Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 11-18-2017, 08:17 PM   #1
Bus Crazy
 
Drew Bru's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Grayson County, VA
Posts: 1,428
Year: 1996
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65
How to seal Leaking Windows?

Hey all. Our windows are leaking like sieves! It's especially bad in heavy, continuous rain. They've been removed and reinstalled by the previous owner, but it didn't seem to really "take". He used silicone caulk and there was weatherstripping around the perimeter. Not sure exactly where the water is coming in, but I've tried sealing the outside of the windows and at this point I think I'm ready to just pull them, scrape off the old, and reseal them. I did this with one window today and it wasn't too terrible of a job. So, a couple quick questions.

What sealant should I use? From what I've read, my main choices seem to be Butyl Tape (or gutter/butyl caulk?) Thermoplastic Elastometric Sealant or possibly a Polyurethane Window/Siding Sealant.


Do I need weatherstripping? The face of the window-frame mates with the rib-frame of the bus. I'm pretty sure it was a flush-mating sort of fit. The bottom of the window rests on the bus frame.

My gut tells me I should scrape out all of the silicone and weatherstripping (to have clean metal surfaces) and slather a TON of sealant around the perimeter, with a nice heavy bed of sealant for the bottom of the window to set into. I don't care how many tubes of sealant I use, I just don't want to have to do it twice! I don't know if I need weatherstripping or not.

We can't really move forward with our plans until we get this thing water tight.

Thoughts, suggestions, advice? What have you guys done, what has worked for you?

Thanks,
-Drew

Drew Bru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2017, 08:23 PM   #2
Bus Geek
 
EastCoastCB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 23,762
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
Take the windows out, clean all the crappily applied sealant off, apply new seam sealer.
3M Dynatron 550 is what I'd use.
EastCoastCB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2017, 08:27 PM   #3
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Owasso, OK
Posts: 2,627
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Saf-T-Liner MVP ER
Engine: Cummins 6CTA8.3 Mechanical MD3060
Rated Cap: 46 Coach Seats, 40 foot
Yeah, I wouldn't let silicone anywhere near the bus.

Once it's there, be very careful to remove all traces or nothing else will stick.
__________________
Steve Bracken

Build Thread
Twigg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 06:41 AM   #4
Bus Crazy
 
Drew Bru's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Grayson County, VA
Posts: 1,428
Year: 1996
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by EastCoastCB View Post
Take the windows out, clean all the crappily applied sealant off, apply new seam sealer.
3M Dynatron 550 is what I'd use.
Weatherstripping? Yeah? No? I'm thinking not.

Also, at the bottom of the window and especially in the bottom corners is where the water seems to be coming in. Any idea how to deal with this? I'd planned on using a generous amount of sealer to embed the bottom window frame. Is this a sound idea?
Drew Bru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 09:26 AM   #5
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Winlcok, WA
Posts: 2,233
Butyl rubber caulk tape will be your most affordable option. It is inexpensive and easy to use.

When you take the windows out you will need to make sure every vestige of the silicone is removed or you will be doing the whole process over again.

I can't tell very well from the picture but if your bus body is an AmTrans from the mid-'80's to the early-'00's the windows used by AmTrans were pretty poorly built and installed. We had some brand new AmTrans buses in the mid-80's that had windows that leaked from day one.
cowlitzcoach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 09:39 AM   #6
Bus Crazy
 
Drew Bru's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Grayson County, VA
Posts: 1,428
Year: 1996
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by cowlitzcoach View Post
Butyl rubber caulk tape will be your most affordable option. It is inexpensive and easy to use.

When you take the windows out you will need to make sure every vestige of the silicone is removed or you will be doing the whole process over again.

I can't tell very well from the picture but if your bus body is an AmTrans from the mid-'80's to the early-'00's the windows used by AmTrans were pretty poorly built and installed. We had some brand new AmTrans buses in the mid-80's that had windows that leaked from day one.

The bus is a 1996 Amtran. There was weatherstripping on the bus frame and I'm not sure if that was factory-installed or added later. It may have been butyl rubber tape, I'm not certain.....it had an adhesive backing that made it look like regular weatherstipping tape though.

Any other tips, Cowlitzcoach, on resealing these things especially the bottoms and bottom corners?
Drew Bru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 12:11 PM   #7
Bus Crazy
 
Mountain Gnome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 1,222
Year: 1999
Coachwork: BlueBird
Chassis: TC1000 HandyBus
Engine: 5.9L 24V-L6 Cummins ISB
Rated Cap: 26 foot
I was just thinking about my window leaks as I logged in...

I must pass on this advice from an auto body-repair pro. As mentioned above, never use silicone to seal your bus, or any metal surface for that matter.

Silicone absorbs moisture from the atmosphere, and holds it internally. Sure it repels volumes of water, but even when not raining, it is holding water against the surface it adheres to. If the surface is metal, it will corrode/rust. This is also why the silicone water sealant in bathtubs always turns black with mold stains. The mold is in the silicone, not on it (spray it with hydrogen peroxide @ $1.50/bottle using a atomizer screw-on top spray-head after each shower, and it will turn white again).

I learned that unfortunately after I re-sealed the windows in my 1977 Dodge Tradesman hightop conversion van with acrylic-silicone window-sealant for homes. (Love the styling on that old one...) I was told use only black urethane window sealant. Polyurethane I think is more adhesive and firmer, and will be harder to remove in the future, but I don't know for sure. Maybe good for house siding and window frames, but vehicles vibrate and flex, and tend to be dismantled and reassembled in the future, whereas houses are gutted and all-new materials are used.

Also, polyurethane glue for wood can cure faster and stronger when the surfaces are exposed to water and damp. Does that mean polyurethane is also water-absorbent like silicone? I don't know.
Mountain Gnome is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 12:35 PM   #8
Bus Geek
 
Tango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 8,462
Year: 1946
Coachwork: Chevrolet/Wayne
Chassis: 1- 1/2 ton
Engine: Cummins 4BT
Rated Cap: 15
I do know that most Urethane glues (like Gorilla Glue) are rated as 100% waterproof as it is CG approved for use "below the waterline".

But the best material I have found for long term sealing is OEM grade automotive "Seam Sealer". Any number of brands available, I use the 3M variety. It stays flexible, will last for many decades and is totally waterproof. Sticks like crazy to just about anything but check the manufacturer's specs for any particulars.
Tango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 12:41 PM   #9
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Greenwood, Indiana
Posts: 669
Year: 1999
Coachwork: New Flyer
Chassis: D45HF "Viking"
Engine: 11.1L Detroit Diesel S60
Rated Cap: 51,600
Funny, I was thinking about my leaking windows, too. Good information - I'm going to use the seam seal / 3M stuff.
MarkyDee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 12:57 PM   #10
Bus Geek
 
Tango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 8,462
Year: 1946
Coachwork: Chevrolet/Wayne
Chassis: 1- 1/2 ton
Engine: Cummins 4BT
Rated Cap: 15
The 3M is not cheap but it works. It is the same material as what Detroit & Japan use to hold cars together and weatherproof all metal to metal seams on their cars. Also sticks perfectly well to glass, but most use a slightly different formulation for windshields and such that is more easily removable.

Just make sure to get any surfaces absolutely clean first. Just like painting, prep is critical to success. Alcohol as a final wipe down is good but again, check the manufacturer's recommendations.
Tango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 02:46 PM   #11
Bus Crazy
 
Drew Bru's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Grayson County, VA
Posts: 1,428
Year: 1996
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tango View Post
The 3M is not cheap but it works. It is the same material as what Detroit & Japan use to hold cars together and weatherproof all metal to metal seams on their cars. Also sticks perfectly well to glass, but most use a slightly different formulation for windshields and such that is more easily removable.

Just make sure to get any surfaces absolutely clean first. Just like painting, prep is critical to success. Alcohol as a final wipe down is good but again, check the manufacturer's recommendations.

I think I'm leaning toward the 3M Dynatron 550, as I can get it locally at Autozone. I don't know how much I should plan on buying. Any ideas? Super sticky and eternally pliable seems like it's probably the key for sealing windows.

I looked at the window this afternoon and noticed there's a lip at the edge where the frame of the bus meets the frame of the window, and it leaves a 1/8" gap.....seems like that's probably the entry point for water
Drew Bru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 05:43 PM   #12
Bus Geek
 
EastCoastCB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 23,762
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew Bru View Post
I think I'm leaning toward the 3M Dynatron 550, as I can get it locally at Autozone. I don't know how much I should plan on buying. Any ideas? Super sticky and eternally pliable seems like it's probably the key for sealing windows.

I looked at the window this afternoon and noticed there's a lip at the edge where the frame of the bus meets the frame of the window, and it leaves a 1/8" gap.....seems like that's probably the entry point for water
At least a few tubes. I've used it and its good stuff and easy to use.
EastCoastCB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 06:07 PM   #13
Bus Crazy
 
Drew Bru's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Grayson County, VA
Posts: 1,428
Year: 1996
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by EastCoastCB View Post
At least a few tubes. I've used it and its good stuff and easy to use.
Good, cuz I just order 12 online after not finding any in stock locally.

Psssst, hey kid wanna buy some sealer?
Drew Bru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 06:20 PM   #14
Bus Geek
 
EastCoastCB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 23,762
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew Bru View Post
Good, cuz I just order 12 online after not finding any in stock locally.

Psssst, hey kid wanna buy some sealer?
How much per tube? $15 at autozone.
EastCoastCB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 06:52 PM   #15
Bus Crazy
 
Drew Bru's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Grayson County, VA
Posts: 1,428
Year: 1996
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by EastCoastCB View Post
How much per tube? $15 at autozone.
Yup, $15 at Autozone, but they only had one in stock and I don't wanna piecemeal it. I got it cheaper at an industrial supplier online. Case of 12 is $132 plus shipping.
Drew Bru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 07:03 PM   #16
Bus Geek
 
Tango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 8,462
Year: 1946
Coachwork: Chevrolet/Wayne
Chassis: 1- 1/2 ton
Engine: Cummins 4BT
Rated Cap: 15
You can usually find any of the OEM seam sealers at auto paint & body supply houses. Often times cheaper than online if you buy a 6 pack.
Tango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 07:13 PM   #17
Bus Crazy
 
Drew Bru's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Grayson County, VA
Posts: 1,428
Year: 1996
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tango View Post
You can usually find any of the OEM seam sealers at auto paint & body supply houses. Often times cheaper than online if you buy a 6 pack.
Eh, that ship has sailed.

I gotsta get this thing sealed up pronto or we won't be able to move forward on the interior. Don't wanna lose my mojo.

Still not sure about the foam weatherstripping that's currently in there. It should be scraped out, right?
Drew Bru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 07:15 PM   #18
Bus Geek
 
Tango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 8,462
Year: 1946
Coachwork: Chevrolet/Wayne
Chassis: 1- 1/2 ton
Engine: Cummins 4BT
Rated Cap: 15
Depends on condition & type. I see a lot of brand new open cell foam used on rat rods and such and it is nothing more than a water wick and rust magnet. Closed cell in good shape is fine.
Tango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 07:18 PM   #19
Bus Geek
 
EastCoastCB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 23,762
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
Get the foam out, its open cell foam. Both my 92 and 98 amtrans had it.
EastCoastCB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2017, 07:24 PM   #20
Bus Crazy
 
Drew Bru's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Grayson County, VA
Posts: 1,428
Year: 1996
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tango View Post
Depends on condition & type. I see a lot of brand new open cell foam used on rat rods and such and it is nothing more than a water wick and rust magnet. Closed cell in good shape is fine.
It looks like open cell.....your standard home improvement store, adhesive-backed stick on weatherstripping. I was thinking it was allowing the water to flow to the bottom corners, which is pretty much where it's coming in. I'm not 100% sure if it's closed or open cell. I've got some EDPM weatherstripping and it's definitely not the same.

If it won't hurt to remove it, that's likely what I'll do. My plan was to just put a thick bead of sealer in its place. Do all buses have weatherstripping in the window frames?
Drew Bru is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.