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Old 01-20-2011, 09:33 AM   #21
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
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Re: Window skinning options?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lornaschinske
Single pane glass has a higher R-Value.
??

This might help ...http://www.glacierbay.com/Heatprop.asp

Note glass has a .20 value compared to FRP has a 2.08 R value.
  • MATERIAL CONDUCTIVITY ("k") INSULATIVE ("R")
    Copper 2712.00 .00037
    Aluminum (6061) 1160.00 .00086
    Aluminum (5052) 960.00 .00104
    Lead 245.00 .004
    Stainless Steel (316) 113.00 .00885
    Glass 5.00 .20
    Polyester FRP (hand laid) .48 2.08
    Polyethylene Foam .43 2.33
    Wood (dry) .33 3.03
    Polyester FRP (pultruded) .31 3.26
    Glass Wool .29 3.45
    Polystyrene (expanded) .28 3.57
    Cork Board 27 3.70
    Polystyrene (extruded) .21 4.80
    PVC (Klegecell) .21 4.80
    Polyurethane Foam .17 5.88
    Air .16 6.25
    BARRIER 20 (new) .037 27.02
    BARRIER 20 (20 years) .05 20.00
    AURA Panels .013 75.00
    Total Vacuum .004 250.00

Lorna: We spent Xmas in Las Cruces NM, love that area. Now in Florida. NM was great - wish we could have stayed.
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Old 01-20-2011, 09:08 PM   #22
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Re: Window skinning options?

The problem with UV stabilized FRP, such as Filon, is getting it. Where?
I bought a 20 foot roll of the stuff from RV Surplus. It ain't cheap, and truck shipping ain't cheap, but I got enough to do alot of bus projects. Built about 7 window blanks, bonded the FRP to plywood with epoxy (which ain't cheap either).
I'll put the blanks in when the weather warms, caulked with 3m marine caulk (which also ain't cheap).

Now broke, but someday plan to take pictures and post 'em.
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Old 01-20-2011, 11:50 PM   #23
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Re: Window skinning options?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaddyMac
... I’m just suggesting you use the correct materials applications – I don't suggest you use interior house materials for exterior truck applications.
This statement here will give us the giggles for days! Okay every one who put wood stoves in their buses... please remove them and put a wood stove that has been made for a mobile application in it's place.

I have tried to buy "specialty" stuff before (other applications) and discovered that it is priced out of our budget because we won't be using it by the tractor trailer load or if I can get it shipped in, then the shipping doubles the already high price.

Besides, one of my favourite pasttimes is making an item do something that it was not originally designed to do. The look on the "sales associates" at Lowes and Home Depot is priceless. When we lived in Seneca, SC, the folks at the local Lowes finally learned to leave us alone... unless they were new. I think the older workers would sic the newbies on us just to see their reaction.
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Old 01-21-2011, 11:37 AM   #24
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Re: Window skinning options?

I wouldn’t confuse innovative and forward thinking energy alternatives to window skinning techniques. It would be absurd to suggest you can’t adapt or modify one use for another – in many mobile applications. I don’t think my comments or effort provoked the same response as you would suggest.

Skoolies are creative DIY engineers who regularly use resourceful and ingenious substitutes for affordable applications in innovative ways. I doubt anyone here is thinking of skinning all their bus windows with wood stoves. I believe the thread topic was window skinning and my own suggestions were directed to that effort.

I wouldn’t be so sure outsiders searching these threads (practiced professionals or knowledgeable amateurs alike) would share or appreciate your giggles as much as you do yourself. I’m fairly confident there are plenty of giggles to go around with comments like “Single pane glass has a higher R-Value” in comparison to FRP.

If you are that presumptuous, I’m pretty sure Lowes won’t be the only colleague or consultant learning to leave you alone. I don’t think the intention of Skoolies is to prohibit an open discussion on innovative techniques - or for that fact - detract knowledgeable fans who wish to contribute and offer intelligent discussion to the community at large.

Lorna: I’ve read your own posts (as well as others) with enthusiasm and appreciation as I sought out helpful information and solutions to my own design. For that I am very grateful to you and the community. I carefully selected my introduction upon a forum area of my expertise, experience and education. I’m not some uninformed troll or know it all who disrespects others competence.

I specialize in advanced technology oriented, forward thinking, constructing industry techniques in the repair, strengthening, and upgrading of industrial and commercial facilities through the application of state-of-the-art construction materials and techniques. I’m a licensed contractor with an advanced degree in these techniques.

I hope my post is not deleted and remain a registered user in what I believe is a valuable and friendly community forum – regardless. Boorish attacks on ‘newbies’ will eventually lead knowledgeable fans to pass on contributing or refraining from joining all together.
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Old 01-21-2011, 12:25 PM   #25
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Re: Window skinning options?

That was a very eloquent rebuttal.
I sure appreciate your knowledge.
What is your degree in?
What university?
Do you have any patentable ideas?
It's ok to be an applications man.
Most of the more modern construction is occurring at the Pacific rim and India.
Have you thought about growing your business in those areas?
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Old 01-21-2011, 01:22 PM   #26
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Re: Window skinning options?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lornaschinske
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaddyMac
... I’m just suggesting you use the correct materials applications – I don't suggest you use interior house materials for exterior truck applications.
This statement here will give us the giggles for days!

When I say "US" I meant my husband, my daughter and myself. I certainly did not mean any one on this board and I still stand behind my statement of FRP havs minimal R-Value. Sorry if I POed you off. I will keep my mouth shut.
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Old 01-21-2011, 05:00 PM   #27
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Re: Window skinning options?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mightybus
That was a very eloquent rebuttal.
I sure appreciate your knowledge.
What is your degree in?
What university?
Do you have any patentable ideas?
It's ok to be an applications man.
Most of the more modern construction is occurring at the Pacific rim and India.
Have you thought about growing your business in those areas?
My bachelor's degree is from Bloomsburg University of Pennsylvania. My continuing education and graduate programs are all leading to master's degree in engineering. Believe it or not – as bad as I spell – I also have a Journalism/English degree with several years experience in broadcasting. I’m now a licensed contractor in the State of Florida. I'm a MSFH (My Safe Florida Home) certified contractor with certification in FLASH (Federal Alliance for Safe Homes) and FEMA Hurricane Preparedness Construction Techniques. Aside from my fulltime job as a contractor I hold down a part time job in engineering. No interest in patents at this time – but I do have a few to many ideas that keep me occupied. I really don’t wish to pursue work outside Florida at this time. I’m really just a guy looking to build a 'Skoolie' bus and learn what I can from those of you who offer.
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Old 01-21-2011, 08:00 PM   #28
Mini-Skoolie
 
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Re: Window skinning options?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bus-bro
The problem with UV stabilized FRP, such as Filon, is getting it. Where?
I bought a 20 foot roll of the stuff from RV Surplus. It ain't cheap, and truck shipping ain't cheap, but I got enough to do alot of bus projects. Built about 7 window blanks, bonded the FRP to plywood with epoxy (which ain't cheap either). I'll put the blanks in when the weather warms, caulked with 3m marine caulk (which also ain't cheap).
Now broke, but someday plan to take pictures and post 'em.
UV stabilized FRP, such as Filon, are a bit expensive. Maybe cost prohibitive purchase for many Skoolie conversion projects. You can check with RV surplus and any local manufacturers for material ‘drops’ – often pieces of cut out or trimmed excess they have left over from manufacture they can offer. I’ve often picked them up for free. You may not find them long enough for a complete 20 foot run, but you should have no problem finding them large enough to fill each window bay.

I’m designing a mixed application of FRP wall skin while building my own windows using polycarbonates and Lexan. With the Lexan application I can run the complete bus side with clean lines and minimum gaps (as in touching side by side). The look should achieve the desired effect as seen on new coaches with the complete side
‘glassed’ in dark tinted color.

Id love to see your pics when posted. My ideas attached.
I’m planning to skin the bus in FRPs, then add complete run of tempered or polycarbonate glass.

My ideal window design using Lexan window concept.
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2853...06589167ATyGdJ

Before and after of window design – just add tint.
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2752...06589167KRFEYC

Inspirational window design and concepts.
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2385...06589167JQMmLA
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2718...89167zTGlGGurl
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Old 01-21-2011, 08:46 PM   #29
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Re: Window skinning options?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaddyMac
... The look should achieve the desired effect as seen on new coaches with the complete side
‘glassed’ in dark tinted color...
To each his own. That is not a look that everyone likes. The nice thing about a skoolie conversion (or any bus conversion) is that we can customize each to his/her own tastes.

Now THIS is the way to go!!!! At least in my opinion!


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http://lorndavi.wordpress.com/blog/
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Old 01-21-2011, 09:41 PM   #30
Mini-Skoolie
 
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Re: Window skinning options?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lornaschinske
That is not a look that everyone likes.
Are you speaking for your family again ... or everyone else!
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