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Old 06-04-2014, 01:01 AM   #21
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Re: Big Bertha

One of the reasons that Crown Coach school buses last as long as they do is that Crown made them with very think marine plywood floors. Marine plywood can stand up to moisture like nothing else. If you are going to put down plywood flooring, I suggest marine plywood. The floors in our 1988 Crown are in perfect condition. It certainly costs more than standard plywood. But, it will give you complete peace of mind in the years to come about your floor.

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Old 06-04-2014, 09:07 AM   #22
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Re: Big Bertha

I have 3" on insulation down and then the 1/2 plywood. I also plan to keep the 72 childeren with sloppy, messy, wet feet off my bus. I hope that helps.
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:08 AM   #23
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Re: Big Bertha

Quote:
Originally Posted by big_bertha

I really don't understand why bluebird wanted to put plywood down. The steel was welded in sections from front to back, and the welds were filled in with sealant. I guess when you have to replace them every 10 years or whatever, they don't really care if the plywood gets soggy.

Of course I'm a huge hypocrite because I'm putting a plywood subfloor right back in...
There might be a state law or regulation that required them to do so. I know there are such things as to how the school busses are being built and that they vary from state to state because a local district a few years ago bought school busses from out of state that were cheaper. I'm thinking these cheaper busses didn't have the plywood sub floor in there and ohio requires there to be one. Anyways, OHP was doing the inspection on them and found the issue and the cheap busses weren't so cheap anymore. I don't know where to find all these rules, or if Washington is similar, but that is most likely why they did it.
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Old 06-04-2014, 05:46 PM   #24
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Re: Big Bertha

Quote:
Originally Posted by Booyah45828
that is most likely why they did it.
That makes sense. When I was trying to brainstorm before we had ours, all the dimension specs I found were specific to state.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wmkbailey
I have 3" on insulation down and then the 1/2 plywood. I also plan to keep the 72 childeren with sloppy, messy, wet feet off my bus. I hope that helps.
Awesome bus. Love all the insulation.
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Old 06-11-2014, 09:59 AM   #25
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Re: Big Bertha

We have a 92BB we're just starting on. We will start gutting her in a few days and I'm curious to see what lurks within... since ours is a retired prison transport bus, when we strip it down we will need to read all the graffiti scratched into the walls before discovering if we have spongy plywood, too... ;)
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Old 06-11-2014, 03:50 PM   #26
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Re: Big Bertha

Crowns used very thick marine plywood for the floor. They were bolted onto the bottom frame of the bus. No metal floor, no rust. That is why a 50 year old Crown floor looked so good. I am assuming they also used some sort of coating with the marine plywood. I am not kidding. I have seen 50 year old Crown floors that look better than other manufacturer's 15 year old floors.
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Old 06-11-2014, 10:09 PM   #27
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Re: Big Bertha

I had not thought about the rougher conditions outside of California or Arizona. However, Crowns were also used in Oregon and Washington. Someone with knowledge of those states would have to weight in about how the floors withstood the wetter climate. Also, there were a bunch of Crowns used by a contractor in Hawaii back in the 1970's and 1980's. Pretty wet over there, but certainly no salt on the roads from snow and ice.
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:32 AM   #28
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Re: Big Bertha

My 1990 Crown was in service in the Bremerton (Washington) School District for 20 years until I bought it from them in 2010. Floors seem to be in perfect condition. There is some rust in the stairwell and around the windshield and doorway but that's about it.
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Old 06-13-2014, 01:38 PM   #29
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Re: Big Bertha

Quote:
Originally Posted by Locutus
My 1990 Crown was in service in the Bremerton (Washington) School District for 20 years until I bought it from them in 2010. Floors seem to be in perfect condition. There is some rust in the stairwell and around the windshield and doorway but that's about it.
That's still a hospitable place for vehicles compared to the middle of the continent
I know people who have gone to the west coast to pick up vehicles to sell back in Ontario. I'm lucky to have a 1998 Subaru Legacy that "grew up" as a west coast (British Columbia) car. It's the best looking car of its vintage around town! The bolt heads holding things to the frame are the correct hexagonal shape, not brown, flaky ovals. All other Subaru's that I've seen of a similar year that have lived their life in Ontario have rotten wheel wells, fully brown undersides and holes in the trunk/tailgates, if they're even still on the road.
Just some anecdotal evidence. Nothing compares to the mid-west for vehicle rot...
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Old 07-06-2014, 11:27 PM   #30
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Re: Big Bertha

I'm quite a bit further along than this thread indicates, and with a December 2014 live-in deadline, I'm strapped for time.

So I'm going to fast track you guys. By now there are plenty of threads detailing how to gut your school bus, so I'm going to post only the crucially relevant and the somewhat interesting photos and give what I hope are concise descriptions of our process.


I used a 7" angle grinder to cut the seats out three inches from the floor. I used the same grinder to remove all the bolt heads, and a prybar to remove the feet. Then, with some help, went to work on the plywood subfloor with some prybars. A T-style wrecking bar proved the fastest, most useful tool for this job.


We ripped the heaters out at some point. Yes, coolant spilled everywhere. No, we didn't care. (that night i cared because my gloves got soaked in it, and my hands shriveled up like i've never seen and stayed that way until the morning... they tingled for a while... i'm sure they'll fall off someday because of that... so please, if you aren't in a hurry, watch for the glycol.)


We ripped out the black box along with the surveillance camera. I cut the lock off the box with the angle grinder and behold! VHS!


We spent pretty much an entire day with an angle grinder and wire wheels, grinding off rust.






The next day was torrential downpour, so we had most of the windows closed. We were using the halogen lamp to try and dry off the floor because the grinder was just rubbing mud around =D... The bus leans to one side so we close all the windows on the side where the rain falls in. I upgraded by now to a non-woven abrasive, an extremely coarse, tough one. It worked well, but please wear your N-95s. You can see the smoke in this picture. I'm sure my lungs will fall off someday despite the mask.


Starting to look better...


Before the bondo. Why did we Bondo? I'm not sure. I like smooth surfaces. What, you thought we knew what we were doing? Balderdash!


Bondo. It smells.


This is me putting Rustoleum, an oil-based paint, directly onto galvanized steel. Apparently you're not supposed to do this, which I found out after two coats had fully cured. Let me just say that this project has been a very humbling experience.


For what it's worth, we didn't have any major flaking due to the reaction. Some parts scratched off, because we dropped sheet metal on them, but I would expect that from any paint job. Just walking around though, wear and tear, putting tools down, etc... nothing horrible to report. So maybe the terrible flaking disaster is something that takes time.


Sometimes we just like to hang out and be family.


We decided to strip all sheet metal and dispose of fiberglass batting. If you have headliner panels that are screwed in, I envy you.


The toilet goes here. I don't know if it has a steering wheel. Maybe that is supposed to be a magazine.


A lot of people recommended a cold chisel and a hammer. This panel was removed that way.


The rest were removed much more hastily by the angle grinder.


The headliner panels got interesting. Rivet heads become glowing hot when they're ground off, and then they fall. Usually you're standing under them. I tried dodging a couple, and failed. So I went to Goodwill and bought a leather jacket and a wool sweater.






Then there was more dust.


Messy, yes. But a 4 or 5 hour job became a 1.5 hour job.


This is where my sanders were. I know I will be flamed for this, but I can't justify the extra weight and besides, I could put something there. I also live in an area where snowfall is about one week in February. All the metro buses here just throw chains on the tires and call it a day. Sorry, guys.


Stop arm delete


So cool!
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Old 07-06-2014, 11:53 PM   #31
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Re: Big Bertha


These had the same vinyl as the inside, and I peeled that off and pulled up these boards with the wrecking bar.


Haggard


Filling these gaps with great stuff


Before


After. I know, I know. Sloppy.


New paint job! Also painted the lower walls.




Cleaned up and painted the fuel filler cover.


Lunch time!


1" Foamular beneath 5/8" plywood. I regret not going thinner on the subfloor.




1/4" gaps between sheets filled with great stuff and cut/sanded flush.


Self-tapping screws.



Then we had to take a few weeks off to finish planning our wedding, and then we went to vegas for a week and wished we had gone to hawaii for a week.




When we returned, we punched out four windows. The forward-most one will be the shower stall, and the three aft of it will be kids bunks.


Horizontal framing, also with self-tapping screws. These are 2x4s.


Window trim will mount on top of this plane and cover the steel.


Trying to be accurate. Do I know what I'm doing? No.


Again, blundering.




This was at the end of today. Yay! Now we're on the same page.
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Old 07-06-2014, 11:57 PM   #32
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Re: Big Bertha

A+ on the job but more so for the ambition. I had ambition once.....
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Old 07-07-2014, 12:05 AM   #33
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Re: Big Bertha

Quote:
Originally Posted by opus
A+ on the job but more so for the ambition. I had ambition once.....
Thanks. You know what, I feel that way now. When we decided to do this we were full of ambition and had big dreams for the bus. We wanted every square inch planned to perfection. What is actually happening now is we're putting one foot in front of the other and hoping it works out. It's good experience.
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Old 07-07-2014, 09:23 AM   #34
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Re: Big Bertha

Lookin' Good Guys! --- and your basic concept is valid for just about everything in life. Think, do your homework, plan...then be flexible enough to make it work in spite of all the well laid plans.

Thanks for sharing and do keep the pix coming.
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Old 07-16-2014, 07:13 PM   #35
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Re: Big Bertha

This weekend we started framing the bedroom.

Construction is a lot harder than demolition. We swallowed the broken pieces of our egos after realizing we had no idea how to actually build things, and then trudged along with a drill and a couple of saws until our heads stopped hurting. Along the way we came up with a few tag lines, such as "whatever" and "almost" and "good enough", and a few too vulgar to print.
















Blue Bird wants $25/ea for these cam locks. No.



Replacing this with a locking handle. I'm sad that the locking version doesn't have the BB lettering.


It was hot!!




























Not attached yet, just mocking them up. More work this weekend!
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Old 07-16-2014, 08:31 PM   #36
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Re: Big Bertha

It's awesome having a wife or girlfriend to help out and share the fun of doing this. My wife's in there getting her hands dirty with me and i love it. We can sit back when its done and think hun we built this with our own hands! You guys are moving along nicely! great job and i can't wait to see more!

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Old 07-16-2014, 08:35 PM   #37
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Re: Big Bertha

A few months ago we found a decrepit Sub-Zero 245 at a local building materials thrift store for $200. I don't have "before" pics to show you, but it was kind of like this:


We ordered a couple parts for it and gave it a thorough cleaning and now it looks like this:


And it runs great. It's designed to be a built-in undercabinet fridge/freezer, so there is a channel in the door where you can slide in a fascia that matches the rest of your cabinetwork. A stainless steel insert is available, which we'll be using, just need to order it.
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Old 07-16-2014, 10:38 PM   #38
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Re: Big Bertha

Tried to add your facebook and it doesn't work... just jumps to my newsfeed... weird... Showed you posted on mine but then it disappeared from from my timeline along the same time... maybe something i did on my end lol...hmmm

C.
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Old 07-17-2014, 02:46 AM   #39
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Re: Big Bertha

I think my floors are a bit worse than yours. My purchase price sure was! Totally jealous of your luggage bays and engine. Still I wanted a bit shorter and at 30' I got it. I have never seen a rear engine bus in my size with the 8.3. For that matter I have never seen a rear engine school bus in my size either. They've all been the transit version.

Your wife is not only willing to help but it was her idea to build and live in the bus to start with? As a theoretical concept I find the idea almost plausible. Almost. Pictures of her working on it go a long way to giving this concept validity, but still I wonder if she is some kind of alien from another world, or at least some kind of weird parallel universe.

My wife's idea of help is to not complain about the buses presence. She has kept her promise. As long as I work on it she promised not to crab.
She isn't that bad but has made it crystal clear that this is my project.
Hope she remembers that when she sees all the polished aluminum I have in mind. (I'm going to 5 truck shows in 5 weeks in 4 different states so shiny metal probably won't be a huge shock, she already expects the extra marker lights, my pickup has 67.)

My progress is terribly slow. Especially compared to you. Had the bus since February and still not done taking crap out. Between my event and work schedules I don't expect to work on the bus again until the end of the month.

Of course I don't have the deadline of needing to live in it either. If I did I wouldn't have bought a 30' bus. My usage is more of a long weekend at a time-if that.

You two should be very proud of your bus. You are doing great so far!
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Old 07-17-2014, 08:12 AM   #40
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Re: Big Bertha

Looks like you're moving right along on the construction and the pictures look great! The new fridge looks like it is going to be really nice as well...and congrats on your wedding

Keep up the good work
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