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Old 01-03-2007, 09:50 PM   #61
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Hmmm...that T50 looks very nice but as far as I can tell it would have to operate on propane, no? I didn't see anything there about fuel oil. As nice as that is I don't think I want a propane fueled main heater; it's just so much harder to carry a large quantitiy of propane than it is diesel.

Am I following this right?
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Old 01-03-2007, 10:37 PM   #62
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Unfortunately, yes...they only operate on gas. They are miserly atleast with their ultra high efficiency and ability to modulate their flame for a given demand. What I mean by that is that if only one zone is calling for heat and the water is still relatively warm, you might not see much more than "pilot light" inside that fire chamber (it swirls, actually). Then another zone calls for heat....the flame gets much bigger as the cold return water hits the system. Now the passive water heater kicks on in priority mode, shutting down the two heating zones. The water return water from the water heater is not nearly as cold as the return water from the previous zone so the flame goes down again. Kinda cool, eh?

I didn't mean that you needed to go with that specific brand. Looking back it did kind of l0ook like an advertisement. It is just one of many that I wanted to use as an example. In twenty years boilers have gone from big, ugly cast iron "things" to something the resembles a beverage cooler and weighs about the same.
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Old 01-08-2007, 08:10 PM   #63
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A bit more work done this weekend...

I got all the ceiling panels down as well as the rear inside cap:







Then I started working on the rubber floor covering:



This is as far as I got before I called it quits this evening:

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Old 01-08-2007, 09:03 PM   #64
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An axe? My rubber came up nice and easy.

What held your ceiling panels on? Mine are held on by #3 Phillips screws, but they might as well be welded on...they are darn near impossible to move.

Progress is progress! Keep it going...just don't go faster than Elliott...someone needs to discover the whoopsies and I've always found it's easier for me if someone else discovers it first.
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Old 01-08-2007, 09:46 PM   #65
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I have basically the same bus as pictured above, and my ceiling panels are held on with phillips screws too...be that as it may, the only way I can take down the ceiling would be to cut all those screws...they are in there tighter than anything I have...I've broken several screw driver bits trying to remove a single screw...I simply can't afford enough bits to even consider removing the ceiling in mine. I'll just do a work-a-round the best I can...
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Old 01-08-2007, 10:29 PM   #66
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I have a 3/8 impact driver that you twist and then smack with a hammer that works wonders on phillips screws, the hammer strike seats the bit into the screw at the same time it twists the screw. Mine is a Snap-on/Blue Point, but I'm sure that Sears or NAPA has a generic version.
Another helpful tip would be to either hit the screwhead straight in with a brass drift and then try to turn it out, or use a chisel to tap sideways at the panel/screwhead to break the screws loose. Usually once the screws start to turn they come out easy, where's the screwgun and about 2 good sets of biceps, cleanup provided by pushbroom and a magnet on a stick.
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Old 01-08-2007, 10:41 PM   #67
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I've tried all that. The impact driver is what broke most of my case hardened bits!! I've tried whacking them chisels, busting them off with an air chisel, soaking them with a sponge full of paint thinner (thinking the paint was working like locktite), and squirting them down with pb blaster... The only thing that is going to take off those screws is my trusty angle grinders (I have an electric one and a pnuematic one). I have given up on the ceiling....it's staying right where it is!!
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Old 01-09-2007, 12:51 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the_experience03
An axe? My rubber came up nice and easy.
No! It's just a scraper with a long handle (I think it's generally used for ice on sidewalks and such but we don't normally have that here; I don't know why Ace Hardware had it.) The rubber is coming up "reasonably" easy but there seems to be a few areas where it's stuck pretty good and needs persuasion.
Quote:
What held your ceiling panels on? Mine are held on by #3 Phillips screws, but they might as well be welded on...they are darn near impossible to move.
945 T-20 Torx screws (63 per row and 15 rows)! Most of them came out pretty well (I've got great Panasonic driver with lots of torque), the ones that didn't came out with an Irwin (folks that make Vise Grips) screw extractor (it looks like a nut driver with sharp flutes (teeth) inside). If what had held my ceiling panels up had been either rivets or Phillips screws they'd still be up there! Just the few Phillips screws I've had to deal with have been a pain in the rear.
Quote:
Progress is progress! Keep it going...just don't go faster than Elliott...someone needs to discover the whoopsies and I've always found it's easier for me if someone else discovers it first.
No kidding!
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Old 01-09-2007, 01:01 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneCamping
I have basically the same bus as pictured above, and my ceiling panels are held on with phillips screws too...be that as it may, the only way I can take down the ceiling would be to cut all those screws...they are in there tighter than anything I have...I've broken several screw driver bits trying to remove a single screw...I simply can't afford enough bits to even consider removing the ceiling in mine. I'll just do a work-a-round the best I can...
Absolutely...I'd have never tackled a ceiling full of Phillips screws! Mine didn't have to come down; I only decided to do it because of the Torx screws figuring I could get a bit more insulation up there and create a thermal break between the steel body and frames and the inside by using a wood ceiling. Nice as that might be I just wouldn't have done the Phillips thing.
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Old 01-09-2007, 01:04 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paul iossi
I have a 3/8 impact driver that you twist and then smack with a hammer that works wonders on phillips screws, the hammer strike seats the bit into the screw at the same time it twists the screw. Mine is a Snap-on/Blue Point, but I'm sure that Sears or NAPA has a generic version.
Another helpful tip would be to either hit the screwhead straight in with a brass drift and then try to turn it out, or use a chisel to tap sideways at the panel/screwhead to break the screws loose. Usually once the screws start to turn they come out easy, where's the screwgun and about 2 good sets of biceps, cleanup provided by pushbroom and a magnet on a stick.
ARE YOU NUTS!

There is no way...no way...that I could swing a hammer against an impact driver overhead for 945 screws. Not in this lifetime and not with these arms!

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