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Old 02-08-2015, 09:20 PM   #211
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YES! that stuff!
I'm going to see if my buddy who runs the brake dept at the shop will make me some.
Wondering how much it would be to skip that and just order it though.
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Old 02-09-2015, 09:10 AM   #212
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Back about a hundred years ago while raising a Blue Bird, I was able to get full repair ribs from the maker and cut them into what I needed. At the time, they were actually pretty cheap. Just a thought.
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Old 02-21-2015, 07:17 AM   #213
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Are rub rails needed?

I've been working on some access doors for my fuel tanks and stabilizer jacks. Building them from scratch. I'll get some pics of them later. While working on them I remembered a conversation I had a while back with a friend who's gonna do a skoolie and was asking if the rub rails could be removed and the whole thing skinned to look more like an RV. I told him I thought the rub rails were part of the structure but that was just a quick assessment and may not carry any real weight. As I think more about I'm thinking they just might not have that much to do with the actual strength of the sidewall as much as keeping the sidewall rotected and creating a handy place and way to deal with lap joints. I have a 1995 AmTrans and the profile on the side panels is a very shallow profile I assume to prevent oil canning. So the question becomes, are the rub rails actually needed? Could one remove all of them, have new matching skin made and re-skin the whole thing the same so it wouldn't look like a patch together job when finished with raising the roof? It may simplify things a good bit as the rub rails have to be cut and closed in where they cross doors and vents and such.
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Old 02-21-2015, 07:29 AM   #214
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That's something I've been thinking about lately. Good topic.
Would sure look sweet all smooth and new looking!
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Old 02-21-2015, 09:03 AM   #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sojourner View Post
I have a 1995 AmTrans and the profile on the side panels is a very shallow profile I assume to prevent oil canning. So the question becomes, are the rub rails actually needed? Could one remove all of them, have new matching skin made and re-skin the whole thing the same so it wouldn't look like a patch together job when finished with raising the roof? It may simplify things a good bit as the rub rails have to be cut and closed in where they cross doors and vents and such.
I'm so glad you mentioned this.

Yes you could.

You also notice that near the middle of the bus body, right above the wheel wells, that sheet of outer skin had ribs pressed right into it? That's the profile you mention.

After reskining the sides of my bus, and doing a tin roofing job, I started thinking about contraction and expansion. Roofing tin has ribs pressed into it every 6 inches or less. I always thought this was just for strength, and rigidity.

Well it turns out both the roofing tin and the sides on my blue bird bus were both ribbed to give the steel somewhere to expand to without oil canning just like you mentioned.

So, for those of us who are reskining the sides after window removal, having a metal shop press ribs that match the rub rails into the new sheets would reduce the amount the new steel tries to buckle / wrinkle, and eliminates the need for rub rails.

One more advantage, is the fact that rub rails collect crap behind them, cause rust to start. With the new one piece panels with rub rails pressed into it, all seams will over lap the proper direction, keeping the water and road grime out.

The next bus I build, I will be reskining the entire sides, and implementing the one piece panels with built in rub rails.

Maybe I will even used polished stainless steel for a chrome look.

Slowly this site is evolving the skoolie conversions. Better idea's, Better methods, Better materials.

Just look at how many of us are doing roof raises now.

Nat
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Old 02-21-2015, 09:13 AM   #216
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Originally Posted by nat_ster View Post
I'm so glad you mentioned this.

Yes you could.

You also notice that near the middle of the bus body, right above the wheel wells, that sheet of outer skin had ribs pressed right into it? That's the profile you mention.

After reskining the sides of my bus, and doing a tin roofing job, I started thinking about contraction and expansion. Roofing tin has ribs pressed into it every 6 inches or less. I always thought this was just for strength, and rigidity.

Well it turns out both the roofing tin and the sides on my blue bird bus were both ribbed to give the steel somewhere to expand to without oil canning just like you mentioned.

So, for those of us who are reskining the sides after window removal, having a metal shop press ribs that match the rub rails into the new sheets would reduce the amount the new steel tries to buckle / wrinkle, and eliminates the need for rub rails.

One more advantage, is the fact that rub rails collect crap behind them, cause rust to start. With the new one piece panels with rub rails pressed into it, all seams will over lap the proper direction, keeping the water and road grime out.

The next bus I build, I will be reskining the entire sides, and implementing the one piece panels with built in rub rails.

Maybe I will even used polished stainless steel for a chrome look.

Slowly this site is evolving the skoolie conversions. Better idea's, Better methods, Better materials.

Just look at how many of us are doing roof raises now.

Nat
I thought the bus you have now and the 60k investment were going to last you a lifetime and be the end of having to buy stuff! What's this "next bus" thing?
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Old 02-21-2015, 09:23 AM   #217
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I thought the bus you have now and the 60k investment were going to last you a lifetime and be the end of having to buy stuff! What's this "next bus" thing?
I have kids, and a bus addiction. There will be more bus builds in my future.

And it was 30k to 50k, not 60k.

Although by the time I build the 32 foot stacker trailer for behind the bus, I may be in that much. lol

Nat
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Old 02-21-2015, 10:11 AM   #218
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nat_ster View Post
So, for those of us who are reskining the sides after window removal, having a metal shop press ribs that match the rub rails into the new sheets would reduce the amount the new steel tries to buckle / wrinkle, and eliminates the need for rub rails.
The only thing I would think problematic with braking in rub rail profiles would be where windows, doors, vents and such would intersect the lines. Having a low profile "profile" would allow the trim rings to simply compress onto them with sealer in between. A heavily raised place like a rub rail, while doing what you suggest as far as basically being a stress relief could be problematic in other places. Would be way cool though if one had the resources to stamp in the proper placement of such with the window and door locations left blank.
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Old 02-21-2015, 01:57 PM   #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sojourner View Post
I've been working on some access doors for my fuel tanks and stabilizer jacks. Building them from scratch. I'll get some pics of them later. While working on them I remembered a conversation I had a while back with a friend who's gonna do a skoolie and was asking if the rub rails could be removed and the whole thing skinned to look more like an RV. I told him I thought the rub rails were part of the structure but that was just a quick assessment and may not carry any real weight. As I think more about I'm thinking they just might not have that much to do with the actual strength of the sidewall as much as keeping the sidewall rotected and creating a handy place and way to deal with lap joints. I have a 1995 AmTrans and the profile on the side panels is a very shallow profile I assume to prevent oil canning. So the question becomes, are the rub rails actually needed? Could one remove all of them, have new matching skin made and re-skin the whole thing the same so it wouldn't look like a patch together job when finished with raising the roof? It may simplify things a good bit as the rub rails have to be cut and closed in where they cross doors and vents and such.

On my 96 AmTran the rub rails are riveted on top of the body panels, just to protect them from damage. Absolutely not part of the body or structural panels, just an add on to decrease the repair cost on fleet shops. Drill them out and patch the holes and your good, or leave them for the same reason they were put there in the first place, to save the body encase you misjudge a close corner. Still not sure which way I'm going, reducing repair cost is great, but if I paint a mural on the side they will have to go first.
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Old 02-21-2015, 03:24 PM   #220
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Here's a couple pics of the access door assemblies I'm working on. I have yet to put in the hinge pins, drill the holes for mounting and cam locks, glaze, sand, prime and paint. Need 6 of them for stabilizer jack access and fuel fill access. Gonna be overseas for a couple weeks so I'll not get to work on her .



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