Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 04-24-2017, 12:51 PM   #1
Bus Crazy
 
Brewerbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 1,918
Year: 1999
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, AT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
Spray foam and water/electric lines...

I've got most of my OEM flooring and seats out. Some clean up and paint and I'll be ready to start talking insulation. I'm thinking spray foam because it's the most airtight. If possible, I want to do floor, walls, and ceiling. If I do that, how do I run wires and plumbing later? Note: right now I don't even have a floor plan. Even if I did the ktichen and the bathroom will end up getting swapped just because Murphy has a sick sense of humor.

I was thinking of runnung some kind of conduit, maybe 1 - 1 1/2 inch with pop ups evey 5 feet or something. Not sure how easy fishing a snake thru there would be. I suppose I could run wires/pipes in cabinets and what not. I really don't want to leave a track like the rear heaters tho that would be best for expansion I suppose.

What's a good way to keep the wires and pipes hidden?
Brewerbob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2017, 12:54 PM   #2
Bus Geek
 
Robin97396's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Willamina, Oregon
Posts: 4,410
Year: 1997
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: TC 1000
Engine: 5.9
Send a message via Yahoo to Robin97396
You could run them between the frame rails.
Robin97396 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2017, 01:11 PM   #3
Bus Crazy
 
Scooternj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: EHT New Jersey
Posts: 1,134
Year: 2003
Coachwork: AmTran
Chassis: International 3000RE
Engine: T444E/AT545
Rated Cap: 75
Tuck your electrical against the chair rail, if you're keeping it low. Figure out your floor plan before you foam, though. After you've treated and painted the steel, mark it out with either chalk, tape, or dryboard markers. I'd also consider floor joists for the plywood subfloor, and then you can run your plumbing or electrical conduit along the joist.

I don't know if you have an access hatch to your fuel tank through the floor, but remember to make sure its accessible!. It'll save you a lot of grief later on if you have to access it.
__________________
Hey! That's not an RV, that's a school bus.
Well thank you for noticing, Captain Obvious

Captain Obvious on deviantArt
Scooternj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2017, 01:29 PM   #4
Bus Crazy
 
Brewerbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 1,918
Year: 1999
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, AT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooternj View Post
Tuck your electrical against the chair rail, if you're keeping it low. Figure out your floor plan before you foam, though. After you've treated and painted the steel, mark it out with either chalk, tape, or dryboard markers. I'd also consider floor joists for the plywood subfloor, and then you can run your plumbing or electrical conduit along the joist.
I've seen quotes here as high as $2400 for a bus. If that holds true then, I'm going to have to save up some money anyway (roughly $1,000 a month). That'll give me time to get a floorplan layed out.

I don't like the chalk outline idea all that much. I'll go to Costco and/or the liquor store and load up on cardboard boxes. A 28" pathway in tape looks fine until you try to get 2 butts thru it at the same time. So, I'm going to build my bus with cardboard boxes first. I'll stand here and cook something, now you go to the bathroom.

Quote:
I don't know if you have an access hatch to your fuel tank through the floor, but remember to make sure its accessible!. It'll save you a lot of grief later on if you have to access it.
Two (sorta). I have a 13 1/2" square access for the fuel pump and I have the filler neck that comes in the interior of the bus for a short distance. Not sure how that was ever legal. I know it's diesel and not nearly as bad as gasoline but some hippy dippy lawyer mommie should have been all over that.
Brewerbob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2017, 02:08 PM   #5
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Salt Lake City Utah
Posts: 1,252
Year: 2000
Chassis: Blue Bird
Engine: ISC 8.3
In lieu of pushing a fish tape through a conduit try tying a light string to a plastic bag and vacuuming it through. Kite string, mason line, even sewing thread can work. (I've vacuumed sewing thread with only a safety pin tied to it through about a 120 foot run of 3/4"!) Use the string to pull a real electrical pulling line in, and then pull the cable with that.

On the floor I'm planning to use foam board rather than spray foam. Not only is it cheaper, but IMHO on a floor it's particularly important that the surface be planar and smooth. It seems like a lot of work to shave sprayed foam to where it would be comparable to sheet foam. Sure sheets have joints, but I'm planning on a foam with adequate compressive strength so I won't be laying any 2x2's or whatever into the floor. That'll keep the joints to a minimum and those can be largely mitigated by using tongue and groove foam, taping, or multiple layers of thin foam with offset joints (or don't worry about them). As background to explain why the surface matters so much to me: I'm planning on a hydronic heated floor. I want to use sheet aluminum on top of the foam as a heat spreader and probably a floor finish on top of that. (Or maybe just leave the aluminum bare?) PEX tube would be clamped/bonded to the bottom of the sheet. I don't want any plywood in the assembly so I'm going for a clean flat face on top of the foam.
family wagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2017, 02:27 PM   #6
Bus Crazy
 
Brewerbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 1,918
Year: 1999
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, AT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by family wagon View Post
In lieu of pushing a fish tape through a conduit try tying a light string to a plastic bag and vacuuming it through. Kite string, mason line, even sewing thread can work. (I've vacuumed sewing thread with only a safety pin tied to it through about a 120 foot run of 3/4"!) Use the string to pull a real electrical pulling line in, and then pull the cable with that.
Never tried it but that must be a hell opf a vaccum cleaner at 120 feet!!

Quote:
On the floor I'm planning to use foam board rather than spray foam. Not only is it cheaper, but IMHO on a floor it's particularly important that the surface be planar and smooth. It seems like a lot of work to shave sprayed foam to where it would be comparable to sheet foam. Sure sheets have joints, but I'm planning on a foam with adequate compressive strength so I won't be laying any 2x2's or whatever into the floor. That'll keep the joints to a minimum and those can be largely mitigated by using tongue and groove foam, taping, or multiple layers of thin foam with offset joints (or don't worry about them). As background to explain why the surface matters so much to me: I'm planning on a hydronic heated floor. I want to use sheet aluminum on top of the foam as a heat spreader and probably a floor finish on top of that. (Or maybe just leave the aluminum bare?) PEX tube would be clamped/bonded to the bottom of the sheet. I don't want any plywood in the assembly so I'm going for a clean flat face on top of the foam.
Um, I have that in my kitcken and it doesn't care much about being flat. I used some self-leveling goop over top of the mats. It didn't turn out all that level and the tiles are broken from moving the fridge but the floor still works just fine.

I'm also thinking about putting this stuff in the bus as well. Not sure what the current draw is.

I'm also thinking of doing more tha 2". I'm thinking 3+". The bus is 74" ceiling and I'm 74". A roof raise is required. If I did the math right, replacing the windows and 3" of overlap top and buttom gives me an 18" raise using 48" sheet metal so I can afford an extra inch or three on the floor and ceiling. I might do the same on the sides. Everyone uses 2x2s. I'm thinking 2x4s sideways. Of course this all may change when I'm told it'll cost $7328 (random number) for that much foam. Hopefully it's nowhere near that.
Brewerbob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2017, 02:29 PM   #7
Bus Geek
 
Robin97396's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Willamina, Oregon
Posts: 4,410
Year: 1997
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: TC 1000
Engine: 5.9
Send a message via Yahoo to Robin97396
Yarn goes through the conduit pretty well the first time.

I've never heard of anyone spray foaming a floor on the interior. There have been a number of cases where people have foam sprayed from beneath the floor. That would be my number one choice because it doesn't steal any headroom.

At one time I had planned to tack weld pieces of sheep wire to the metal subfloor from underneath to give the spray foam more surface to cling to. It's still a possibility. I had cold feet all winter. I'm guessing there is less work involved in spraying foam from under the bus than there would be involved in removing the entire interior flooring to insulate.

I'm sure I'd find rust on my steel subfloor if I removed the plywood, but that's because of the way these things are treated, being frequently washed out by hose for 20 years. No, I'm not going back to the foundational spray foam guy for a subfloor insulation job. He wasn't very careful about spraying IMO. I'll spray it myself so I don't have anyone to complain about but myself this time.
Robin97396 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2017, 02:56 PM   #8
Bus Crazy
 
Brewerbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 1,918
Year: 1999
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, AT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin97396 View Post
Yarn goes through the conduit pretty well the first time.

I've never heard of anyone spray foaming a floor on the interior. There have been a number of cases where people have foam sprayed from beneath the floor. That would be my number one choice because it doesn't steal any headroom.
Thought I saw one just this afternoon when I did a search but I don't remember for sure much less the username.

Quote:
At one time I had planned to tack weld pieces of sheep wire to the metal subfloor from underneath to give the spray foam more surface to cling to. It's still a possibility. I had cold feet all winter. I'm guessing there is less work involved in spraying foam from under the bus than there would be involved in removing the entire interior flooring to insulate.
After being built, cabinets, etc. there's not much chance I'd bother. Now if the flooring sucked or had completely rotted out, fine.

Quote:
I'm sure I'd find rust on my steel subfloor if I removed the plywood, but that's because of the way these things are treated, being frequently washed out by hose for 20 years. No, I'm not going back to the foundational spray foam guy for a subfloor insulation job. He wasn't very careful about spraying IMO. I'll spray it myself so I don't have anyone to complain about but myself this time.
I've thought about doing the same with just the bed liner stuff but there are brake lines, fuel lines, nut & bolts to various crap... No way I want to cover that in 3" of foam. You think spraying the interior walls was a pain... just imagine what those boneheads could do to the underside of your bus. Better hope diesel dissolves it and the eninge doesn't care.
Brewerbob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2017, 03:54 PM   #9
Bus Geek
 
Robin97396's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Willamina, Oregon
Posts: 4,410
Year: 1997
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: TC 1000
Engine: 5.9
Send a message via Yahoo to Robin97396
Yeah, I don't trust the foam guy I used to do a decent job under the floor. At least I wouldn't have to trim the foam under the bus, but that's one area the tougher foam would shine.

Previously someone was talking about spray foaming the underside of the floor and then spraying bedliner onto the foam to keep it dry and safe. It would certainly be sad to have to cut the foam out to be able to fix things under the bus. At the same time the foam would protect anything down there.

It looks like a lot of work to spray underneath the floor. My alternate, lazy, plan would be to install a floating floor inside, loosing about 1 1/4" of headroom.

Plans keep changing. I also didn't have a real floorplan in my bus. I let things fall where they may basically. There is a pattern developing.
Robin97396 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2017, 04:01 PM   #10
Bus Nut
 
superdave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: hills of sw virginia
Posts: 837
Year: 1996
Chassis: thomas
Engine: 8.3 cummins
Rated Cap: 11 window
check out my build pics, I used soup bowls and irrigation pipe for the vehicle lights. for the other wires I ran them in the space between the ceiling and the foam board I put over the ribs. keep your wet areas back to back
__________________
living in a bus down by the river.
my build pics
https://www.skoolie.net/forums/membe...albums942.html
superdave is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:35 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.