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Old 08-05-2014, 11:05 AM   #121
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

While I personally believe that the constitution gives every american the right to bear arms and that means I or my weapons shouldn't have to be permitted or registered etc, that belief has nothing to do with the "real" world.

Your #1 line of defense is the ability to LEAVE. Always park in a manner that will allow you to leave quickly. Avoid the dangerous areas or places that your instincts tell you is a questionable area. If you get new neighbours that creep you (or your spouse) and you are alone.... leave out (if they ask, tell them you have an emergency or you are meeting up with a friend in another area). If you are with a female who normally isn't freaked out over new places, ask her how she feels about a place. Women usually have good instincts. Usually, not always.
This post is my opinion. It is not intended to influence anyone's judgment nor do I advocate anyone do what I propose.
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Old 08-05-2014, 11:39 AM   #122
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

Unfortunately most folks have NO bloody idea (anymore...) about the WHY of the constitution!
The Right to bear arms has nothing to do with PERSONAL defense (as it is portrayed today...), but as a means for "the people" to defend themselves as a people/community against a government that turned against its people!

I am certainly not a specialist on American History, but I did read up on the Constitutional points just because of the gun-debate....

Unfortunately, the Constitution is abused as a lousy excuse for the arms industry to sell more - that's all there is!
NRA is not helping either by being paranoid about "impending total arms prohibition" (which would be a big mistake, like in Australia....)
If NRA would promote PROPER arms posession, stupid things would eliminate themselves...
Number one/two thing is a thorough background check for anyone wanting to buy/own a fire arm and a psychological assessment! And that's pretty much the only things needed!!
What's a few days waiting to clear your record and off you go with whatever you want to carry?
And most folks, that have the proper mindset will pass both and should be allowed to carry whatever they want!
Then you don't need a dis-functional 10-round mag limit, etc....
You could even have people own full-auto asault rifles, they wouldn't be used unless REALLY needed.....

As it is (...not verified), I understand all I need is an ID (US citizens only!) and I can walk out of a gun shop with at least a revolver? WTF??

Anyway, as Lorna said, the first line of defense is keeping the ability to LEAVE/RUN!

All this discussion about arming up and fortifying the bus - for me - is all about giving myself (and my passengers...) a chance to get back to the point where I have the LEAVE/RUN option again - ...because I missed the window in the first place....
If in the process of getting back to that point, the agressive party decides that it is not worth their trouble to pursue their agression - even better!

Now, fire away!

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Old 08-05-2014, 01:10 PM   #123
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

Unfortunately, 2nd Amendment support is like 1st Amendment support. Either you support all sides of it, the good, the bad, the warts and all, or it will slowly be chipped away and then you have nothing. Like England or Australia or... Germany pre-NAZI and during NAZI. Sucks. But tothat is why the NRA is so horn-dog about anything possibly smelling like potential gun control or other such carp.

One of the early defenses of the 2nd Amendment in the Supreme Court brought up the "militia" aspect of it. Someone pointed out that militia use of a pos low power weapon is useless, while a cannon or rapid fire gun is definitely within the militia profile. Case quietly dropped

Best way to get oneself out of the deep cracky is to have the mindset that once everything goes south, one will act morally, logically and swiftly to bring oneself and those around to a position of stability and security and freedom. This may mean that things that normally are distasteful, like shooting someone, cutting or chopping them, stabbing them, setting fire to them, killing them, have to become the norm until "normalicy" returns. (I know, preachy, preachy, preachy.)

So, basically, you either load for bear and prepare to put bear 6' under, even if you don't ever need to, or you can surround yourself with less-than-lethal crap and go under when the Huns pour over the walls. Sorry, a bang-bang gun has more emotional stopping power than a nail or a paint-ball gun. By using a "real" weapon, vs a hocked together thingy, you will have infinitely more power than a Home-Depot Warrior.

Bleh. Much easier as Lorna says to boot scoot and boogie outa harm's way before too things go bad.

From what I have read in the forums most skoolies when they are skooling tend to plan ahead and stock up on basic supplies. They tend to check weather and road conditions before leaving. They tend to plan on large amounts of fuel storage and water storages so they can live off-grid, even if all they ever do is to go to a campground and hook up.

This puts them ahead of 95% of the sheep out there.

Most of them want to get out away from the deep-cracky and go to some place quiet. Again, this puts them ahead of the sheeple in a big way.

If you are truly worried about bad people out there, don't vacation in cities, don't vacation along any of our or your boarders, don't vacation in any democratically controlled state.

Bleh. I want my skoolie and I wanna go away!
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Old 08-05-2014, 04:45 PM   #124
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

We certainly do agree on most all posted!

The discussion (for me at least...) is all about the 5% of time one screwed up with the LEAVE/RUN window or things are getting out of hand anyway.

As said - with some common-sense-looking-ahead planning that should be possible.....

I also agree, that I would certainly prefer the arsenal of my choice incl. the nasty ammunition - ....HOWEVER, I plan to travel and see the continents, north and south, so chances are I won't be back in the same corner anytime soon after passing through (which might take a few month, if I like the place - hell! ...might get stuck there, who knows! But the plan is to slowly see it all...) - so, the nice arsenal (that I probably could assemble for a few select states...) is not going to happen, goin' south from the US even less so.

The alternative is to tap into toys and tools and make them do......which may by no means be cheaper - quite possibly can be more expensive than real fire-arms...

Tools&Toys are just a way to go, IF the real deal is not available for travel.....


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Old 08-07-2014, 02:39 PM   #125
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

Fun thread, I like hypothetical stuff.

My thoughts after reading about everyone wanting to defend from ballistics? You're gonna need a bigger chassis to carry all your armor.

The Multi3 FSA is based on a Man Kat 8x8 chassis. Armored cab - occupant height reduces injuries from IED and mines. The chassis is large and powerful enough to carry living quarters.

The living quarters cabin is fabricated from steel armor plate, ceramic liner and aramid flat sheet spall shield. It might end up being 5-10 inches thick, but them's the breaks. Keep windows to a minimum. You'd probably want to give it some nice angles to deflect the energy, so take some notes from the buffalo MRAP and the LAK bodies on Ural trucks.

So, you've certainly traded fuel economy, practicality, and comfort for protection. You're still vulnerable to HEAT rounds, so perhaps so reactive or slat armor around the outside to give you a fighting chance.

What have we built? Something a little like this little guy, but even bigger:

Now the trick would be to not draw attention from every bad guy in a 100 kilometer radius. Perhaps you can get a vehicle wrap made to look like a prevost, it might fool a few people.
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Old 08-07-2014, 05:00 PM   #126
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

Never mind the Prevost. I want my vehicle wrap to look like the Little Guy!!!
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Old 08-16-2014, 09:12 AM   #127
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

Well, guys,

if the military gear is wanted/required - what/why are we talking skoolie?
There is plenty of heavy off-road gear out there, but as stated "your mileage may vary!" - [as in "suck".....]

Seriously, if you need "Little Guy"-equipment you are driving in the wrong COUNTRY - not just in the wrong neighborhood!

As also stated, the idea is to have a chance to get back to the point where you missed the chance to run or just took the wrong turn.
If the goin' gets hot, I would expect some damage to the bus, as long as I get AWAY!

So, I am not talking heavy armor, but possibly some way to slow down rounds enough to not penetrate all the way through the bus - does anyone know about some fabric that would "fishnet" rounds? Hang it somewhat loose between the outer body panels and the insulation - round comes through the body panel - hits the fabric - drags it along and gets slowed to a stop within a few inches of travel....

I think the same goes for the film-on-window technic....

Once the bad guys use real high-power gear, you didn't take a wrong turn or missed the run-away spot - you are on a LIST and will certainly need even something better than the "Little Guy"....

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Old 08-16-2014, 08:17 PM   #128
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

Originally Posted by thjakits
. . . . does anyone know about some fabric that would "fishnet" rounds? Hang it somewhat loose between the outer body panels and the insulation - round comes through the body panel - hits the fabric - drags it along and gets slowed to a stop within a few inches of travel....
You might check around junkyards for old cop cars . . after the shoot-out in California a few years back, "ballistic panels" were an available option to be added inside the doors of CVPI (Crown Vics) and Special Service Tahoes to provide cover in a shoot-out. I can't speak for other models, but I don't think they've been available on Dodge Chargers. If they haven't been peeled off, modified doors have a little white circle label on the inside panel advising the occupants that the doors will provide cover.

Most rounds will go through an un-modified door. In one city, I saw a used door in storage that had been deliberately shot at in a police pistol range, and the various sized holes were marked with a sharpie to educate the officers what type of rounds had penetrated the door. That door made me a believer in 00 buckshot.

If you are really concerned about this, buy yourself a couple of the modified doors, take them apart, and re-purpose at least a panel or two below the Skoolie's driver's window. That way, you won't take one in the side from across the street during your escape, driving while peeking through the steering wheel spokes like the proverbial little old lady.

These panels won't help for shots from the sidewalk if you have the standard glass doors, but PapaBear who started this thread almost 5 years ago did close up his front entrance and install a navigator's seat. A side entry was constructed further back.
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Old 08-31-2014, 09:29 PM   #129
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

Although I highly doubt it, I hope most folks will come to realize exactly WHAT the NRA really is and why they exist. I was a card carrying member back in the late 70's, and back then they were selling the same line of bull that they are today. They've been telling you that the government is coming to take your guns away from you since FOREVER! Yet when you look around today, IF you're old enough to remember, and of course only IF you are intellectually honest enough to admit it, in the U.S. as a whole, there are FEWER laws controlling gun ownership today than there were 30 years ago.

The cogent point to understand is this: The leadership of the NRA has set for itself the goal of making itself, first and foremost, into a powerful political machine whose sole purpose is to be able to WIELD THAT POWER, to influence elections and in essence set themselves up as powerful political brokers, kingmakers if you will, while their purported function as a protector of gun rights is a distant second. A little research will show that the NRA has often backed candidates running against incumbents/candidates who have had 100% ratings according to their own rating system, but they consistently backed more extreme conservatives simply because for them it's about POLITICS not about protecting gun rights.

Their constant fear mongering is strictly a propaganda tool to allow them to CONTROL avid gun owners and squeeze $$$ out of them by keeping them fearful of some imagined government conspiracy to take away ALL GUNS, right down to cap-guns. And it is a lie. There never has been any such secret conspiracy. But that's what they want you to believe so that they can control you, take your money, and tell you how to vote. Been that way as long as I can remember. And the sad thing is that they won't even back the simplest of common sense legislation, legislation that over 80% of the population supports like background checks that would make sure criminals and foreign terrorists can't buy guns (or closing the gun show loopholes for the same reasons). Here's the rundown:

-- 90 percent of Americans and 90 percent of gun owners support fixing gaps in government databases that are meant to prevent the mentally ill, drug abusers and others from buying guns.
-- 91 percent of Americans and 93 percent of gun owners support requiring federal agencies to share information about suspected dangerous persons or terrorists to prevent them from buying guns.
-- 89 percent of Americans and 89 percent of gun owners support full funding of the law a unanimous Congress passed and President George W. Bush signed after the Virginia Tech shootings to put more records in the background-check database.
-- 86 percent of Americans and 81 percent of gun owners support requiring all gun buyers to pass a background check, no matter where they buy the gun and no matter who they buy it from.
-- 89 percent of Americans and 85 percent of gun owners support a law to require background checks for all guns sold at gun shows.
In terms of protecting Second Amendment rights, 79 percent of Americans and 90 percent of gun owners said they believe an individual has the right to own guns, and the amendment is not limited to protecting the rights of state militias. Eighty percent of Americans and 90 percent of gun owners oppose a law that would ban the sale of all handguns.

REALLY SIMPLE STUFF RIGHT , but the NRA refuses to back any of this common sense legislation. Why? Because they are not here to help - it's not on their agenda - their only tactic is to oppose and stall ALL gun control legislation so that when election time comes it will to be a continual battle that they can then point to and explain to all the fearful gun fanatics that SEE, this is the secret government conspiracy we keep warning you about, this is how it starts, BE AFRAID because once these laws are passed, THEN they'll come for your assault rifles, and then your hunting rifles and then your handguns, BE VERY AFRAID, RUN, SCURRY, FLEE, FLEE! And like a bunch of puppets on a string, the gun fanatics dance to the NRA's bidding, forking over their $$$ and voting for hard-line nutbags, what a bunch of gomers, I swear, lol. But the clueless will remain so, forever, it's just in their nature.

BTW, if you think that the NRA is responsible for saving gun ownership in America, reread the underlined part in that list of polling. See that bit about "79 percent of Americans" being completely in favor of private gun ownership? THAT is what is keeping gun control laws in check NOT THE NRA. Only 5% of gun owners are actually card-carrying members and only about 30% of Americans even know much if anything about the NRA. Their biggest influence comes from bullying candidates with threats of opposition to their candidacy, or from the MOSTLY FALSE adds they pay for during elections, although judging from the results, they are pretty bad at picking winners, lol.

Though it spent nearly $11 million on the 2012 election, the National Rifle Association saw less than 1 percent of its money go toward its desired result, according to the Sunlight Foundation—a nonpartisan group that uses data to promote government transparency.
While the NRA supported 27 winning candidates, it used the majority of its donated funds to target Democrats, most of whom wound up defeating their Republican rivals.
According to the Sunlight's data, the gun rights group doled out nearly $9 million to oppose Democrats, spending nearly $7.5 million to run ads opposing Barack Obama alone.

But unfortunately as long as the sheeple keep funneling money to them, the NRA can continue to scare Republican politicians into voting against even the most sensible of legislation (even when 80% of their own party are in favor of it) . That's why we need to get money out of politics, but that's another debate altogether, lol.

Ahh drat, I let myself get sucked into another political debate, lol, I think I need to go to rehab or something...


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Old 08-31-2014, 09:49 PM   #130
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Re: Fortifiying Your Bus Against Intruders Or Attack?

Relax Lightfoot,

same old, same old!!

For me there will be no chance to carry anyway - I am not American.
In my country of residence I can carry whatever I like, though it is hard to get 10mm amo, but for my 9mm - no problem.
Detailed background check, psychological check, etc., renew every 5 years....

However to travel through most Latin countries, I will depend on the "Alternate Equipment" mentioned earlier.... - if I get to it!


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