring and summer.. not much in fall unless you are south of the ohio river..

-Christopher

[superdave]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

if you are planning on a roof unit or a portable unit keeping you cool while driving (running a genny).. you will be disappointed.. make you dashboard A/C and heast work right and use good fittings, proper 134A conversion.. clean it all up nice and it wont be unreliable...

for being parked, you'll want your bus to be greatly insulated to even stand a chance in daytime sunshine... at night a poertable unit in your bus will do the job nicely.. or if you are highly shaded...

swamp coolers are great west of the mississippi but not east (even up north).. unless you like a cool Clammy feeling... gulf moisture makes it north and east... dewpoints in the high 50s even are pushing it for a swamp cooler to not make you feel clammy..

in the west they are fantastic where the dewpoint rarely gets into the 50s. unless it rains.. you can get a lot of cooling for vdery little energy use and wont make the bus too clammy inside...

even in ohio. michigan/ new england you'll see fairly humid conditions in spring and summer.. not much in fall unless you are south of the ohio river..

-Christopher

are you a good ac man chris, I must have moved one of mine the wrong way because it stopped working. not sure if I lost the juice or busted a wire.

[FuzzWantsABus]

Originally Posted by family wagon

In case you're near the "pay the problem to just go away" point, there's a guy in Denver who does roof raises for hire.

Who is this guy? How do I find him? I'm not at that point quite yet, but I may need to consider this option. PM me if you like.

[EastCoastCB]

Originally Posted by FuzzWantsABus

Who is this guy? How do I find him? I'm not at that point quite yet, but I may need to consider this option. PM me if you like.

Charles_M is his forum name.

$10,000 to raise your roof.

[FuzzWantsABus]

Originally Posted by EastCoastCB

Charles_M is his forum name.

$10,000 to raise your roof.

Dear God. I am doing a skoolie because I am NOT made of money. I'm sure it's a good option for some, but I think I'll wait until I'm more desperate.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by superdave

are you a good ac man chris, I must have moved one of mine the wrong way because it stopped working. not sure if I lost the juice or busted a wire.

I do a lot with A/C's. (used to be my trade till I found out I could make 3X the $$$ programming and installing computers instead of thermostats...)

does your bus have 2 compressors and 2 inside units? or just 1 compressor and 2 inside units?

if they are Trans / AIR and leak their freon out the controller will not allow the unit to start.. not even the indoor or outdoor fans or compressor..

-Christopher

[superdave]

I have 2 units and 2 compressors. Both worked. Now on the front unit the blower works. The fans outside work but the compressor does not engage. R 134 systems

[family wagon]

Originally Posted by EastCoastCB

Charles_M is his forum name.

$10,000 to raise your roof.

Yep, that's who I was thinking of. Didn't realize he charges that much. Maybe I should start doing 'em too. It'll only take me 2 years plus or minus to get it done.. Surely the second time would go faster!

[EastCoastCB]

Once Superdave and I raise my roof, and my confidence is higher, I'll gladly raise roofs for folks CHEAP. I'm gona work hard this year to get some property- then ITS ON, folks!
Charles is a HELL of a guy- but I think folks spending TONS of money on these things are missing one of the big points of going the school bus route vs just buying a badass coach.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by superdave

I have 2 units and 2 compressors. Both worked. Now on the front unit the blower works. The fans outside work but the compressor does not engage. R 134 systems

Most often when a compressor fails to engage it's usually low pressure or a simple wiring issue. Someplace near the receiver / dryer( little canister) there should be a pressure switch on it. If it's 2 wires you should be able to pull off the connector and ohm across the switch terminals .. if you get an open, time to put gauges on it and see if you have refrigerant. If it's a good circuit then start tracing wires from the compressor on toward the control relay panel. Each unit should have a little relay board someplace.. mine for redbyrd was stuffed in the driver switch panel, I've seen others in outdoor accessible compartments. These units are most all aftermarket so the installers can put them anywhere.. and it's easy when ripping wires out for a conversion to cut one..
Christopher

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by family wagon

Yep, that's who I was thinking of. Didn't realize he charges that much. Maybe I should start doing 'em too. It'll only take me 2 years plus or minus to get it done.. Surely the second time would go faster!

If there's people bidding a rusty dented bus up to nearly 9k then there's people willing to pay 10k for a roof raise
Christopher