Under cloud and under star - Page 4

mysty · 04-16-2017, 08:15 PM

I found some channel that fit pretty snug inside the existing hat channel, so I bought 26 pieces of it in 3' lengths. I'll probably follow your example and get some angle iron to create a flange to rivet my skin to.

We ended up with an 18" raise - Grant said he didn't really feel comfortable pushing it beyond that for safety reasons, and since he's the one with nearly 20 years of welding experience, I decided to trust him. That gave us 9" of overlap on both ends for the rib extensions. He initially was welding up both sides of the overlap, but the hat channel is so thin that even on the lowest setting, the welder kept burning holes through it that he had to go back and fill. So we changed tactics a little and did a horizontal weld across the 3 edges of the channel where it met on both the inside and the outside. (That sounds confusing, but it's actually pretty simple. I'll try to get a picture of it tomorrow.) This made things start moving much faster, and everything still felt completely secure and solid.

We were able to completely finish welding in the supports on the passenger side, and got all of the inside welds done on the driver's side, except for the two ribs that had the lifting mechanisms on them. Our plan is to finish that side up next weekend. Even so, we are sturdy enough to take the bus off it's leveling jacks and even drive it (although the rear lights are all disconnected currently, so I'm not planning on doing much driving!)

EastCoastCB · 04-16-2017, 08:21 PM

Not confusing at all. We had a couple burn throughs initially but once Dave got into a rhythm we got em all buttoned up nicely. We welded along the same edge as yall. We also did some plug welds.
The rib extensions were initially stuck in with self tapping screws just to line everything up and hold it till it was all welded up.
CONGRATS again! And welcome to the HIGH ROLLERS CLUB!

tobeamiss · 04-17-2017, 08:13 AM

Girl, you're doing abadazz conversion! I just found your thread this morning and I'll be watching

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mysty · 04-23-2017, 11:49 AM

We've been busy this weekend! Jonathan and I have been trying to get a good method going for tinting the windows with some heat control film. It's not as perfectly smooth and bubble free as we'd like, but I can live with it.

Grant finished welding in the supports for the roof raise. Yeah! We ended up using some 3 1/2" x 1/4" bar to create a flange. It took a while to figure out how many rivets and where they should go to attach the skin, but I think we have a plan.

The front of the bus is a special problem that we're still improvising on. The channel they used up there wasn't the same size as the rest of the bus, and I forgot to measure it before buying this week's order of metal. Consequently, I ended up running to Home Depot and grabbing some electrical strut that we made fit. (It's amazing what you can do with an angle grinder!)

We also put in some horizontal bars that sit just under the windows for a little extra structural stability. The windows themselves are held up by screws that go into the hat channel, so the bars aren't necessary for support; we are hoping to fold some of the exterior sheet metal over them like they did with the original skin, though. We used a window and a sharpie to mark where they should sit, but I'm worried we may have made them a little too snug - the windows no longer fit with weather stripping on. We got the naked windows in, as shown in the picture above, but it's pretty tight. Hopefully, we can find enough room to make the fold work.

The rain we're getting today is supposed to continue into tomorrow, but Jonathan is coming back on Tuesday to help me start (hopefully) skinning the bus.

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Robin97396 · 04-23-2017, 12:01 PM

Nice work. That's going to turn out nice.

EastCoastCB · 04-23-2017, 12:35 PM

Very groovy, yall!

mysty · 04-23-2017, 02:37 PM

Also, a quick update on the composting toilet beta test, for anyone who's been wondering about such things...

I've had it sitting in our main bathroom for a few weeks now. As far as I know, I'm still the only one in the family who's been actually using it. I've emptied the "lemonade jug" a few times now, it's really not as bad as I was afraid it might be. Of course, the flushie is only about 2 feet away, so it's not like I'm carrying it any real distance.

The eco earth coconut dirt from the pet store has been working surprisingly well. Grant was brave enough to stick his face right down to the toilet and take a good whiff while he was here this weekend, and asked if I was sure there was actually any poop in there. There's really not a smell. (I mean, the bathroom still has a little odor when you actually go and right after, but that's how it is with a regular flushie. We keep some air freshener in the bathroom for a reason!)

There still hasn't been enough volume to justify emptying the compost yet. I blame my family for being too chicken to try it yet. I figure I'll take the bag out once it gets about halfway full?

-----

OK, as I was typing this, my 8 year old admitted that she has used it, too. I guess my hubby and the teenagers are the chickens!

mysty · 04-26-2017, 09:09 PM

Jonathan came over yesterday to help with the bus. It rained on Sunday and Monday, so unfortunately, quite a bit of flash rust had appeared on the new steel and welds. We spent most of yesterday cleaning it with wire brushes and hitting it with a bit of spray paint to help prevent further rust, then shopping for supplies to reskin the bus.

We initially planned to use rivets, but we weren't able to find the right sort and we don't have a decent air compressor so we'd have to do them all by hand. With that in mind, we decided to use self tapping screws instead. We also picked up a 30" metal brake - although once we got to skinning, we found it still wasn't big enough for the panels we had, so we ended up returning it and using pliers and an 18" bending bar instead.

Today we finally were able to starting putting skin on the bus. Yay! Our first challenge was figuring out how to bend the curves for the back end of the bus. We tried pulling the sheet metal around a pipe, but it didn't want to bend evenly. Next, we tried heating it with a heat gun and then pulling it around the pipe, but it had the same result. Finally, I grabbed one of my auto body hammers and tried working the metal around the edge of a piece of wood. By clamping the wood to a table and then tapping the metal around it, we got some pretty nice curves.

I reused the sheet metal that I pulled down from the ceiling, so I did run into some weirdness trying to make the panels fit. I was hoping it would be wide enough to span 3 windows so I could line it up with the existing rivets, but the ceiling panels were a few inches too short. The larger panels were just big enough to span two windows when turned sideways, so we made it work. It's not as pretty as I'd like, but eh, I'm hoping it won't be too noticeable once the bus is painted. We should be able to skin all but the front of the bus with the ceiling panels, so I'm considering it a win.

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Robin97396 · 04-26-2017, 10:02 PM

Nice progress. I'm jealous of your full height back door.

mysty · 04-27-2017, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robin97396

Nice progress. I'm jealous of your full height back door.

I can't tell you how happy I am not to be banging my head on the door frame every time I climb in and out of the back anymore.

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EastCoastCB · 04-27-2017, 11:27 AM

Yup, it feels GREAT to have the extra room to walk around with your head up high!

mysty · 04-29-2017, 02:29 PM

Jonathan went past the point of no return with the wiring, taking out the whole electrical console next to the driver's seat. After examining the controls, we determined that almost all of them were related to school bus specific functions and we won't be needing them. (4 way flashers, stop sign, crossing guard, heaters we already removed, etc.) The real test came when we started up the engine afterwards...

The bus started (hooray!), and the front turn signals and headlights still worked, plus the gauges on the dash, so we were feeling pretty good. Then I pointed out we weren't gaining any air pressure and the air governor never kicked in. Uh oh! After opening up the hood to make sure everything looked ok on the compressor itself, we went back and re-examined all the wiring. It turned out there was a blue wire with a red stripe that ran alongside the air hoses up under the dash that was labeled "test." We decided it likely went to the air governor, and reconnected the blue wire with a red stripe up at the electrical console and... the air gauge started moving again, and the usual hiss came out when we hit 120 psi. Insert huge sigh of relief.

We continued work on reskinning the bus, while Gwen kept busy prepping the exterior for priming.

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Njsurf73 · 04-29-2017, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mysty

Jonathan went past the point of no return with the wiring, taking out the whole electrical console next to the driver's seat. After examining the controls, we determined that almost all of them were related to school bus specific functions and we won't be needing them. (4 way flashers, stop sign, crossing guard, heaters we already removed, etc.) The real test came when we started up the engine afterwards...

The bus started (hooray!), and the front turn signals and headlights still worked, plus the gauges on the dash, so we were feeling pretty good. Then I pointed out we weren't gaining any air pressure and the air governor never kicked in. Uh oh! After opening up the hood to make sure everything looked ok on the compressor itself, we went back and re-examined all the wiring. It turned out there was a blue wire with a red stripe that ran alongside the air hoses up under the dash that was labeled "test." We decided it likely went to the air governor, and reconnected the blue wire with a red stripe up at the electrical console and... the air gauge started moving again, and the usual hiss came out when we hit 120 psi. Insert huge sigh of relief.

We continued work on reskinning the bus, while Gwen kept busy prepping the exterior for priming.

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Awesome.

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mysty · 04-29-2017, 08:05 PM

I will try to get some more pictures tomorrow, but I figured I should mention what we're using to reskin the bus. I know that from the factory, the exterior panels are riveted on, but I wasn't sure the pop rivets would hold up to the stress of vibrating and jostling down the road, and since I'm doing most of the work on my own, I was concerned about the man power required for more heavy duty rivets. I talked it over with Jonathan, and decided to go with some sort of adhesive plus self tapping screws.

After a little googling, I found that over and over reviews said to stay clear of adhesives like liquid nails for steel to steel bonding, and to use epoxy instead. I bought some loctite heavy duty epoxy from Home Depot and discovered it's a lot like working with fiberglass resin (although the ratio is an easier 1:1). With Jonathan's help, I'd already cut, bent, and dry fitted the panels, so it was simply a matter of mixing the epoxy, slathering it onto the hat channel, then putting the panels back up and clamping them in place while we put a few screws in.

I bought some phillips pan head self tapping screws from Home Depot, but they were having a hard time getting through the thicker steel of the channel. After tiring ourselves on with just a few of those, we drove to Fastenal and bought some #10 phillips pan head screws that had a more aggressive thread to bite into the metal a little more. We also picked up some 1/4" Norseman drill bits. They weren't tin coated, but the guy at Fastenal assured us they were quality bits that could take some abuse. He wasn't kidding! Compared to the Milwaukee "heavy metal" bit that gave out after drilling just 13 holes, these things drilled out dozens and dozens before the first one finally snapped. (I bought 4 bits, so still have 3 remaining.)

I know the point of self tapping screws is to not have to drill pilot holes, but the pan heads don't have quite the power that their hex head equivalents do - however, they more closely resemble the domed shape of the existing rivets, so I stuck with them for aesthetic reasons. Predrilling doesn't take THAT long, and the screws go in much easier.

J had to return home yesterday, so I'm going to finish up the reskinning with one of my lovely assistants to help get the panels in place and clamped before the epoxy hardens.

I am going to need to buy one piece of sheet metal to reskin the front of the bus above the windshield. Since I was able to reskin the rest of the bus with the ceiling panels, I feel pretty good about it.

Robin97396 · 04-29-2017, 08:39 PM

Nice progress. Reusing the interior panels is a good idea. All my panels were perforated, but I'll find a use for them somewhere.

mysty · 04-29-2017, 11:06 PM

Yeah, solid panels in the ceiling were one of the benefits of the bus I ended up buying. A few of the others I looked at were perforated. There are still screw holes all along some of the edges (where the panels were screwed to the ribs) that I'll need to fill in. J suggested Bondo, but I'm not sure that's the best route. Would the "bondo hair" filler work?

Robin97396 · 04-29-2017, 11:41 PM

Yeah the hair filler works, until it rains.

Several of us have wondered about using the perforated panels over the windows to cut down on sun in hotter areas but the panels aren't quite wide enough to cover the windows in buses with the taller windows.

mysty · 05-02-2017, 01:21 PM

Lesson of the day - don't forget ear protection! I am trying to get the exterior stripped, sanded, and prepped for priming, so I'm spending lots of quality time with a grinder and wheel brush plus a sander/polisher. The sander is actually not so bad, but the grinder vibrates like crazy and is really, really loud. So now I've been sitting inside for about 15 minutes and my hands are STILL buzzing and my ears are STILL ringing. (Not sure what to do for my hands, but I should have really known better than to grind without ear protection!)

Anyway, we're making progress, but it feels so slow! Does everyone else just paint over the yellow? I was worried my paint job would look bad if I didn't strip the old paint first - you can still see old lettering under the paint, so they must have repainted the bus at least once before, and I didn't want two sets of lettering showing through my new paint job. (The top layer was vinyl, which I pulled off, but I'm pretty sure the older lettering was stenciled on with paint.)

Also, I want to go ahead and prime the bus now to protect the metal and to get it looking less "school bus" and more "rv-ish" (someone finally called the county on us, and while I'm not technically violating the no commercial vehicle code, the officer said it still looks like a school bus, so that's an issue...), but I don't want to do the final paint job until I figure out where my access panels are going for things I plan to put under the bus. Is it ok to leave it simply primed for a few weeks?

Robin97396 · 05-02-2017, 01:36 PM

It's ok to leave it primed for a few weeks, but you'll probably have to sand lightly before putting on your final paint job. The primer dries out enough over a short period of time that the next coat of paint doesn't stick well simply applied on top of a well dried coat of paint. The best adhesion to the primer would occur within hours after applying the primer. I was always told to put on the top coat of paint two or three hours after the primer was applied to insure very good adhesion.
Then again I'm not a paint guy. Free advise is worth what you pay for it.

mysty · 05-03-2017, 01:55 PM

Oh boy, I kind of stumped the local sheet metal fabricators...
I called about some metal for the front end of the bus, but they aren't able to fold the top of the metal around the curve of the roofline without it buckling. They said they can probably do a hammerlock seam to connect a strip of metal at a 90 degree angle to the edge, and then solder it together, but that's going to take some hours of labor and will end up costing around $300.

They suggested we might be able to spot weld a strip to the edge and then weld the seam up? I'm not sure how pretty that would be, and they don't do welding.

I'm still wondering if my diy idea would work - cut the sheet a little bigger than we need, then make cuts into the curve to create tabs and fold them down into a flange. Then I could cover them with fiberglass to smooth the corners and make it all watertight.

Any thoughts?

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