Picacho Project

[gealto]

I've owned my 1969 Ford/Superior 66 passenger skoolie now for 12 years. It has a 360 MD gas engine, 5 speed stick, dual vacume brakes, and is all stock and in perfect working order with only 87,000 total miles. I purchased the bus from "Picacho Elementary School" for $1000, as it had been used as their backup bus for about fifteen years at the time, due to the stick shift. For my purposes, this seemed the ideal bus for conversion. Unfortunately, due to circumstances I did no work on this project for all this time, other than to maintain the machine mechanically, and work on the few minor problems that it had.

Recently, in a dispute with my neighbor, the city was dispatched to my home, and ordered me to remove the "bus" from my property. Instead, I've been rushing to complete a minimal conversion in order to quickly license the vehicle, so that I can keep it parked here next to my home, where it will serve as my hobby room, den, library, and computer center.

My philosophy in this project is to keep everything minimal and simple. It makes no sense to me whatsoever to try to make a skoolie look like a store bought motor home. The skoolie is opposite in nature, and this difference should be maintained. I plan to keep the floor plan open, and to not cover any windows, except for one where I will mount a window fan. Spending a fortune on your skoolie is foolish, since you will never recover the expenses when the machine is sold, as often they are, when the owner discovers the "limitations" of the machine. Notice how many try to sell their skoolies on the internet boards.

I started by painting the entire outside of the bus with Walmart brand "Exterior Semi-Gloss House and Trim" latex paint, tinted to match the desert soil where I live. This took several days using a 3 inch brush. It took two complete coats to cover. It looks very beautiful now, and the dirt, which will usually stick to the latex semi gloss paint, will not show.

Then, the entire inside of the shell was painted with white interior latex semi-gloss enamel, which was a drastic improvement on the mint green color that came as stock. I notice the interior is much cooler after painting the inside white, which doesn't make much sense, but is true.

I'm also mounting an under the counter small refrigerator, a 12 volt car battery with 120 volt inverter, a crock pot, and an electric heater. These are four of the seven required items to define the vehicle as a motor home in Arizona.

Next week, I'm driving for inspection, to change the title to motor home. I will keep all advised of the progress of this project. I'm trying to see how to post pictures on this board, which isn't obvious at this point, so will be a little learning experience too.

[gealto]

Today, I made some little round covers from 1/4 inch plywood, and screwed them to the holes where the front flashing lights were mounted. These were painted to match the bus, then caulked on edge, which was a very messy job. Earlier, I made some nifty metal covers, but found that they didn't looks good, due to irrregularities in the surface on the bus top front.

As an aside, I found it more difficult to paint the bus on the inside than the outside. It was nearly three days to complete, and I still have some detailing to do on the dash and inner door areas. I think white is the best choice for inside, since it is the brightest, and is neutral.

I have a homemade generator that is very interesting. I use an industrial 5 HP Tecumpseh engine turning a 200 amp, 28 volt surplus aircraft generator to produce about 100 amps at 12 volts with engine speed around 2000 rpms. Aircraft generators, used at reduced voltages and currents, are just about the most mechanically efficient 12 volt converters around. Also an excellent 28 volt welding generator, too. A tremendous advantage is that the generator can also be used as an extremely powerful starter motor. I've wired an automotive starting solenoid to do this. You wouldn't believe how quickly the engine starts with this huge starter motor attached.

I plan on using this genset in an unusual way. Most people seem to think that you need a huge battery bank with a genset. This is NOT true. The genset is always there and able to run, so the usefulness of the batteries is when the load is less than the full power rating of the genset. This genset of mine produces 1400 watts power. When my refrigerator is running, it uses about 350 watts, about 1/4th the amount produced. Therefore, the genset can be operated 1/4 th of the time at full power into a battery in order to power the refrigerator through an inverter. The genset can be on for 5 minutes, off for 15, to produce that needed power. In this example, the battery will only need to store energy for 15 minutes. A single car battery, discharged to 90% of capaciity,would nearly work for this. Using a large battery bank adds greatly to the cost of your delivered power.

Operating this way requires a much better starter motor than the normal ones available for small engines, since it is used very often. A controller is also needed in order to automatically start the engine when required. I use one that I built using a PIC microcontroller a few years ago, which works pretty well.

I will mount the genset on a 2 foot long deck, which I will mount on the rear of the machine. I believe strongly that this is the best place for a genset on a skoolie. I will do this later, since I'm not planning on any camping for about the next year. Another neat addition, would be to run the engine exhaust through an elbow and strait down into a pail of water. This greatly quiets the engine, and allows the waste heat to be used to boil water. Using filtered grey water in the pail, and an air cooled condenser, would allow reuse of the grey water and use of the engine exhaust water. I would not recommend drinking this, but it would be very useful in my swamp cooler for cooling the skoolie.

The really neat thing about skoolies is that they make you think. They let you create an environment the way you would like, rather the the way someone else decided for you. They're terrible on the interstate. I drive mine at 45, and it runs very smoothly and comfortably at that speed. If your ego won't let you do that, your in trouble with the skoolie. At 45 mine will run all day without sweating. At 55, where the governer kicks in, it's much less comfortable to drive. When your used to it, interstate driving at 45 is very comfortable, and safer as well. Since everybody is passing you, you can just drive along in the right lane all the time, and never have to worry about passing anyone. It's rough in the big city, so stay away from them.

More later...

[Clueie]

You've got some pretty good info there bud. I've already got the engine now I need to find a surplus aircraft alternator, will the searching for stuff ever end?! Oh well when you're short on bucks and long on ideas that's the price we pay. I like you're outlook on schoolies. I've been laying out plans for one for a long time, but I always find myself trying to figure out how to make the thing look less like a bus and more like those mega dollar land yachts going around here in the summer. There's a fine line here, I think, to achieve the perfect balance between the two. I'd love to own a proper class A but my wallet and, more importantly, my common sense won't let me, after all I'm only going camping, perhaps if I was full timing it would be different. You're "KEEP IT SIMPLE" attitude is something I know I could use a healthy dose of. Thanks

[gealto]

I haven't been able to do much work on Picacho the last few days. I still need to do some detailing on the interior painting. I can't seem to get the left front turn signal to work. The parking light works, and the lamp appears to have both filaments intact. The bulb is stuck in the socket. How to unfreeze a stuck bulb? I'm thinking about a squirt of WD-40? Maybe the bulb really is burned out on one element. I find the wiring appears intact and proper. All other lights work properly.

Tomorrow, I will bolt my refrigerator down. I'm using a cheapo under the counter type "Sanyo" that I paid about $110 for at Walmart a few years ago. It draws 350 W when the compressor is running, and only about 20 W when not running. There are two adjustable feet under the front that are 10-32 threads, so I will bolt this to the bus's steel floor with 10-32 machine screws. I'm spacing it out 4 inches from any other material, so that I can add about 4 inches of additional foam insulation to the stock 1 inch. This should greatly reduce the power use of this small refrigerator, which is marginal for my family of 5. Meat isn't healthy, anyway.

I'm bolting down a battery strap, machine screwing my 120 v inverter to the bus wall on the left rear of the bus. The frige is at the right rear of the bus. (both facing forward) I have a small electric space heater, that can be screwed down with one big screw in the middle, and a crock pot, which I'm not sure how to fasten down. I don't see anything to screw to. Strappigng it down may not be good enough. With these four items, I have four out of seven needed for registration in Arizona as a Motorhome.

later...

[lornaschinske]

Put a piece of rubber under the fridge (to let the feet sit on) to keep the vibration down a bit. We had a Sanyo in our pop-up that would make the floor vibrate a bit. Used it for about 10 yrs before this last "remodel" and the fridge is still going strong (but sitting in the shed). Don't really need a very big refrigerator... what we need is a good-sized freezer. For our skoolie, I will re-use the old Sanyo (new paint) and pick up a small upright freezer. We use alot of frozen food from Schwan's and we eat alot of meat!

They make a thing called "thumb lock" to hold down TV's, etc. I picked mine up at Wal-Mart in the camping section. Different strengths to hold down differnet stuff. I use the TV weight ones to hold down my VCR in the pop-up and the CB radio on top of the dash in the Jeep. A set of these should hold your crockpot in place (uses sticky tape to hold base plates on or you can use screws... sticky tape has been holding the VCR pretty well since last summer). The nice thing about them is that you can unlatch the appliance from the decking that you are holding it onto. A crockpot casing shouldn't get too hot and breakdown the adhesion but you might want to watch it. Don't just screw into the sides of a crockpot casing! If you use the kind with the removable crock liner then there shouldn't be too much weight in it while traveling since you can store the liner someplace where it won't get broken.

[gealto]

Thanks for the feedback and information. I busted my crockpot trying to take it apart last night. Unscrewed a nut on the bottom, and the inside casing sprang apart from a handle that holds it down. It still works electrically, and now I can see where to put screws. Maybe I'll still use it. The inside is now free be partially lifted out. It is possible to put screws about a half inch long into the bottom of the unit.

I just posted more pics of this project in the gallery section, including some that show a neat little window fan unit I just bought on sale at Target for $3.70. It fits my windows perfectly, like it was made just to pop in. It doesn't move much air, and is noisey, but the price is right and the fit is perfect. Also shows my refrigerator installation.

I removed the feet from under the fridge, and bolted it down using bolts with the same threads as the feet leveling screws (10-32). It sits on the thick rubber mat that came with the bus on hardwood blocks. The rear of the frige is fastened with clamps that sheet metal screw into the bus floor. It was much harder to install the frige than I thought it would be.

Tonight we attach the inverter and battery box.

The saga continues...

[soused moose]

I applaud your Frugal nature Gealto….
But, I definitely think that…if a person decides to spend whatever they want to make their Schoolie Look & Act ‘Top of the Line’ there is nothing foolish or wrong with that.

One of the MAIN reasons Schoolies get a bad rap around this country …are the folks who throw together a few items, just so the can fulfill the legal requirements for RV status.
People get to see these rigs all over the country, and cant help but think the person who did that doesn’t much care for the sensibilities of anyone else.

I’ve been to many Rainbow Gatherings where lots of the Folks are always wondering why do cops pull their buses over all the time & why wont campgrounds ever let them stay….
The answer to that is simple.
It’s because the people who own those buses don’t care enough to make their homes at all nice. A Cop knows that when he sees it …so does the campground owner.

So, it’s fine if you want construct your ‘Home’ with the bare minimum…
But it’s equally fine if a person decides to make their bus look Great.

Michael
http://www.mobilehomestead.com

[gealto]

Thankyou, yes I am very frugal with my hobbies. It's much better to spend big bucks putting your kids through college than down some old school bus rathole. Personally, I don't think that skoolies that look like store bought motorhomes look good at all. Neither do people with money looking to buy used motorhomes, that's why so little is paid for skoolies on the resale.

I could care less why skoolies get any kind of bad rap from anybody. That's somebody elses's problem. I'm just planning on using mine the best way I know how. "Top of the line" means different things to different folks. I think your over generalizing, and spreading rumors rather than stating facts. The fact is if you spend $15,000 making a perfect skoolie, you'll still get only about $2000 for it when you sell it. The best plan is to make yours the way you want, and plan on keeping it forever. I think my skoolie looks beautiful, and the ones with the slick paint jobs look kinda silly, kinda sissy.

I just finished my minimal motor home conversion today, and postsed a couple of pics in the "Picacho" album, which is now located at the end of the skoolies section of the gallery. Thanks to whoever moved the album to it's proper place. So Picacho is now ready to license. Tomorrow, I will get the insuracnce, and have the machine inspected next Monday. Total cost of the conversion was $150, and it took nearly a month. Could have been much faster if it wasn't so hot outside all the time. I just had a beer that was in the frige inside the skoolie, and it was very good to toast my new motorhome.

[Steve]

What kind of inverter is that? Don't be afraid to post large pictures, the gallery will automatically resize them for you and will allow those who want a larger view a chance to look in detail.

[Clueie]

I've got to go along with soused mouse on this one. I wouldn't necessarily spend a fortune on the outside of a schoolie, since what gealto says is right, a converted bus is not worth much more than the bus was before the conversion. But there's nothing wrong with trying to emulate a "real" motorhome in some respects either. That TC2000 Bluebird in the gallery is, if you ask me, the perfect schoolie, and the red international with the stacks and the harley hilton are close seconds. I've seen plenty of conversions over the past few years and most look pretty desperate simply because of shoddy construction both inside and out. And this causes the "neighbours" to roll their eyes and generally not take a liking to seeing these things on their streets or in the campgrounds. I think there's a happy medium to be found here. I think that once you past the 6 to 8 thousand dollar mark, then you probably should've bought a motorhome to start with, unless you like large and possibly diesel trucks, like me. I plan to keep things simple since I just want a cheap camper for the family thats cheap to operate (can't wait to try the WVO, already got some suppliers) and has lots of room. If I wasn't so frugal, I'd have probably gone to the bank and gotten a good used 28' or 30' class C with a diesel.

STILL shoppin'

[Steve]

You can't tell the purple Bluebird in the gallery didn't significantly increase the value of the truck after the conversion. In fact I think it is better than the original Blue Bird Wanderlodges...

[Clueie]

I don't mean to generalize. I agree, that bus is near perfect and no doubt worth more, and rightly so. I am mostly refering to the shabby buses out there that don't look the part, like the moose said, their owners haven't taken any pride in their rigs. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that a simple, low buck schoolie doesn't have it's place among the heirarchy of RV's. That's in part why your gallery is so great.

[soused moose]

Why do you think there are so few Insurance companies that will touch a Schoolie Conversion?
Even the Insurance companies that will write a policy for a MCI , Prevost etc. wont insure a School Bus Conversion.

They’ll tell you…it’s an issue about safe installations, Blue Book Values and all sorts of dribble about how an MCI is designed for highway travel & a Schoolie isn’t.
But it’s really not about that stuff at all.

Over the years …Insurance Companies, The General Public, Police etc. have seen that the majority of Schoolie owners don’t much care about creating a quality ‘Rolling Home’.
They toss in a few simple items and head for the DMV to get licensed as an RV.
That’s not a generalization…that’s Reality.
I’ve seen it here in Alaska & all over the West & East Coasts.
It’s very rare in the world of Schoolies to see as much care as Vern , Steve & few other folks here took in their Conversions.

Then, where are you going to take those poorly converted rigs?
It would have to be the most Cheesy & Low-rent RV or Mobile Home Park in the world that would let someone stay who didn’t have a Holding Tank and a way to plumb into the parks sewer system.
They’re not going to put up with someone pouring their ‘you know what’ down the sewer hole or in the Bathrooms at all.

So you’ve just built yourself a rig that essentially prohibits you from staying anywhere other than in the a few out of the way BLM and National Forest areas and Truck stops & Sports Events (their not going to like you dumping your porta-pottie down their toilets either)


This sort of thing Bugs me for a number of reasons …
Being a Craftsman and very long-term Nomad , I don’t see the point of doing anything unless I can do the job right and as well as I can.

Then even more important are issues about the future of School Bus Conversions.
Right now the’ average’ person who buys a Schoolie to convert is mostly stuck with GMAC for an insurance policy.
If GMAC sees a continuation of poorly converted rigs and gets the info from Campgrounds and whoever that Schoolies are not valid ‘RV’s …then they’ll stop insuring them.


So as far as I’m concerned, anyone who cobbles together a Schoolie is DIRECTLY contributing to a future where no Insurance companies will insure Schoolies for personal use. …And is doing nothing other than validating the general publics bad attitude that Schoolie owners are just Hippy trash or Bums who cant afford a real RV.

[Clueie]

Yeah, what he said. No, seriously though. I don't see any point even buying a bus if you're not going to do a nice job on it. That's the problem though, people get a good deal on a bus (read: cheap) and do squat to it, and figure they're good to go. It makes it bad for guys like myself that are looking to get an RV by way of a schoolie, and plan to make it look as close to a factory conversion as I can, without spending a fortune, and I'm not a stranger around tools either. I figure that at the very least a decent paint job and remove and cover a few windows to take the blatant school bus look off. Nothing worse than seeing windows left in place with plywood visible inside or cheezy curtains hanging everywhere! A job worth doing is a job worth doing well. Hey a good lookin' bus is pretty cool lookin' out on the road, whether it's an MCI or a Bluebird. The whole insurance thing is another fiasco altogether. I think that soused moose just hit the nail on the head, I agree 110%. Way to go.

[gealto]

Steve,

The inverter is an old "trippe lite" 550 Watt, which is about 20 years old. I'm not planning on really using it, will get another newer one before long.

Picacho is now insured by GMAC at a cost of $131/6 months. Next week I will get inspected, and have my emission test. Does anyone have experience in monkeying with their 2bbl motorcraft carbs to pass emissions testing? This is a '69 Ford 360 MD.

Incidentally, GMAC insures schoolies because they have a huge database on them that allows them to profitably underwrite policies. As long as it's profitable, they will continue to do so.

My schoolie will be mostly parked next to my home, where it can serve as a living space extension. I don't want bolt down furniture, I want maximum free space so things can be moved around, like in any home. It will occasionally be taken boondock camping when the weather cools. Ever hear the expression "you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear."? No matter what you do to a school bus, it will always look like a school bus.

Skoolies have many great virtues, and covering them is nonsensical. Take the wonderful windows all the way around. Wealthy people pay a fortune to have solid window glass all around their crystal mansions, but we have it on our schoolies for free. Very nice to see wonderful views all the way around without restriction. Creates a feelling of wide open spaces as well. Curtains or shutters can be used to block the sun selectively, I prefer shutters. I will keep my windows intact, thank you very much. Think of how much one would have to pay to have an ordinary motorhome glass all around. Be proud of the windows.

The high ground clearance is another, making for an excellent backroad and offroad vehicle. The solid steel construction is another, making a much safer structure. The heavy duty suspension is another blessing, making for comfortable living without jacking the thing up every time you stop. The slow speed driving nature is yet another virtue. Take back roads, enjoy the view, don't be in a hurry.

I'm planning on retiring in my skoolie in about 15 years, so will become a full timer then, to some degree. Keeping the design simple will allow me to decide what do as time goes on. I think that open space, fold up and take down/put away type furniture is much better than all the bolt downs, which I think look really cheasy.

I'm thinking about building a couple of big boxes, 3 feet wide, 16 inches tall, and 14 feet long, and placing these on either side at the front of the bus. I can store almost everything in them, which will make things low and accessible. On top, I'll use inflatable twin mattress pads, so can comfortably sleep 4.

Another really cool thing is to build a flat deck on top, with fold down side rails, and a canopy atop that. Doubling my floor area and having a nice bug free view would be worth the trouble. I plan on mostly parking, and not moving much.

[gealto]

Yesterday, I installed a spare twin bed in the bus, and a leatherette upholstered love seat, both temporaries to make the skoolie look more motorhomie. I managed to fix the busted left turn signal by squirting in some WD-40 and twisting the bulb slightly side to side. Must've been a bad contact and a frozen bayonette.

My big surprise was tonight, the four hour grueling tire inflation routine. I first spent several hours trying to figure out what inflation pressure to use. I thought the tires were almost fully inflated, the bus has been parked for 6 years without air added. I found the rear tires were all sitting at 5-20 psi, the front tires about 15 psi. I need to get a better valve adapter on my air compressor, which is a direct drive 1.5 HP model. Very hard to fill by inner dual. I managed to finally get all tires up to 70 psi, taking a total of four hours time. Those tires are big, and my compressor small. Had to let the compressor cool for a while in the middle of the job, otherwise it might burn out.

I decided to go with 70 psi based on a tire loading chart I find online. My front tires and outer dual are 9.00-20, and the inner duals are 12.00-20. 70 PSi should give max gross wt. around 16,000 lbs. I',m at about 14,000 now after conversion, will confirm this on the scales in a few days.

I had no luck trying to adjust my carburetor. Couldn't even find what looked like jets to adjust, only the throttle stop. I measured my fuel tank and confirmed it is a 30 gallon. I can see the top of the fuel looking into the tank so know I have about 24 gallons, which should be enough to get me inspected and emissions tested this week.

more later...

[Sundial Camper]

This thread has actually made me reconsider purchasing a skoolie. i never really thought of what I would do with it after it got old or we wanted to upgrade. We re still looking though.

[gealto]

Last Tuesday night, I accepted a check for $2000 for the sale of Picacho. It was with a deep sadness that I accepted it. It was a really great bus. I drove it about 40 miles today on the interstate, and it handled really well. I had just finished the conversion, and it was fun.

[justcorey1960]

lot of talk about how a good convertion looks bad and simple is the way to go even some talk about how ya can not get your $ back out of it after converting but at a starting price of 1000 and 15 years later selling for 2000 seems like a hell of a profit to me anyone doing a skoolie convertion should take pride in there rig no matter how much they have to spend on it make it look good and u will not have to worry about getting your $ out of it

[gealto]

The reason I got a good price was that I found a buyer who could recognize the inherent value in the bus. Picacho is an antique that is in excellent mechanical condition and with very low mileage. If I had done a full conversion, I probably could not have sold for as much. It was worth more than $1000 when I bought it 12 years ago. The value has appreciated, because it wasn't used or abused.

Incidentally, the buyer was a person who had driven by and seen the for sale sign on the window of the bus, not seen one of my numerous internet ads, or newspaper ads.

I still recommend keeping conversions simple until you are sure that the skoolie is a keeper for you. They are noisey, vibrate your teeth out, uncomfortable to drive, and very tiring to manuever. These are usually the reasons people don't tend to keep them.