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08-31-2018, 07:56 AM
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#201
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 3,738
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, MT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
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Page 1 replies, comments, and smartass quips
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
I have considered putting some cribbing on top of the engine cover, put a bottle Jack on top of the cribbing and then cut a length of 4x4 to go from the jack to the ceiling.
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I assume those ribs are toast too.
Since I'm starting 7 months behind I guess I'll see what you ended up doing about it all but I would pop the rivets on that last section along the roof, cut the ribs below where they bent and throw all that out. Replace with new ribs and new sheet metal. You aren't going to get the wrinkles out of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twigg
You never realize all the benefits a Hi-Lift jack can bring, until you own one
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Sounds like the threaded posts used in basements as permanent supports which would also likely work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Reminds me of a sign I saw in a TV repair shop (yes, I am old) some years ago:
Labor rate:
$25/hour
$40/hour if you watch
$60/hour if you help
$100/hour if you worked on it first...
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I see that fairly often in auto shops.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid
11foot8 is waaayyyyy east from you..
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There's more than one short bridge in the US. What makes whatever the famous one special?
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
I was thinking about running threaded rod from underneath the box up through the bus floor to transfer part of the load to the bus floor. Probably in 6 locations. 2 at each end of the batteries and 2 in the middle.
Anyone see any problem with this plan? Any suggestions?
Thanks.
S.
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I would get a 1/4" thick plate (4'x8') and use it as plywood or a giant washer. Put it inside the bus, Drill holes for the threaded rod and then suppose as you already are. Cover the whole thing with spray foam and flooring like the rest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Mine are only about 18" deep. They are supported on one side by the frame rail and the skirt on the other.
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You sure about that? Attached to the skirt yes. Supported no. It's been awhile since I was under teh bus and I cut an eyeball out since then but I think I remember seeing supports coming down from the floor like the threaded rod method. I might have pics somewhere.
Yeah, here we go. I was tacking a pic of the supports but it'll do. The box has tube framing under it. The framing is supported by rods somewhere (not pictured).
Quote:
Originally Posted by sojourner
Take a look at my build how I mounted the fuel tanks and grey water tank (pg. 16 has some pics). You might be able to do something like that using some heavy duty drawer slides. Or.... you can see how I mounted my batteries between the frame rails (pg. 45,55) to keep the center of gravity low and in the middle. Having them between the frame rails does require access from inside the bus to service. While some may be uncomfortable with this approach, having been in the marine repair industry for most of my career, I've had to access batteries from floor hatches many a time.
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I haven't looked at your thread and pics but I'm not sure I like this idea or not. How often does one need to get in there for the batteries? I like the idea of the center and I like the idea of not crawling under the bus. But there's a chair in the way, a bathroom in the way, something in the way. I'd also worry about the floor matching and closing flat, not rattling, etc. You have the craftsmanship to make it look right. I have the craftsmanship to make it look "unique".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tango
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The clouds parted and the sun shown down!!! [Cue church music] I didn't know those existed. I'm parked on dirt so not running out to get one now but I shall remember this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
I have been a member here 7 months longer than you. I have removed the seats from my bus all ready. What have you done besides convert your first bus, travel all over the country and start on your second bus......
I had better step away from the keyboard and pick up my air chisel,.......
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And you've been here about 5 months longer than me. I've had my bus 17 months and I've almost managed to cut my roof off and my eyeball out.
I need to get back to work on mine too. The eye is healing nicely but Sept is going to be a busy month. Weekend travel this coming weekend and the 21st. Gf is having a girls' weekend which means I'll probably be out camping with a co-worker. That's 3 of the 5 weekends in Sept. I gotta get that roof up and new siding on before it gets cold. That was the excuse I used over the winter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
I'll let Angie pick the color
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Who the hell is Angie??? Who the hell am I thinking of. Lived solo in a fishing cabin bus with cats.
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08-31-2018, 08:52 AM
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#202
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Eastern WA
Posts: 6,401
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American RE (A3RE)
Engine: Cummins ISC (8.3)
Rated Cap: 72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brewerbob
You were out in the sticks right? When did you move? Am I losing (what little) mind I have left? Didn't you live in a bus that was the fishing bus?
I'll mutli-post the rest of my comments as I read thru your thread.
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Hey Bob,
Yes, I was out in the sticks. In the woods with a creek in my back yard.
I moved a little over a year ago.
Yes, you are loosing your mind Welcome to the club.
No, the fishing bus is not mine.
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08-31-2018, 09:28 AM
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#203
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 3,738
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, MT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
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Page 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by brokedown
I have veto power on our bus. If Hillary picks something awful I can say no, but she is fully responsible for color choices otherwise. Pretty much as long as she doesn't try to paint it hot pink.
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That's as it should be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gdog 5651
We have equal division of responsibilities around here too she picks it I pay for it I install it
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My math isn't the best in the world. I couldn't pass Calc II. But I think the above is slightly less than equal even without weighted averages.
1 she picks it
2 you pay for it
3 you install it
I count 3 parts. And if we are going weighted, #3 should be the biggest with #2 following..
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
I pulled the final bits of interior metal from the front cap. The main piece with the little cabinets built in was quite a bit heavier than I expected. It took a bit of cutting with the angle grinder to free the ends up and then a couple of whacks with a big hammer and it started to come down on its own.
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Mine was light but didn't have any shelves in it either. An access panel but that's it.
Quote:
I looked at mine and thought that instead I would simply remove the rivets and lift the entire front cap. Then I noticed the adhesive that was squeezed out of that particular joint and wondered if that may be why he cut above that rivet line.
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That's what I did. It was sprayed with tar but no actual adhesive in the overlapping metal. They separated on their own with heating and contracting. I guess that's one advantage to dragging your feet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjakitty
Someone on another thread mentioned a rivets shaver. I looked them up and the run between $150 (used) up to about $400. I guess the investment may be worth the time if you have enough rivets to remove. You can always sell it when finished to recoup some of the cost.
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Steve,
Undoubtably too late now but how are you putting it all back together? If it was a rivet coming out, it's a rivet going back in my case. So, I needed a 3x or 4x air gun. I erred on the high side with teh 4x. Does a wonderful job installing 1/4 solid rivets. Turns out if you put a chisel on it, it rips out 1/4" solid rivets as well. I decided to try it one day with a punch on some stubborn rivets that I had drill but they still didn't want to come out with the 1x H.F. air gun. Well, while I have it out anyway, why don't I try the chisel on the rivets that I didn't drill yet. OMG, the head just flew across and hit the RV next to me. It's old and beat up so don't worry for that guy. If I had known a yr and a half ago just how well it worked on rivet removal, I could have done all the rivets in a single day instead of the literal months that it took.
And t was almost half the price of the ebay tool that this guy posted. It was $215 I think. And as I mentioned I'm going to need it to put the rivets back in so it's not single purpose like this tool.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliot Naess
One item that can be upgraded... is where to cut all the window posts. It would make more sense to alternate cutting them high and low, for better alignment and better structural integrity. (All in a line... invites failure along that line.)
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Except that is a foot top and bottom of square tubing to overlap with the existing ribs, you can't do that on a Blue Bird easily. Not with 1 1/4" tubing anyway. At the top of the window frame are window headers that are bolted thru the ribs. At the bottom of the window frame there isn't a foot worth of space before you get to the chair rail. So at the top you'd have to unbolt the headers and drill thru the square tubing, then put the bolts back in. At the bottom with the chair rail in the way, you can't get the interference fit tubing in there without lots of banging and possibly mushrooming the banged end. Even if you did, then you can't make sure it's seated flush. No way I'm removing the chair rail.
So, ... right, wrong, or indifferent, I'm going with all center cuts on the ribs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Just got off of the phone with Kevin @ Bluebird regarding emergency exit interlocks.
I am trying to avoid making this weeks "my bus wont start" post.....
According to Kevin, If I remove the relay labeled "VandalLock" and jumper between the connections labeled "30" and "87A" it will bypass the interlock.
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Quoted for the sole purpose of finding it later. Mine is "bypassed" with a bunch of the window plates sammiched in there so the door is always "closed".
Quote:
Originally Posted by o1marc
Can you explain your experience or theory on how one way differs from the other in any way at all? You raise the roof using a section of steel welded at the end of each spliced piece and the end of each cut at minimum having 4 welds. If done correctly you will stitch weld the whole connection. At that point I suspect you are stronger than the original and staggering the cuts will make zero difference.
Most structural designs of parts like those ribs are designed to exceed their needed limit by 50%, so I think we are worrying about a minor detail.
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It's still weaker where the cut is. Is it strong enough, yeah probably.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tango
...I offset my cuts by 19", inserted 1-1/4"x 1/8" square tube from below the floor up to the start of the roof curve then both riveted and welded it all together including 19" replacement sections of factory rib. No doubt stronger than what came off the assembly line. But there was still a "weak line" way up at the top where the added metal ended.
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Wait you did what??? You threaded a 6 foot long piece of square tubing to the new ceiling height from under the bus? How the hell did you do that without the bus being on a 4 foot lift or you in a 4 foot pit?
Definitely overkill and definitely AWESOME!!!
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08-31-2018, 09:30 AM
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#204
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 3,738
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, MT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Hey Bob,
Yes, I was out in the sticks. In the woods with a creek in my back yard.
I moved a little over a year ago.
Yes, you are loosing your mind Welcome to the club.
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I've been on that bus for awhile now.
Quote:
No, the fishing bus is not mine.
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Who is the fishing cabin bus that doesn't fish? Was in OR instead of WA maybe?
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08-31-2018, 10:20 AM
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#205
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 3,738
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, MT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Ok..... I was going to place a picture and the comment on it. I am not finding the right way to do this so Here are pics of:
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Old people shouldn't try to technology.
After you've uploaded your pictures, you can right click the attachment, copy location, then paste it in the thread itself with the image tag of {img}{/img} only use [] instead of {}. Then type away over under the image tag with whatever comment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
I have to say again how much I appreciate the help I get from this community and especially Asetechrail for his help. He is a Rembrandt with the angle grinder. I am more of a Picasso.
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Apparently I'm not even a Van Gogh; I missed my ear by a good two inches. :rofl :
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
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Why did you do a raise? You're short.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
And more pics:
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Am I going to see more pics of what you did with the main door frame? I've cut above the door header and mechanism. It's going to suck but it's what I "had to do" as I didn't see any other option(s).
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
The coolant lines for the heaters were run inside the bus except where the emergency exit is (was...). At that point they drop through the floor and come back up on the other side of the door opening.
After much pulling, poking and prodding I came to the conclusion that to remove them would require removing the storage bays.
Not going to happen.
I cut them off flush with the floor and am going to abandon them in place.
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Mine didn't go thru the storage boxes. I've had mine removed for a yr now. Even drove the bus 400 miles with them bypassed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Back to roof raise tasks.
I am trying to figure out how to deal with a couple of spots up front where I cannot access the rib to weld from the outside.
I am thinking that I will drill several holes in the rib, clamp the square tube in place and plug weld from the inside.
Like so:
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So, my sammiched pair of ribs at the front are different than the rest.
They are rectangle not square. One of them is "crimped" and not hollow.
"Plain" rectangle with edges that are NOT so nice and neat for inserting:
Rib 2 with the "crimp":
It also look like you are getting rid of the front door? Leaks like carzy, less secure, etc. but I like it. I'm keeping the front fan fold door at this point. I made my cuts thru the "crimped" rib as neat and as straight as I could. That was before I became a squinty pirate. Ialso cut thru some of the exterior sheet metal in order to do that. I'll have to weld and grind flat the sheet metal cuts. Here's to hoping I don't totally hose it up. I can just see me burning huge holes in it. Dragging the MIG at some goofy angle and having t weld 3 or 4 beads before I actually weld the cut itself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tryonis
I am at this same stage, have you thought of running them at the top of the bay? Like yours mine run inside the bay for the length of the emergency door.
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...
Oh wait, I thinh I get it now. Storage bay not "people bay" and that explains Steve's problem. I don't have a storage bay directly under the e-door. I have two in front of the door and a small tool box one after the door.
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08-31-2018, 10:46 AM
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#206
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 3,738
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, MT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
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Page 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
The roof metal is pulled far enough away from the hat chanel that the clecos are too short and too stiff to bend easily back in place. I need to such the roof metal back in place so that I can rivet it. Is there a special tool for this?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by family wagon
I went inside the bus and located in the C-shape header at the top of each bay (between vertical hat channels) where the original line of rivets at the bottom edge of the roof metal had been. I drilled 2-3 of these through from inside toward outside.
Finally I went back outside the bus and pushed a #10x1 inch machine screw through the existing rivet hole in the roof metal, through the newly-drilled hole in the new wall sheet, and through the existing hole in the C header. An assistant on the inside put a nut on it and we spun it down snug. Repeat for the other two holes drilled above.
That took the roof metal down close enough that I could drill the remainder of the holes and buck rivets into all of them, removing the machine screws at the appropriate time.
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Hmm, I was hoping for vise grips but wait, there's a huge sheet of metal in the way. Grrr. Might have to do the same.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Just got my first quote back on metal to cover the windows. Only the windows.... Not the front or rear cap metal.... $995.04 plus tax.......
Only about double of what I expected. Waiting on additional quotes and hoping for a better deal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Metal quote #2 - $923 plus tax.....
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For plain old 4x8x16gauge sheet metal? Mine was $5xx something $524 maybe. Low $5xx anyway. I got 4x8 and some 4x10.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
I may have to post a picture to illustrate.
There are two rivets in the roof metal between each "eyebrow". This is where I am having trouble. There is one rivet on each side of the hat channel that sits between the eyebrows.
I need to pull that portion tight.
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I removed the entire bottom row of rivets including those two.
Quote:
Originally Posted by family wagon
I should have left my original text as it was!
We hoisted the new exterior wall metal into place with ratchet straps. The hook on the end of the straps was awful big and held the sheet out from the wall surface too much so I made a low-profile J hook from a scrap of sheet. The ratchet strap hooked into this, which then hooked under the bottom edge of the sheet. We made coarse adjustments to sheet position by winding the ratchet and fine adjustments by sliding the hooks sideways and/or shimming the strap out away from the sheet. With the sheet positioned just where I wanted it, I drilled 3 (?) holes through the sheet and the hat channel and placed clecos. Then we drilled and riveted the entire sheet.
Attachment 24653
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I likes that!! Easier than what I had planned.
Dzlfreek on YouTube made out riggers with square tubing and used pulleys which is what I planned but this is much more simple and the ratchets have stops instead of tying stuff off.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyBrown
Definitely check out Pacific Steel. I do not have my notes with me but it seems to me their quote was between 5 and 6 hundred.
I had a similar delima sourcing 1 3/16 tubing...it is unobtanium. I ended up cutting a small section of hat channel so that I could get an accurate internal dimension. It turned out to be 1.23". The 1 1/4" square tubing I purchased from Pacific Steel was 1.26" . I spent the next 2 weekends grinding/belt sanding .015" off both sides of both ends of each piece using the piiece of hat channel as a gauge. Good times, good times.
Casey
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My plan is to ignore the difference between 1.23" and 1.26". With persuasion, 1 1/4" fits.
And caught up.
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08-31-2018, 12:47 PM
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#207
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Essex, MD
Posts: 3,738
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: Blue Bird TC RE 3904, Flat Nose, 40', 277" wh base
Engine: 8.3L Cummins ISC 260hp, MT643, 4.44 rear
Rated Cap: 84 pax or 1 RV; 33,000lbs
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Where are you at now? Did you get your sheet metal yet?
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08-31-2018, 02:42 PM
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#208
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Eastern WA
Posts: 6,401
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American RE (A3RE)
Engine: Cummins ISC (8.3)
Rated Cap: 72
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The metal for the sides is here.
Waiting on rivets and still have to get the metal for the front and rear.
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08-31-2018, 02:45 PM
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#209
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Eastern WA
Posts: 6,401
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American RE (A3RE)
Engine: Cummins ISC (8.3)
Rated Cap: 72
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Knock on wood....
I have not managed to disfigure myself with the angle grinder yet.
I did try and kill Aserailtech with it though. Still feel bad about that....
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08-31-2018, 06:17 PM
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#210
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Bus Crazy
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: N.C.
Posts: 1,136
Year: 1997
Coachwork: Bluebird
Engine: DT466E
Rated Cap: 34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brewerbob
Apparently I'm not even a Van Gogh; I missed my ear by a good two inches.
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That was priceless.
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09-21-2018, 04:03 PM
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#211
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Eastern WA
Posts: 6,401
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American RE (A3RE)
Engine: Cummins ISC (8.3)
Rated Cap: 72
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Finally a bit of progress!!
The first of the side metal is going up. Lifting it in place by myself has been a bit of a task.
I used ratchet straps to lift it a little at a time. A wood block & hammer to fine tune location then riveted the top. Then had my wife push on the metal from the inside to bow it out so that I could tuck the lower edge behind the rub rail.
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09-21-2018, 04:10 PM
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#212
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Bus Crazy
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Salt Lake City Utah
Posts: 1,635
Year: 2000
Chassis: Blue Bird
Engine: ISC 8.3
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It sure feels good when you get a system worked out and start making visible progress!
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09-21-2018, 04:19 PM
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#213
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Eastern WA
Posts: 6,401
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American RE (A3RE)
Engine: Cummins ISC (8.3)
Rated Cap: 72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by family wagon
It sure feels good when you get a system worked out and start making visible progress!
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I cheered when i got the first piece up. I am REALLY hoping to get it enclosed before the weather turns too cold or wet.
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09-21-2018, 07:01 PM
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#214
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Skoolie
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Riverside, CA
Posts: 171
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Steve,
If I was closer then I would help you with your roof raise. This is like barn (bus) raising.
Todd
__________________
BlueFish aka Todd
Seeking a Crown, Thomas, International, Blue Bird bus with DT466, Cummins 8.3, Allison trans, high roof, air brakes, and A/C.
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09-22-2018, 01:26 PM
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#215
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Eastern WA
Posts: 6,401
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American RE (A3RE)
Engine: Cummins ISC (8.3)
Rated Cap: 72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueFish
Steve,
If I was closer then I would help you with your roof raise. This is like barn (bus) raising.
Todd
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Thanks Todd,
I wish you were closer. I love the idea of co-op building. We started down that road when we started the roof raise.
Asetechrail and I were going to work together on my roof raise then tackle his together.
Unfortunately, after Kent spent several days helping me (he did most of the work) he had a change in life circumstances and had to move out of state.
I really enjoyed the time we spent working together on the project and sharing the occasional meal with Kent and his lovely wife. Good folks!
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09-22-2018, 01:47 PM
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#216
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 23,764
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Thanks Todd,
I wish you were closer. I love the idea of co-op building. We started down that road when we started the roof raise.
Asetechrail and I were going to work together on my roof raise then tackle his together.
Unfortunately, after Kent spent several days helping me (he did most of the work) he had a change in life circumstances and had to move out of state.
I really enjoyed the time we spent working together on the project and sharing the occasional meal with Kent and his lovely wife. Good folks!
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One day Roxy and I will have a bus co-op here in central FL.
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09-22-2018, 02:01 PM
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#217
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Eastern WA
Posts: 6,401
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American RE (A3RE)
Engine: Cummins ISC (8.3)
Rated Cap: 72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EastCoastCB
One day Roxy and I will have a bus co-op here in central FL.
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I daydream about buying a piece of property and doing the same. Maybe I should move to FL
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09-22-2018, 02:41 PM
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#218
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 23,764
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
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09-22-2018, 03:46 PM
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#219
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Bus Nut
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Damascus, OR
Posts: 681
Year: 2004
Chassis: International
Engine: T444e w/ 2000 Allison Trans
Rated Cap: 35
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nice Steve, It'll seem real when it is all buttoned up and you can see the space you have to work with on the inside! keep it up.
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09-22-2018, 04:49 PM
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#220
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Skoolie
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Riverside, CA
Posts: 171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve
Thanks Todd,
I wish you were closer. I love the idea of co-op building. We started down that road when we started the roof raise.
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I'm looking for land now to build my own bus. I'm lucky in that I can move wherever I want for work right now.
Who knows maybe I will become one of those snowbirds.
__________________
BlueFish aka Todd
Seeking a Crown, Thomas, International, Blue Bird bus with DT466, Cummins 8.3, Allison trans, high roof, air brakes, and A/C.
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