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Old 04-18-2015, 11:07 PM   #461
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Florida
Posts: 584
Year: 1988
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: I.H.
Engine: DT360
Exclamation

That's why tasks like this are left for the wife.

I'd be on the sideline with a cold drink and a chair watching with a camera just in case. Hey, I don't want to leave just the easy stuff for her. I'd never hear the end of that.
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Old 04-19-2015, 12:13 AM   #462
Site Team
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 648
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: TC2000 RE
Engine: 8.3l Cummins
Rated Cap: 78
Criticisim taken, but Idunno - it seemed pretty safe and stable to me. Its not like I was going to drive it like that ;)

The longer guide rod is 1.25" square x .25" wall DOM tubing, and the upper flange (two lower, and upper) are through bolted, not welded, to the bus ribs.

I feel that the somewhat sketchy part of the whole lift was probably the threaded rod. If my welding is questionable, then I'm probably screwed considering how much is fab work has been done so far.

Considering how stiff that DOM tube is, I imagine if the roof came crashing down via timed explosive bolts severing the threaded rod, it would just rest on the ends of those tubes.

I think I'll leave the explosive bolts in over Kerbal Space Program


Quote:
Originally Posted by nat_ster View Post
Sorry man, but that looks scarey as hell.

You have no safety measures in place to keep that roof from crushing you.

The entire roofs weight is being held by the few small welds where the lifters attach to the ribs.

Even a simple 2x4 frame would have been better than nothing.

Remember fellow skoolies, even when we get excited, we still need to keep working safely.

Nat
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Old 04-19-2015, 01:30 AM   #463
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Maple Ridge BC Canada
Posts: 191
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: TC2000 Rear engine
Engine: Cummins 8.3; MD3060
Rated Cap: 84
I did it almost the same way. I used 4 tube in tube guides. The only difference was I added 6"x6" fir pieces across in the front and in the back and used farm jacks that were pushing 6x6 pieces up.

I think it was safe enough, the one thing must be obeyed for sure NO WIND.

Everyone is taking some degree of risk when trying to work with tools. If you feel unsafe just add temp wood scaffolding inside the bus and keep raising it up.
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Old 04-19-2015, 10:03 AM   #464
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Year: 1992
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Chassis: TC2000 FE
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I mean no ignorance by my post, only caution.

I may not be able to see everything going on in the pics.

Now just a few more thoughts.

If using threaded rod as a lifter, choose the largest you can to increase the surface area of the threads taking the load.

Use nuts that are longer than standard. Coupling nuts are around three times the length of a standard nut. This gives three times the threads to take the load of the roof.

Lube the threads. This will prevent premature wear on the threads that could lead to thread failure on the soft grade 5 threaded rod / nuts.

Use grade 8 nuts if you can. This will put the thread wear on the threaded rod vs the threads inside of the nut failing.

Pay attention to how hard the nuts are to turn. if they are overloaded, or binding, they will get harder to turn.

Have no fear people, I'm so glad more of you are raising your bus roofs.

Coupling nuts.
https://www.boltdepot.com/Coupling_nuts.aspx

Nat
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Old 04-20-2015, 12:49 PM   #465
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Maple Ridge BC Canada
Posts: 191
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: TC2000 Rear engine
Engine: Cummins 8.3; MD3060
Rated Cap: 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by nat_ster View Post
I mean no ignorance by my post, only caution.

I may not be able to see everything going on in the pics.

Now just a few more thoughts.

If using threaded rod as a lifter, choose the largest you can to increase the surface area of the threads taking the load.

Use nuts that are longer than standard. Coupling nuts are around three times the length of a standard nut. This gives three times the threads to take the load of the roof.

Lube the threads. This will prevent premature wear on the threads that could lead to thread failure on the soft grade 5 threaded rod / nuts.

Use grade 8 nuts if you can. This will put the thread wear on the threaded rod vs the threads inside of the nut failing.

Pay attention to how hard the nuts are to turn. if they are overloaded, or binding, they will get harder to turn.

Have no fear people, I'm so glad more of you are raising your bus roofs.

Coupling nuts.
https://www.boltdepot.com/Coupling_nuts.aspx

Nat
These are all good points. I didn't even think about using threaded road to raise the roof. This is the most economical way unless you already have farm jacks or can borrow them.

Home depot sells coupling hunts. They are about 1.5" high. If you keep rods greased they will last even to raise few roofs.....
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Old 04-20-2015, 02:22 PM   #466
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Salt Lake City Utah
Posts: 957
Year: 2000
Chassis: Blue Bird
Engine: ISC 8.3
Quote:
Originally Posted by taskswap View Post
I'm a little surprised I don't see more fiberglass used. Is it because of the difficulty in working with it, cost, or something else? Fiberglass would never oil-can or buckle in this way.

Another option would be to take a lesson out of the RV industry's book: a layered sheet. An 1/8" or 1/4" sheet of H45 or H100 would add a huge amount of rigidity to a sheet of aluminum or galv. and you can just bond them together with adhesives. They're both reasonably cheap, you can still attach with rivets (just need a longer one, and use normal break rivets, not high-strength), and you get an unexpected but maybe cool advantage: it's a lot harder to dent. It's also a thermal break.

It's not free but the thinnest sheets might only add a couple hundred bucks. I'm seriously considering this route myself - if I do, I'll report back here on the results.
For my part, disuse of fiberglass is because of ignorance. I'm so unfamiliar with it I don't know where to begin as far as deciding whether it's appropriate for a job or how to build up an assembly. If you felt inspired to write anything about how fiberglass might be advantageous especially in the external wall or in the shower enclosure, I'd definitely read it!
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Old 04-20-2015, 03:24 PM   #467
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 258
OK cool, I'll definitely do that. I have a 50-yard roll of BID left over from a previous project and the bus seems like the perfect place for it. It does take a bit of practice, but so does anything else..

I'll post some YouTube videos once we get started. We're shopping for the right bus now, hoping to get started in the next month or two.
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Old 04-20-2015, 07:30 PM   #468
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Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Vacaville, Ca
Posts: 1,136
Year: 1988
Coachwork: Crown / Pusher
Engine: 8.3 Cummins
Quote:
Originally Posted by taskswap View Post
OK cool, I'll definitely do that. I have a 50-yard roll of BID left over from a previous project and the bus seems like the perfect place for it. It does take a bit of practice, but so does anything else..

I'll post some YouTube videos once we get started. We're shopping for the right bus now, hoping to get started in the next month or two.
I used fiberglass between my 2 roof levels , If I were to do it again I would have a sheetmetal shop build a cap for me
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Old 04-21-2015, 01:51 AM   #469
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Maple Ridge BC Canada
Posts: 191
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Chassis: TC2000 Rear engine
Engine: Cummins 8.3; MD3060
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allwthrrider View Post
I used fiberglass between my 2 roof levels , If I were to do it again I would have a sheetmetal shop build a cap for me
Any pictures??? Any concerns??? Leaks???? Cracks????

I think the problem with fibreglass is when you use it on a boat built from it already it works great, but when the entire bus is built from steel and you add some fibreglass panels they will expend/contract differently, it is harder to rivet them without cracking.

It was much easier to me just weld steel panels in roof slope.
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Old 04-21-2015, 09:31 AM   #470
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
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Specifically, it hardly expands/contracts at all. It is an extremely rigid material. When doing things like skins over metal you just need to elongate the holes a tiny bit. Metals expand/contract "a lot" - but only relative to not moving at all. They don't grow inches. You only need to make a round hole 1/16" or so longer to allow for it, depending on what you're doing. There are some side benefits, though, like no galvanic corrosion, it's waterproof, can never rust, etc.

This only applies to exterior skins - which may not be the best use, anyway. It's almost never a problem with smaller things. Fiberglass does take some work, and the work is directly proportional to the piece size. It's REALLY good for doing things like trim work, making ducts, supports, mounting brackets, etc. It's SUPER good when making odd shapes, things you'd need a bending brake and some experience to make out of metal. You guys that are good at welding probably wouldn't get as much mileage out of this, but it's amazing what you can make.

I'll post some videos of this soon when we finally get to work on ours.
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