Build Thread For Haulin' Oats (and goats)

[jazty]

Awesome work! It'll be nice to have the peace of mind that everything is in good shape (other than the o-rings at the moment) once you get it back together.

Originally Posted by onenationundergoat

Once all of that is removed, we had to detach a few hoses and a pipe to make room for the head to come out. For some reason the school district plumbed a garden spigot into the coolant system, maybe to turn the heat on/off in the cab?

School buses typically come from the factory with those valves. As you guessed, it's to turn off the flow of coolant to the heaters during the summer.

[onenationundergoat]

Originally Posted by Tango

By the livin' Gawd that made you,. You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din!

Looking good guys. Be sure to check and abide by all related torque specs when going back together. Do you have a factory book for your motor?

Yeah that's the first thing I got when I bought the bus! It has all the torque specs and bolt pattern order in it. Although idk how we're gonna gauge the torque on some of those bolts. They're too dang hard to get to!

[onenationundergoat]

Originally Posted by HolyBus

I might be wrong (usually am) but I thought a DT360 had 4 rings on each piston.
Help me out somebody.

There are four grooves but only three O rings. The sets for sale also only include three rings per cylinder.

[onenationundergoat]

Today we took the injector nozzles to a diesel mechanic friend of my dad's who owns his own shop to see if he could clean them. He said he no longer has the equipment for that and it's almost as expensive to have them cleaned and tested as it would be to buy new ones. Idk about that. But anyway he said they looked ok and are hard to damage inside the engine. We're gonna just clean them with ScotchBrite like he said. He also did recommend using dish soap (no water) to insert the cylinders and o-rings back in place to the o-rings wouldn't swell and get caught going in.

And then as he and my dad were chatting about the lack of power he went in the back and pulled out a NEW Garrett turbo, about twice as big as ours. And gave it to us. For free. He said it had just been layin' around for ten years because it came in a lot with other parts he bought and he didn't need it. The thing is worth over a grand. So maybe we won't have power issues anymore! I couldn't say WOW and THANK YOU enough!

[roach711]

Finally some good luck getting that new turbo!

[onenationundergoat]

I've tried looking up the specs to see exactly how much difference it's gonna make but I can't find much info about it.

[Tango]

Something to consider. A lot of diesel hot rodders add mongo turbos, sometimes several of them. But you have to be careful how much extra boost you pump in. The head studs will only handle so much pressure and I know it is common on Cummins that are pumped up to replace the cylinder head studs with larger, stronger ones during one of the these "pump you up" jobs. Otherwise, heads have been known to separate and go boom.

Garrett should be able to give you some direction on this.

[onenationundergoat]

This one has a waste valve for any extra pressure that would be bad for the head. Not looking to soup it up too much. No sense in making a 360 into a drag racer!

https://youtu.be/86E9d5PMCxA

[Tango]

The question is still...what pressure will be going in and what can the motor handle? The wastegate may or may not be compatible with your otherwise stock engine. Might be fine...or...

[Dragonpop]

It appears that the oil control ring on the piston you were holding
when you were displaying the rod bearing, had the end gaps lined
up rather that spaced apart as called for. Looks like a green
mechanic may well have assembled this engine. Also it looks as if
the bearing has a dull appearance on the contact surface from
the babbit reacting with the coolant. Before final assembly you
may want to apply pressurized oil to the oil galleries to see if
the clearance on the mains and cam bearings is still good.

[claydbal]

replace the bearings, they are embedded with grit from the coolant. use atf or hydraulic fluid to lube the orings, not detergent! and to use the larger turbo would require the ability to turn up the fuel to match. how will you calibrate the fuel requirement? and if you can calibrate correctly, as tango said, you will then have a much more powerful BOOM inside the cylinder which result in a shorter lived engine (maybe MUCH SHORTER) and will also result in more fuel consumption and exhaust gas temps. then there is that pesky spool-up time........

[USMCRockinRV]

Keep in under 2500 rpm and you should be fine.

[nat_ster]

Thanks for the great pics.

I would stay with your stock turbo until you get the engine running properly.

Then do a bunch of reading, and swap on the new turbo.

Nat

[onenationundergoat]

Thanks for the advice, y'all. It does make a lot of sense to wait on the turbo until we fix the problem. If I need to get the fuel turned up and calibrated I can get my dad's friend to do it.

I'd like to research the combination of the turbo and this engine, but I'm not sure what I'm looking for. I can find the turbo listed online but nowhere does it list what kind of pressure it puts out. Nor do I know what my original one puts out.

Claydbal, what makes you recommend atf or hydraulic fluid instead of dish soap? (I had wondered how the dish soap gets out of there later without making a mess of everything.) I have heard the dish soap thing from two mechanics so far, and the guy who gave me the turbo has owned his own heavy duty diesel shop for 20 years and worked as a mechanic for over 30.

Dragonpop, what were you saying about the oil control ring? I'm not versed in that part yet.

[Dragonpop]

The oil control ring is the bottom ring on the piston. It
is made up of two narrow rings with an expander under
or between the thin rings. The proper way to install the
oil ring is to install the expander so the ends butt together
and rings assemble with their end gaps spaced about
45 degrees on each side of the expander gap. Otherwise
the oil has a fairly straight path to get past the rings.

[claydbal]

detergent contains phosphates or other harsh chemicals that will attatk the rubber. they also contain abrasives. imagine the soap drying on the o-ring as you are pressing the cylinder into the block.......maybe the last guy used detergent??????

atf or hyd. fluid are the norm for any o-ring or seal installation. mechanics know this. ever seen anyone assemble auto transmissions with soap?

concerning the turbo, where will the source of vacuum be to control that waste gate?

[onenationundergoat]

Last night we cleaned everything up and took a closer look. 4 of the cylinder sleeves have minor cavitation pits that haven't gotten halfway through the cylinder wall yet. Two of those four we are going to replace because the cavitation is in the o-ring groove and is much deeper than the other two. One of the rod bearings has wear down through to copper coloring, and all the rest have babbit wear, so we're going to replace them.

From agkits we'll be spending $367 for the head gasket set, oil pan gasket, two cylinder sleeves with o-rings, and four o-ring sets. The bearings are $22 per rod. Eek. So I contacted DSG Parts in Nevada who has them for $4 per rod. I sent them an email for a quote on the rest, too, so we'll see how that turns out.

[onenationundergoat]

Originally Posted by claydbal

concerning the turbo, where will the source of vacuum be to control that waste gate?

I'm not sure. I'm not versed in anything turbo yet. I did try to track down some specs. Garrett says they've never heard of that PN even though it's their name on the label.

I called a company that is a Garrett turbo distributor to ask questions. That guy said this turbo puts out 40psi and that the head should be able to withstand up to 40psi. He said we can also adjust the wastegate. I haven't looked at it to see how, though.

When my dad heard the 40psi number he said, "You mean 4psi, right?" But the guy definitely said 40. I'm not sure if his info was right or not.

[USMCRockinRV]

40psi
If you drive in normal operating range and don't get up and stay over 2500rpm you'll be fine.
Make sure your turbo boots are in good condition and tight. Leaks there will rob power.

[onenationundergoat]

(I posted this in a thread by itself to let the general skoolie population know.)

I found a company online that had a parts list with no prices. I called for a quote and they said they were wholesale and generally only sold to distributors. But they said they would make an exception for me.

I'm not going to name the company here because they were so nice and helped me out and I don't want to take advantage of that and swamp them with personal orders. BUT if you can locate a wholesaler and contact them, they may work with you.

I ordered
3 cylinder sleeves with o-rings, 10 individual o rings, a head gasket set, 6 connecting rod bearings, 6 piston ring sets, 1 main bearing set, and an oil pan gasket for $353.

The same order at agkits.com would have cost $800 and they don't carry the piston ring sets for my engine, which would have been another $120.