Trailer Choice

[LP4171]

I will be looking to haul my car behind my bus. I have never hauled cars so I am unsure of how much is good and how much is overkill.
The car as of now is 17' long and weight of 4k. I am sure double axle is way to go but what about length and axle rating?
Wood planking or metal floor?
Tongue length?
Do I need brakes on both axles or is one good?
Thanks

[dond]

Originally Posted by LP4171

I will be looking to haul my car behind my bus. I have never hauled cars so I am unsure of how much is good and how much is overkill.
The car as of now is 17' long and weight of 4k. I am sure double axle is way to go but what about length and axle rating? Double axle yes! I use a 14ft, 7000 lb. for a car that's 11 ft long and 2800 lbs.
Wood planking or metal floor? Metal is heavier, your choice.
Tongue length?
Do I need brakes on both axles or is one good? One is OK, both better.
Thanks

[family wagon]

Brakes: brakes become required when trailer GVW is over 3000 (?) pounds. Some states require brakes on all axles; for others just one axle is good enough. You'd have to check what's required in the state where you plan to license the trailer. In my opinion, more brake is always better and brakes should only add about $100 to the new cost of an axle assembly.

Weight: axles in this segment usually are rated for 3500, 5200, 6000, or 7000 pounds. For a 4k payload plus trailer weight, if you wanted single-axle you'd be looking for something with a 6000 pound axle. I don't know why anybody would build a single-axle that heavy (and never seen one either).. tandem is so much nicer. It generally rides smoother, however a tandem-axle is nigh unto impossible to push around, particularly to turn, by hand. Maybe it's just that my tandem-axle trailers have all been so heavy that I can barely lift the tongue let alone push it anywhere..

Floor/deck: wood is fine, but you have to ("should") take care of it. I bought a new trailer with wood deck almost two years ago and have sprayed it with boiled linseed oil several times. It's in great shape; much better than other folks' untreated decks appear.

Far and away the most common trailer for your application is the 7000 pound car hauler like dond described. It runs tandem 3500 pound axles, weighs around 1800 pounds empty, so has a payload capacity a little over 5000 pounds. Tilt deck is really nice, and may be essential if your car is particularly low-slung. But it does add $$ to the price. Ramps to a fixed deck are fine for most cars.

You might also consider a dolly, depending on your toad. Works fine for most front-wheel drive cars. Not a good idea for all-wheel drive. Front- and rear-wheel, it's a mixed bag. Flat tow is an option for some as well.

[turf]

I have the cummins 5.9 and the at545 combo and tow a trailer with my atv. i think thats around 3000lbs. i tow it up and down the colorado mountains so thats an added strain, but i sure would think twice about going much heavier.
the bus tows that load but its tough day of driving.

i want to pull a car, but i feel thats going to have to be a flat towed, toad. just to avoid the extra trailer weight.

[nat_ster]

I prefer a wood deck over metal. Metal can be a real slip hazard, and even the load won't stay put the same as with a wood deck.

Also wood allows you to screw or nail into it if you have some sort of od load you need to secure.

The wood of choice would be fir. Fir has some of the longest grains of any wood in north America. It is the bamboo of this continent.
Spruce and pine will last a few years, where fir will last 10 to 15.

I recommend Not Flat Towing with a front engine bus. The rear over hang is so long it forces the front tires to drag sideways when taking a corner. This destroys the front suspension of the car in a short time.

To fix this issue, you would need a tow bar the length of the rear over hang of the bus. That is the length from the center of the rear axle to the back of the bumper.

Or build a simple wheel lift that lifts the front of the car off the ground like a tow truck uses. No need for hydraulics, all you need is the frame, a high lift jack, and a way to pin it there so it can't come down.

The wheel lift would be the best of all methods. Vary little extra weight, no added wear and tear on the car, traction on the rear bus tires, and great control when stopping.

I will be building a wheel lift on the back of my bus.

Nat

[Alan N]

Nat
I like the wheel lift idea.
I haven't built it yet but my idea is to combine the tow bar and a snowplow lift on the toad.
Then you can flat tow or lift up the front of the toad.
My toad is a Suzuki Samurai 1800 lbs soaking wet, my idea might not work well with a larger vehicle.
Build your wheel lift. I want to see it.

[somewhereinusa]

tow bar and a snowplow lift on the toad.

You live in MN and plow snow with an 1800 lb Samurai?

[family wagon]

Tow bars are usually hinged so they can move up and down freely. I think he meant the ram from the plow lift attaches to the tow bar, so that the toad can lift its front end off the ground by forcing the tongue of the tow bar downward, transferring the weight that would've been on the toad's front axle onto the tongue instead. Kind of a powered version of a weight-distributing hitch, I guess..

[somewhereinusa]

I was talking about the ability of a Samurai to push snow.

[LP4171]

Thanks for all the advice. Does the tongue length make any differences? Also do most car haulers have the axles so close to the rear of the trailer?

[opus]

Originally Posted by LP4171

Thanks for all the advice. Does the tongue length make any differences?

Yes it does. YOU'LL have to blow the dust off your geometry book though.

[Dragonpop]

Go to your local U-Haul dealer and check out his car hauler or
tow bar or better yet rent one of each and see which one you
like the best. I've used both and they are well designed and
worked great on 1200 plus mile trip both times.

[Alan N]

Originally Posted by family wagon

Tow bars are usually hinged so they can move up and down freely. I think he meant the ram from the plow lift attaches to the tow bar, so that the toad can lift its front end off the ground by forcing the tongue of the tow bar downward, transferring the weight that would've been on the toad's front axle onto the tongue instead. Kind of a powered version of a weight-distributing hitch, I guess..

Exactly!

[REDD]

[=nat_ster;124796]I prefer a wood deck over metal. Metal can be a real slip hazard, and even the load won't stay put the same as with a wood deck.

Also wood allows you to screw or nail into it if you have some sort of od load you need to secure.

The wood of choice would be fir. Fir has some of the longest grains of any wood in north America. It is the bamboo of this continent.
Spruce and pine will last a few years, where fir will last 10 to 15.

I recommend Not Flat Towing with a front engine bus. The rear over hang is so long it forces the front tires to drag sideways when taking a corner. This destroys the front suspension of the car in a short time.

To fix this issue, you would need a tow bar the length of the rear over hang of the bus. That is the length from the center of the rear axle to the back of the bumper.

Or build a simple wheel lift that lifts the front of the car off the ground like a tow truck uses. No need for hydraulics, all you need is the frame, a high lift jack, and a way to pin it there so it can't come down.

The wheel lift would be the best of all methods. Vary little extra weight, no added wear and tear on the car, traction on the rear bus tires, and great control when stopping.

I will be building a wheel lift on the back of my bus.

Nat[/QUOTE]
ATTACH]9068[/ATTACH][QUOTE

I've pulled A and B trains, flatbeds, vans, tankers but never anything with a 13 foot over hang / back swing. Can't seem to find anyone who HAS done this before...only opinions. I'd like to pull this 26 foot trailer [was a mobile home] with my 40 foot bus....I'm aloud 75 feet bumper to bumper here in Ontario so I have some wiggle room. The tongue is also a lot lower than the bumper, could put hitch further under bus, but little concerned about hitting corner of bus or a really long tongue underneath. The trailer pulls great, took this pic just before we went to Kentucky.

[nat_ster]

That trailer has a nice long tongue to match the rear over hang of the bus.

Nat

[msumoose]

As a wood scientist by trade, fir would be one of my LAST choices. It has no rot resistance. Treated southern yellow pine is the only way to go, if you want it to stay looking nice, put a sealer/linseed oil on it.

[nat_ster]

Originally Posted by msumoose

As a wood scientist by trade, fir would be one of my LAST choices. It has no rot resistance. Treated southern yellow pine is the only way to go, if you want it to stay looking nice, put a sealer/linseed oil on it.

I don't need rot resistance. That's what wood treatment chemicals are for.

Being your a wood scientist, you should know the length of the fibers in Fir make it north Americas bamboo.

We don't have southern yellow pine here. If you need to treat the short fiber pine, may as well treat the fir.

Also, I don't care what your education is. It's easy to sit in a arm chair trying to tell me what works best where.
However, I have had a work trailer most my adult life. We use it everyday.
From experience, I know what wood lasted on my work trailer, and what wood did not.
Pine is best left growing in the forest.

Nat

[msumoose]

Wow Nat, get up on the wrong side of the bed?

The fiber length that you are talking about is tenths of millimeters in difference. And it depends on the species that you are talking about.

It is hard to tell in the store which fir you are getting, so making a blanket statement that it is soo much stronger is hard.

Please refer to a span table from TP or SPIB if you want to get really technical.

I am glad that you don't care about my education - thanks for marginalizing it.

Good day grumpypants.

[2kool4skool]

Originally Posted by msumoose

As a wood scientist by trade, fir would be one of my LAST choices. It has no rot resistance. Treated southern yellow pine is the only way to go, if you want it to stay looking nice, put a sealer/linseed oil on it.

Welcome MSU, your expertise will be very helpful here. Most of us are civil.

[opus]

MSU:

We had a barn once in upstate NY. It was sided with yellow pine, excellent, durable wood. Here in the Rockies, the best thing we have I believe would be larch, then maybe fir. However, I do recall a lot of semi trailer decks made from cottonwood.

With all that said, I wouldnt know what to use. I'm an anti chemical type guy so of those choices, I'd have no clue.