Transmogrifie and Me

[Shadoll]

Wondering if home depot will let me return the 3 sheets of 1" I haven't used in exchange for some 1/2" that I wanted to put on the floor.

[lornaschinske]

Originally Posted by Shadoll

Wondering if home depot will let me return the 3 sheets of 1" I haven't used in exchange for some 1/2" that I wanted to put on the floor.

Don't see why not. How long ago was it bought?

Originally Posted by Shadoll

... perhaps a layer of the white foam on the inside of this stuff and then wood...

We left our insulation alone and sealed up behind the interior metal sheeting. Furred out and placed the rather irritating 1" Polyshield with the shiny radiant barrier on the interior (shiny side in). Then we covered the foam with laminate flooring. Made a nice looking rather durable paneling. One "plank" covered from the ceiling to 4 or 5" within the floor. I want a BIG tall baseboard. The biggie is the thermal break. Biggest problem we have found using the laminate flooring is you have got to get it to lock together. We have two spots (both are hidden) where David could not get the planks to line up right and lock together. The planks are slightly off at times. The top and bottom hit but the middle didn't. Not sure if it's the bus walls or the planks. At any rate, we will fill the opened up seam with caulking AFTER we move back to a more humid area.



All our "furring" strips came from the culls bin at Home Depot (green paint = 51¢). Plus we got a whole lumber cart of the real 1X2" pretzelly furring strips (culls) for free. I had to get David to get it as they wouldn't let me , myself or I get it. Thought it would look bad for an employee to get it. They would just trash it anyway. Got to get that stuff early in the AM or it's gone!

[Shadoll]

Originally Posted by lornaschinske

Don't see why not. How long ago was it bought?

Last Thursday.

[lornaschinske]

Originally Posted by Shadoll

Last Thursday.

TAKE IT BACK! There is no reason for you to keep it if you can't use it. They can resell it.

Take it to the returns register, not the desk in the lumber section.

[Shadoll]

They get irritated at me because I 'check out' at the returns counter if I have just a couple of things, the other counter is at the other end of the store.

So you left the metal sheeting on the walls and put the foam on the outside of that? I'm thinking if I already have R-ll in the walls I could use half inch when I get to the walls.

I called a friend with the truck and we're taking it back tomorrow night (and she's making me beans and cornbread). Trade for what I need for the floor foam board and the Rosen Paper. Then on payday get the plywood.

Things seem to take odd turns, but I guess as long as I keep moving forward..

[Shadoll]

Another question, to use self tapping screws into the framing to attach the furring and/or boards, do you drill a small hole first? I'm not sure my battery Makita is powerful enough to run a screw into the steel.

[bansil]

Take a look at how I did ours,(I am no expert...the results sound like what you want)
I have atleast 2 drills at al times
I will predrill wood oversize alittle for the screws used(so drill doesn't have to drill both)
And then I will sometimes predrill metal with say a cheap 1/8 drill bit,then follow with a #10 or #12 self tapper.
Make sure to set drill to "rachet" and not drill or you may strip out holes.
...oops gotta godinners ready

For your use it will take power,esp. For a lot of screws....one drill set for drilling and one for screwing will help tho

[lornaschinske]

Originally Posted by Shadoll

Another question, to use self tapping screws into the framing to attach the furring and/or boards, do you drill a small hole first? I'm not sure my battery Makita is powerful enough to run a screw into the steel.

David drilled a pilot hole. We were using a battery powered screw gun and the battery is getting weak. They got too cold last winter without having a full charge. Cordless to screw the screws in, corded to drill the pilot holes. Using two drills makes it all go much faster. We used the SPAX screws (green boxes). David drilled a hole thru the 3/4" furring strip, then thru the 1/4" shims (to accommodate the 1" insulation) and the thru the metal siding (and occasionally in the steel frame). We also screwed the flooring/wall covering, top and bottom, into the furring strip (no farther... we did not touch the interior metal with any of the wall covering screws as that would have created a thermal bridge) and we predrilled the screw holes in the wall covering for that too. So that we didn't damage the laminate.

We have lots of folks check out at the returns desk! All day long.

[Shadoll]

Thanks to both of you. El Tortuga is one of my favorites to watch and read..

Lorna, what did you mean by this?

Originally Posted by "lornaschinske

We left our insulation alone and sealed up behind the interior metal sheeting.

When I took the sheet of metal off it was sealed all around with crackeling caulking I had to chip away at. If I don't take all the sheeting off I don't know how I would seal it, makes sense though.

[Shadoll]

Was just sitting here thinking how much I can get done before I have to move in... and picturing white foam walls... my cat would just love to tear them to shreds.. yikes.

I think I'm just panicking now..

[Shadoll]

Originally Posted by roach711

Your R-11 fiberglass is for a 3 1/2" thickness which comes to about R-3.14 per inch. The foam panels are usually better insulators at up to r-5 per inch. One problem with insulating only the bays is the thermal bridging of the body ribs. The cold will come right through those ribs and cool down the inner steel skin unless you create a thermal break between the rib and the inner skin. How much time you want to spend on insulating will probably depend on where you'll be traveling and the time of year.

Wow.. missed your post somehow. Thank you for the explanation, yes the R-11 said 3" on it. I can see where people are leary of even rivet heads transferring cold. We have been having an unusually cold winter month this year but usually it's not that bad. Now people have me worried about the heat.

[Accordion]

A 9/64th drill bit is perfect for sheet rock screws going into metal.

[Shadoll]

Originally Posted by Accordion

A 9/64th drill bit is perfect for sheet rock screws going into metal.

Thank you. Was going to buy one tomorrow. had one that was working until it broke.. think it was for wood. I was drilling out the aluminum heads on the rivets, some were steel I think.

[lornaschinske]

Originally Posted by Shadoll

...
Lorna, what did you mean by this?

When I took the sheet of metal off it was sealed all around with crackeling caulking I had to chip away at. If I don't take all the sheeting off I don't know how I would seal it, makes sense though.

[/quote]
We did not remove any of the interior sheet metal. We had NO rust at all in our bus. When we pulled and recaulked the windows, no rust. No rust in the floor, no rust under the floor. No rust in the doors. We had a little surface rust in the entry steps. A little surface rust at the bottom of the entry door. We removed the metal pieces directly above the windows where the wiring runs. Fiberglass insulation was in great shape (except for the two pieces that someone had removed and apparently tore up). No rust. And we even had a small leak in the ceiling. No rust though. We dealt with rust in our Eagle. We were looking for rust. My hearing is very good. I beat on all the walls listening for the sound of falling rust. Besides we have about a ton of rivets. No way we were going to deal with all those rivets just to remove insulation and then add different insulation. I firmly believe BlueBird pays their workers based on how many rivets they use. Rivets are all in good shape. BlueBird makes a well put together bus.

[lornaschinske]

Originally Posted by Shadoll

... I can see where people are leery of even rivet heads transferring cold...

Rivets transfer heat as well. Here in NM, I had a rivet get hot enough during the summer that it blistered the bottom of my foot that I had propped up on the side wall. I have... "prop-itis". I prop on everything and laying on the bed with my feet propped up on the side wall while I read a book is very comfortable. Rivets can get very hot.

Thermal breaks and insulation are very very important. For both hot and cold.

[lornaschinske]

Originally Posted by Shadoll

The Luaun that I saw was rough and almost plastic like finish, it was strange...

Are you sure you weren't looking at hardboard?

[Shadoll]

I noticed some busses do have a lot of rivets. The panel I took off had maybe 15. Even my ceiling panels have one every 2 feet or so. Not as many as a lot of them I'm seeing. I just thought you meant that you put some sort of sealant behind the metal somehow.

I didn't want to cut corners but I can see the need to not tear off all of the interior sheeting at this point. Timing.

[Shadoll]

Originally Posted by lornaschinske

Are you sure you weren't looking at hardboard?

It was 1/4 inch luaun it said on the shelf, I dunno. Sometimes I get a guy at Home Depot that doesn't know anymore than I do it seems. I decided to go with half inch plywood on the floor. More expensive but I need the stability for the Allure Trafficmaster and the carpet guy thought it best as well for 1/2 inch. Course.. haven't bought it yet either.

[Diesel Dan]

I've been seeing some crappy looking Luan lately. It still looks like Luan basically, but it has a lot of imperfections like cheap quality plywood. I didn't think there was more than one grade of Luan. What the hell is going on? Seems like the quality of wood is getting worse every year!

[lornaschinske]

Originally Posted by Shadoll

I noticed some busses do have a lot of rivets. The panel I took off had maybe 15. Even my ceiling panels have one every 2 feet or so. Not as many as a lot of them I'm seeing. I just thought you meant that you put some sort of sealant behind the metal somehow.

I didn't want to cut corners but I can see the need to not tear off all of the interior sheeting at this point. Timing.

The rivets on our bus are the same inside and out. One Rivet holds on the exterior AND interior skins. The vertical rivets on our bus are spaced 1-1/2" apart on center and horizontal rivets are 3-1/2" on center. No way we were going to drill out all those rivets. We would still be working on the rivets. I tried to count rivets one day but lost count.

On a ceiling panel: there are 55 rivets on each of the 8 seams. Then there are 7 more rivets between seams (7x7). So the ceiling alone has a total of 489.