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Old 06-26-2014, 04:02 PM   #11
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Re: A Crown for Burning Man

You may not want a crown. They are getting expensive. The mid engine design has very little room underneath. You can find thomas and blue bird pushers or even front engines for a couple grand, and have a full 40 feet of space. If you are willing to drive it down they get cheaper in texas and washington.
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Old 06-26-2014, 05:00 PM   #12
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Rated Cap: 47,000lb/38,000lb GVWR
Re: A Crown for Burning Man

Just some things to consider with a Crown:

The pushers are the only Crown's with 'real' underfloor storage. Also, you won't actually get any more underfloor storage in a 35' 2-axle mid-engine vs a 40' 3-axle tandem mid-engine; that 3rd axle eats any extra underfloor storage that could have been there.

Mid-engine Crown's will have the following underfloor bays (not including trunk):

1 up front on passenger side (generally used to hold a spare tire, and only in rare cases is this bay enclosed.)
1 up front on driver side (this is for the engine radiator.)
2 center bays (access to either side of the engine.)
1 rear driver side (this contains running batteries and engine air filter.)
1 rear passenger side (often enclosed and usable, unless used for rare engine A/C.)

So, normally you only get 1 usable underfloor bay with a mid-engine Crown. Best case will be two if you get lucky.

This doesn't mean I'd stay away from a mid-engine Crown for a conversion; obviously it was my preferred choice for a few personal reasons. However, if my intention was to have the most usable space for a conversion without a ton of headache I would go with a different bus make altogether. Also, running all sorts of plumbing and electrical under the floor of a mid-engine Crown isn't going to be fun; there's a lot of moving parts to stay away from. It's best to avoid too many large hoses/cables running long distances.

Crown's look awesome (in my opinion the best looking bus on the road.) And the mid-engine and ride height make it drive like nothing else. BUT they are a BITCH to make into a 'proper' conversion when compared to all the other great buses out there. Unless you don't mind butchering it by putting all sorts of 'ugly' crap on the roof. ;)

As for the Air-Ride. Not a lot of the Crown's have it installed by default, it was more common in the later years. My bus had no signs of dry-rot but it was basically straight from the school district so most things were fairly well maintained. Personally I don't think the air-ride makes much of a difference when compared to springs in the rear. My front-end still has leaf springs so from my perspective it's just as 'bouncy' either way. ...haven't been in one with air-ride all around to compare.
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Old 06-26-2014, 05:21 PM   #13
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Rated Cap: 47,000lb/38,000lb GVWR
Re: A Crown for Burning Man

Quote:
Originally Posted by serpent
Just some things to consider with a Crown:

The pushers are the only Crown's with 'real' underfloor storage. Also, you won't actually get any more underfloor storage in a 35' 2-axle mid-engine vs a 40' 3-axle tandem mid-engine; that 3rd axle eats any extra underfloor storage that could have been there.

Mid-engine Crown's will have the following underfloor bays (not including trunk):

1 up front on passenger side (generally used to hold a spare tire, and only in rare cases is this bay enclosed.)
1 up front on driver side (this is for the engine radiator.)
2 center bays (access to either side of the engine.)
1 rear driver side (this contains running batteries and engine air filter.)
1 rear passenger side (often enclosed and usable, unless used for rare engine A/C.)

So, normally you only get 1 usable underfloor bay with a mid-engine Crown. Best case will be two if you get lucky.

This doesn't mean I'd stay away from a mid-engine Crown for a conversion; obviously it was my preferred choice for a few personal reasons. However, if my intention was to have the most usable space for a conversion without a ton of headache I would go with a different bus make altogether. Also, running all sorts of plumbing and electrical under the floor of a mid-engine Crown isn't going to be fun; there's a lot of moving parts to stay away from. It's best to avoid too many large hoses/cables running long distances.

Crown's look awesome (in my opinion the best looking bus on the road.) And the mid-engine and ride height make it drive like nothing else. BUT they are a BITCH to make into a 'proper' conversion when compared to all the other great buses out there. Unless you don't mind butchering it by putting all sorts of 'ugly' crap on the roof. ;)

As for the Air-Ride. Not a lot of the Crown's have it installed by default, it was more common in the later years. My bus had no signs of dry-rot but it was basically straight from the school district so most things were fairly well maintained. Personally I don't think the air-ride makes much of a difference when compared to springs in the rear. My front-end still has leaf springs so from my perspective it's just as 'bouncy' either way. ...haven't been in one with air-ride all around to compare.
I should clarify (I really don't want to scare you away from this endeavor):

You will get two usable underfloor bays with a mid-engine Crown as long as there is no factory engine A/C (or if there is, you remove it), and if you don't mind doing some 'work' on the front passenger side bay (you can move the spare tire to center front (many buses have a place to mount the tire there) and then enclose it. Or, if you want an on-board generator, it makes a nice place for that.

Take some time to browse through these forums. There's a few REAL nice Crown conversions out there.
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Old 06-26-2014, 05:24 PM   #14
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Rated Cap: 47,000lb/38,000lb GVWR
Re: A Crown for Burning Man

...just one more thing before I come back (hopefully after I do some more work on my bus today and take some pictures.)

THERE IS NO WAY YOU ARE GOING TO KEEP THE DUST OF THE PLAYA OUT OF YOUR BUS.
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Old 06-26-2014, 09:20 PM   #15
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Re: A Crown for Burning Man

I would only add that painting the exterior in primer and then leaving it until later for the final paint color may not be a good idea. I had a Mustang that was primer gray for [too long] and it rusted terribly. Primer is designed to adhere to the metal and give the color coat something to stick to, but it's also porous and water penetrates to the surface. It's not supposed to be a protective layer.

Probably better to do both priming and painting first or last, but at least around the same time.
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Old 06-26-2014, 10:23 PM   #16
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Engine: Cummins 855 BCT/6V92TA, RTO-910/HT-740
Rated Cap: 47,000lb/38,000lb GVWR
Re: A Crown for Burning Man

I'm taking a short break and would like to add something else... more of a question really.

What are your ideas on this?

One of a kind A/C system that will automatically separate the sand from fresh air.

Normal refrigerant using A/C units already generally do this. The evaporator coils are normally isolated from the condenser coils. In normal operation the condenser coil and fan would be the only part exposed to the dust. The evaporator coil and fan will use (probably not so fresh) air from inside the bus.



Interested in your idea as A/C units have always been an issue in the dust.
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Old 06-26-2014, 10:42 PM   #17
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
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Re: A Crown for Burning Man

Quote:
Originally Posted by serpent
Quote:
Originally Posted by serpent
Just some things to consider with a Crown:

The pushers are the only Crown's with 'real' underfloor storage. Also, you won't actually get any more underfloor storage in a 35' 2-axle mid-engine vs a 40' 3-axle tandem mid-engine; that 3rd axle eats any extra underfloor storage that could have been there.

Mid-engine Crown's will have the following underfloor bays (not including trunk):

1 up front on passenger side (generally used to hold a spare tire, and only in rare cases is this bay enclosed.)
1 up front on driver side (this is for the engine radiator.)
2 center bays (access to either side of the engine.)
1 rear driver side (this contains running batteries and engine air filter.)
1 rear passenger side (often enclosed and usable, unless used for rare engine A/C.)

So, normally you only get 1 usable underfloor bay with a mid-engine Crown. Best case will be two if you get lucky.

This doesn't mean I'd stay away from a mid-engine Crown for a conversion; obviously it was my preferred choice for a few personal reasons. However, if my intention was to have the most usable space for a conversion without a ton of headache I would go with a different bus make altogether. Also, running all sorts of plumbing and electrical under the floor of a mid-engine Crown isn't going to be fun; there's a lot of moving parts to stay away from. It's best to avoid too many large hoses/cables running long distances.

Crown's look awesome (in my opinion the best looking bus on the road.) And the mid-engine and ride height make it drive like nothing else. BUT they are a BITCH to make into a 'proper' conversion when compared to all the other great buses out there. Unless you don't mind butchering it by putting all sorts of 'ugly' crap on the roof. ;)

As for the Air-Ride. Not a lot of the Crown's have it installed by default, it was more common in the later years. My bus had no signs of dry-rot but it was basically straight from the school district so most things were fairly well maintained. Personally I don't think the air-ride makes much of a difference when compared to springs in the rear. My front-end still has leaf springs so from my perspective it's just as 'bouncy' either way. ...haven't been in one with air-ride all around to compare.
I should clarify (I really don't want to scare you away from this endeavor):

You will get two usable underfloor bays with a mid-engine Crown as long as there is no factory engine A/C (or if there is, you remove it), and if you don't mind doing some 'work' on the front passenger side bay (you can move the spare tire to center front (many buses have a place to mount the tire there) and then enclose it. Or, if you want an on-board generator, it makes a nice place for that.

Take some time to browse through these forums. There's a few REAL nice Crown conversions out there.
LOL. We really ant to use the crown. We were wanting to turn any available open space under the bus into new storage areas.
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Old 06-26-2014, 10:46 PM   #18
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Re: A Crown for Burning Man

Quote:
Originally Posted by PDBreske
I would only add that painting the exterior in primer and then leaving it until later for the final paint color may not be a good idea. I had a Mustang that was primer gray for [too long] and it rusted terribly. Primer is designed to adhere to the metal and give the color coat something to stick to, but it's also porous and water penetrates to the surface. It's not supposed to be a protective layer.

Probably better to do both priming and painting first or last, but at least around the same time.
This is a good point, but we are not planning on stripping it down to where it's a white body. The conversion will take place in a warehouse away from the elements. Did you mustang project go don to the bare metal or was thee any top coat left?
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Old 06-26-2014, 10:49 PM   #19
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
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Re: A Crown for Burning Man

Quote:
Originally Posted by serpent
I'm taking a short break and would like to add something else... more of a question really.

What are your ideas on this?

One of a kind A/C system that will automatically separate the sand from fresh air.

Normal refrigerant using A/C units already generally do this. The evaporator coils are normally isolated from the condenser coils. In normal operation the condenser coil and fan would be the only part exposed to the dust. The evaporator coil and fan will use (probably not so fresh) air from inside the bus.



Interested in your idea as A/C units have always been an issue in the dust.
This is fine if we only had to worry about a cooling portion of the project. It is more so getting a nice mix or fresh dry air. We don't want to recirc the interior air too much or the air will become muggy. The sand separation is not project, but my friend's. He wants to use the concept that those dyson vacuums use where there is a vortex.
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Old 06-26-2014, 10:55 PM   #20
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Black Rock City
Posts: 110
Year: 198x
Coachwork: Crown & MCI
Chassis: 40ft Tandem/40ft MC-9 Tag
Engine: Cummins 855 BCT/6V92TA, RTO-910/HT-740
Rated Cap: 47,000lb/38,000lb GVWR
Re: A Crown for Burning Man

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reymac
Quote:
Originally Posted by serpent
Quote:
Originally Posted by serpent
Just some things to consider with a Crown:

The pushers are the only Crown's with 'real' underfloor storage. Also, you won't actually get any more underfloor storage in a 35' 2-axle mid-engine vs a 40' 3-axle tandem mid-engine; that 3rd axle eats any extra underfloor storage that could have been there.

Mid-engine Crown's will have the following underfloor bays (not including trunk):

1 up front on passenger side (generally used to hold a spare tire, and only in rare cases is this bay enclosed.)
1 up front on driver side (this is for the engine radiator.)
2 center bays (access to either side of the engine.)
1 rear driver side (this contains running batteries and engine air filter.)
1 rear passenger side (often enclosed and usable, unless used for rare engine A/C.)

So, normally you only get 1 usable underfloor bay with a mid-engine Crown. Best case will be two if you get lucky.

This doesn't mean I'd stay away from a mid-engine Crown for a conversion; obviously it was my preferred choice for a few personal reasons. However, if my intention was to have the most usable space for a conversion without a ton of headache I would go with a different bus make altogether. Also, running all sorts of plumbing and electrical under the floor of a mid-engine Crown isn't going to be fun; there's a lot of moving parts to stay away from. It's best to avoid too many large hoses/cables running long distances.

Crown's look awesome (in my opinion the best looking bus on the road.) And the mid-engine and ride height make it drive like nothing else. BUT they are a BITCH to make into a 'proper' conversion when compared to all the other great buses out there. Unless you don't mind butchering it by putting all sorts of 'ugly' crap on the roof. ;)

As for the Air-Ride. Not a lot of the Crown's have it installed by default, it was more common in the later years. My bus had no signs of dry-rot but it was basically straight from the school district so most things were fairly well maintained. Personally I don't think the air-ride makes much of a difference when compared to springs in the rear. My front-end still has leaf springs so from my perspective it's just as 'bouncy' either way. ...haven't been in one with air-ride all around to compare.
I should clarify (I really don't want to scare you away from this endeavor):

You will get two usable underfloor bays with a mid-engine Crown as long as there is no factory engine A/C (or if there is, you remove it), and if you don't mind doing some 'work' on the front passenger side bay (you can move the spare tire to center front (many buses have a place to mount the tire there) and then enclose it. Or, if you want an on-board generator, it makes a nice place for that.

Take some time to browse through these forums. There's a few REAL nice Crown conversions out there.
LOL. We really ant to use the crown. We were wanting to turn any available open space under the bus into new storage areas.
Crown it is. But if you want any available open space under the bus a mid-engine isn't going to give you much to work with. Another though, there recently there was a Crown Atomic Articulated for sale. Now THAT would give you some space!
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