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Old 04-23-2015, 07:55 AM   #11
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We decided to throw a metal panel back up where the bathroom will go, and one above where the stove will be, sans insulation for now, just to be safe. We were thinking about a fire safe insulation... But I keep convincing myself there's no such thing that I would feel safe with.
There are plenty of fire-safe insulations. They're regularly used to insulate stainless chimney liners. With wood-burning appliances, keeping flue temperatures as high as possible as actually desirable, because creosote is the condensation of unburned compounds from the fire. It sounds a little counter-intuitive, but people go out of their way to keep the temps high, not low, because if creosote can't condense, you never get enough build-up to have a chimney fire.

To that end, we're talking temps of 450F or so. Fiberglass (with no paper liner) is commonly used in this case and it can take 1850F or so. If you want to step it up, you can buy the liner blankets they use for flue liners. These are a ceramic wool and are rated to the same temp as the stainless is - 2200F or so. You will only ever see those if you have a chimney fire, which you should never have if you maintain your flue properly. In a bus that's so easy you'd have to be a real knucklehead to have an issue. 8' of pipe is about 10 seconds of cleaning work. Most chimney fires happen to people that clean their chimneys once a decade - if you clean yours even once a winter and burn only dry wood, you'll be fine.

Do not be afraid to insulate. With a wood burning appliance, LACK of insulation can cause the very harm you're trying to avoid.

And do not be unnecessarily afraid of exhausts from stoves, propane appliances, etc. You're talking temps of 250F-450F even in extreme cases. Your oven gets hotter when you're broiling a steak, and it's insulated with... plain old fiberglass. Remember, we have _paints_ designed to handle 2000F+ temps. Temperatures are just something you manage, like anything else. Don't put any wood up there, and you'll be fine.
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Old 04-23-2015, 08:01 AM   #12
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Oh, one more thing. If you really want to scare yourself... consider that you're assuming steel is safe. But steel burns. Easily. That's why they don't make fire grates out of it - they use cast iron. Try it some time - throw a steel can like from a can of corn into a hot bed of coals from your next camp fire. There will be holes it in by morning, and if you leave it in there for a week it'll be completely gone.

My fire grate in my boiler broke last year and in a pinch (it was mid-winter, I couldn't have it down even for a day) I mig-welded one up out of some 1" bar stock and expanded metal sheet I had lying around. I didn't expect it to last - just get me through the week. I was right. Within a week, the expanded sheet (I think it was 16ga) was totally gone. The bars survived the winter but sagged badly in the winter. I'll post a pic of this tonight when I can get home and take one.

But hot wood coals are 1800F-2200F if they're getting lots of air. Flue temps are <500F. There's nothing to worry about... I'm just pointing out that you shouldn't assume steel is safe and insulation is not...
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Old 04-23-2015, 08:44 AM   #13
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As for the recycled grey water, all grey I have smelled that comes in contact with any proteins, doesn't smell good at all, probably worse than a black tank

if you could filter out the food bits and such it might be doable?? I just know that any time I have taken a trap under a sink apart it is

have you looked around motherearthnews (or similar sites?)
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Old 04-23-2015, 11:02 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by maggiemae View Post
Also we are installing our wood ceiling. It's totally growing on me.


We decided to throw a metal panel back up where the bathroom will go, and one above where the stove will be, sans insulation for now, just to be safe. We were thinking about a fire safe insulation... But I keep convincing myself there's no such thing that I would feel safe with.


Today I had to work more on homework and selling our stuff, and also taking care of all the animals (chickens, rats, snake, and I am fostering a family of ten 3week old puppies and their mom... Yikes!)
Sure are cute, though!!
Attachment 6722

I started with the ceiling yesterday, and justin was able to snap a picture of the progress when he got home from work. I used pink foam insulation sheet/non adhesive tape stuff glued in between the wood and metal ribs. We are thinking it will help with noise and rubbing when the bus is moving... To help protect the wood . Hopefully we will have the ceiling done this weekend. We just need to finish the floor and frame the bathroom first.

Its crazy how different it looks just from 3 weeks ago...
Attachment 6723
Attachment 6724
More photos to come! I will take more tomorrow.


I am securing the wood panels loosely right now, then I will tighten them in once they are all in place. I am using 1.5 inch wood to metal self tapping screws, I used two on the center board, and one on each board thereafter to be able to move them.
I will do the same thing with my ceiling, did you start installing the wood from the middle and work your way to the sides?, post more photos.

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Old 04-23-2015, 11:05 AM   #15
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Glad to hear you've come around on that ceiling! Wood is gonna look so good!
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Old 04-23-2015, 12:02 PM   #16
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Taskswap, those are very interesting and great points. I used great stuff fire safe insullation in a shed I used to live in, put it in right around the single wall stove pipe, and there were no fires. I suppose I am just being exceedingly cautious. I will post a picture of the pipe that came with the stove, it's called metalpestos (sp?). I have never seen anything like it before and I'm not sure how it will work.

Bansil, yes I just cleaned my sink pea trap... And I almost threw up. Told Justin no more face shaving or spitting in the sink. Yuck!!! Definitely going to have to put a filter in the sink.

Juliol: yea we started in the middle, to help keep the ceiling symmetrical.
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Old 04-23-2015, 12:12 PM   #17
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Double-wall metalbestos flue pipe is an excellent fire safety measure and has its own built-in insulation to keep the flue hot. Triple-wall is even better, but it's bigger, more expensive, and really only required in special circumstances. You'll be fine.
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Old 04-23-2015, 01:38 PM   #18
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Yup, steel burns alright. Like Tankswap mentioned, good stoves are made from cast iron, and have fire bricks to line the burn chamber. Otherwise, the stove would burn out in no time at all.

Wood burns hot, coal burns even hotter.

I have pics in my thread of a can in my stove. One third of the can vaporized in 10 min in the small coal fire.

Funny how some members must learn the hard way, despite the countless posts and time used to try to help them with the experience we have learned the hard way.

Great stuff spray foam will not expand properly in a closed space. The pics you posted show some of the foam you shot into that cavity didn't even expand. That is the part that would have caused rust down the road.

Great Stuff expanding foam was never intended to be used on metal buildings. It was made for use in wood structures for filling gaps smaller that half inch.

Thanks for posting the pics for other members to see.

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Old 04-23-2015, 05:34 PM   #19
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Yay well I'm glad we were able to get that metalbestos pipe! It only requires a two inch clearance from any Combustible material and is rated up to 2100 degrees F!

I'll need to go to the stove shop for a spark arrester, I'll just see what they have in terms of gaskets that can go around the exterior pipe, as well as any insullation.

Nat, yes I know about the great stuff, I posted pictures about what happened to it when we put it in a roof panel! That will be a useful image/experiment to other members that wants to put it in their ceiling without taking the panel down! I'm a scientist, so naturally I like experiments, or solid evidence. Now other members can use my experiment, Like you said, so people don't have to learn the hard way Also I know that metal/steel burns too! It just doesn't burn as much as wood, which is why we decided to put the metal panel back up over where the stove will go.
I'll go take photos of what I'm talking about
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Old 04-23-2015, 06:23 PM   #20
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Remember height with chimney (you can keep it short and stubby with a cap while on road, when you need it stick extension on with arrestor and be golden)

As for shaving, pick him up a cheap SS salad bowl, fill with hot water and shave then dispose of water, works great for a quick cleanup also w/o shower ;)
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