Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 05-11-2016, 04:57 PM   #1
Skoolie
 
New2Skool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bemidji MN
Posts: 209
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Carpenter Body
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65 to Zero. Folding Chair
Post Floor Replacement

Hello All,

My next question is about the rusted, wavy, flimsy first floor panel.
The section below the Driver's seat to the stairway.
It is in pretty rough shape.

I have a 4'x10' 10g sheet of steel and I would like to remove and replace that first panel.

I would like to pull it up, add angle iron, tubing anything I need to reinforce that entire section before replacing it.

Is this a good idea?
Any suggestions?

Thanks
__________________
D.L. Jones III
"The Independence"
98 International
New2Skool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 05:18 PM   #2
Bus Geek
 
Robin97396's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Willamina, Oregon
Posts: 6,409
Coachwork: 97 Bluebird TC1000 5.9
Do you know that you don't need to start a different thread every time you move on to a new part of your project? Most people have one ongoing thread throughout their build.
Robin97396 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 05:35 PM   #3
Skoolie
 
New2Skool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bemidji MN
Posts: 209
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Carpenter Body
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65 to Zero. Folding Chair
I did not, sorry.
__________________
D.L. Jones III
"The Independence"
98 International
New2Skool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 06:06 PM   #4
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: The Valley - Arizona
Posts: 644
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freight-shaker (Freightliner)
Engine: Cat 3126b 250 HP
Rated Cap: Only 1 seat
Post some pics of it if you can, the top and the bottom would be most helpful.

-Doc
Docsgsxr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 06:23 PM   #5
Skoolie
 
New2Skool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bemidji MN
Posts: 209
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Carpenter Body
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65 to Zero. Folding Chair
Pictures

Here we go.

Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

These are the primary problem rust areas.

Any suggestions would he helpful.

Thanks
__________________
D.L. Jones III
"The Independence"
98 International
New2Skool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 06:36 PM   #6
Bus Nut
 
BurlKing's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 502
Year: 92
Coachwork: Thomas Built
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 5.9L
Rated Cap: 77
I'll be glad to help a fellow Minnesotan out! we both got a model 3800 yours is new but floor looks the exact same, my drivers area actually had the least rust. wheel well section in the back was the worst for me. they are all about 9 1/2" c-channel pieces butted up next to each other and the riveted along the legs of the "C" other than that big piece for the drivers area. so i tore out the bad stuff and replaced it with square tubing over the two main beams of the chassis (with rubber padding in between the tubing and frame) then made a frame work with small angle iron in between the square tubing and laid 11Gauge metal on top. it worked great but you may find any easier way. So im assuming you could just do the same up front and then put that big sheet you got on top of the tubing. it is in between pages 9-12 in my build i believe if you want to check it out.


http://www.skoolie.net/forums/f11/92...tar-11151.html


Some quick pictures, more in the build.


BurlKing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 06:41 PM   #7
Bus Geek
 
Robin97396's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Willamina, Oregon
Posts: 6,409
Coachwork: 97 Bluebird TC1000 5.9
You're making some impressive progress.
Robin97396 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 09:42 PM   #8
Skoolie
 
New2Skool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bemidji MN
Posts: 209
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Carpenter Body
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65 to Zero. Folding Chair
Smile Minnesota

Hi Burl King,
I am glad to find another 3800 in the same region.
I have seen tons of flat nose bluebirds and the 3800's Ive seen have always been from the southern half of the country.

You knocked that floor work out of the park.
Good job.

The floor panels on my bus are huge. As wide as the bus and they appear to be 3 to 4 feet long sections. So we differ in that way but, I am follow your example and patch them up.

I had to ask because, I wanted to remove the lower interior wall section / chair rail but was told by several it was structural and to leave it.

So, I was worried if I popped a floor panel out it would end up being structural and my bus would fold in half. You did a very good job with your floor replacement and it will save me a lot of time and research.

Thank you.

I am assuming you are located in the cities or Iron range.

This evening I pulled 90% of the wiring from the control panel to the front and rear of the compartment. It was easy, the most time was removing the dead wires one at a time since, they were twisted together.

Another quick question;
Should, I focus on the floor and rust removal first or lift the roof?

Thanks,
DLJIII
__________________
D.L. Jones III
"The Independence"
98 International
New2Skool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 10:04 PM   #9
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: The Valley - Arizona
Posts: 644
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freight-shaker (Freightliner)
Engine: Cat 3126b 250 HP
Rated Cap: Only 1 seat
Do the floor first. When you raise the roof and add panels, it will be heavier to lift if you need structural replacement as bulking did. That is exactly what I have to do to my Thomas MVP ER.
Docsgsxr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 10:14 PM   #10
Skoolie
 
New2Skool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bemidji MN
Posts: 209
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Carpenter Body
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65 to Zero. Folding Chair
That makes perfect sense.
Thank you,
To be honest, I have been very eager to start the lift.
Rather than doing rust removal.
Thanks
__________________
D.L. Jones III
"The Independence"
98 International
New2Skool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 10:41 PM   #11
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado
Posts: 57
Year: 1999
Chassis: Thomas
Engine: Cat 3126 7.2 / Allison AT545
Rated Cap: 77 Passenger
BurlKing,

Looks like you have done exactly what I need to do with my floor (bus came from MN) thanks for the example!!!
PoolRoom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2016, 11:04 PM   #12
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 12,542
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
wouldnt you want to do the floors before you cut the supports for the raise? this way you dont have a bus in flux where the body could flex or distort as youve cut the structruals for the raise and then take the floor out...

I would want to make my floors solid first and then do the raise.. your new floors active as more structural integrity against body flex.
-Christopher
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2016, 07:50 AM   #13
Skoolie
 
New2Skool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bemidji MN
Posts: 209
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Carpenter Body
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65 to Zero. Folding Chair
Yes, I never thought about the flexing during the lift.
Thank you guys.
__________________
D.L. Jones III
"The Independence"
98 International
New2Skool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2016, 11:33 AM   #14
Bus Geek
 
Tango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 8,462
Year: 1946
Coachwork: Chevrolet/Wayne
Chassis: 1- 1/2 ton
Engine: Cummins 4BT
Rated Cap: 15
Once cut free, a bus roof wants to relax any tension that is built into them. It is highly recommended that substantial cross bracing be tack welded side to side before cutting. Some buses barely move and others can torque so far out of shape it is nearly impossible to ever get them to line up properly again. It can vary greatly from brand to brand. My old BB, which I raised 19", had some cross bracing and I still had to do a lot of work to get it lined up right. Should have used more.
Tango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2016, 11:38 AM   #15
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 12,542
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tango View Post
Once cut free, a bus roof wants to relax any tension that is built into them. It is highly recommended that substantial cross bracing be tack welded side to side before cutting. Some buses barely move and others can torque so far out of shape it is nearly impossible to ever get them to line up properly again. It can vary greatly from brand to brand. My old BB, which I raised 19", had some cross bracing and I still had to do a lot of work to get it lined up right. Should have used more.

wow!! that one I wouldve never known or thought of!. the metal staying "loaded" after 10+ years on a bus.

-Christopher
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2016, 11:52 AM   #16
Bus Geek
 
Tango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 8,462
Year: 1946
Coachwork: Chevrolet/Wayne
Chassis: 1- 1/2 ton
Engine: Cummins 4BT
Rated Cap: 15
Blue Birds have one-piece roof ribs that run from below the floor on one side to below the floor on the other. The sheet metal is then attached by wrapping it down around the ribs and getting riveted in place. The resulting tension makes the ribs and sheet metal want to splay outward when it is cut free.

There are other makes that use bolted together, multi-piece ribs and slightly different manufacturing techniques so they can react differently. I figure it is easier to assume it will move, tack it, and thereby avoid having to try and crank forty feet and a thousand pounds of free floating steel back into shape.
Tango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2016, 07:20 PM   #17
Bus Crazy
 
Stu & Filo. T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Vacaville, Ca
Posts: 1,624
Year: 1988
Coachwork: Crown / Pusher
Engine: 8.3 Cummins
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tango View Post
Once cut free, a bus roof wants to relax any tension that is built into them. It is highly recommended that substantial cross bracing be tack welded side to side before cutting. Some buses barely move and others can torque so far out of shape it is nearly impossible to ever get them to line up properly again. It can vary greatly from brand to brand. My old BB, which I raised 19", had some cross bracing and I still had to do a lot of work to get it lined up right. Should have used more.
I used cargo straps cinched down in
Between each rib, didn't have any movement.
Stu & Filo. T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2016, 08:02 PM   #18
Bus Geek
 
EastCoastCB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 19,876
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu & Filo. T View Post
I used cargo straps cinched down in
Between each rib, didn't have any movement.
DO you have any pics of that? Thanks!
__________________
.
Roll Your Own Build Thread
EastCoastCB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2016, 08:24 PM   #19
Bus Crazy
 
Stu & Filo. T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Vacaville, Ca
Posts: 1,624
Year: 1988
Coachwork: Crown / Pusher
Engine: 8.3 Cummins
Quote:
Originally Posted by EastCoastCB View Post
DO you have any pics of that? Thanks!
On my home computer, at work now don't have them on my iPad
Stu & Filo. T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2016, 09:11 PM   #20
Skoolie
 
New2Skool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Bemidji MN
Posts: 209
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Carpenter Body
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65 to Zero. Folding Chair
Ribs

Since, everyone has mentioned it.
I am concerned about roof movement during the lift.
I watched a guy on youtube lift the roof and he used all thread bolts and car jacks.
Which is what I planned to do but, he had a blue bird and I have a carpenter international.

I ordered metal for the exterior skin to complete the lift.
I ordered 1x1 angle iron and believe it came in 20 foot lengths for something like $22.
1x1 tubing in 24 foot length was $19 so I have the material to tact all of the ribs together.
I could easily order more steel to create the rib extensions.

It would be easy in my mind, I can weld well enough to do most things and make them worth a few bucks.

While we are on the subject, I know Burlking has an international 3800 but, has anyone with a 3800 completed a lift?

If so, what should I expect for movement and flex in the roof?

My ribs have thinner sheet steel ribs connecting the primary ribs together horizontally.

What do you think would be the best course of action?
__________________
D.L. Jones III
"The Independence"
98 International
New2Skool is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
floor, flooring, removal, rust, seat

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:01 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×