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Old 06-02-2014, 09:14 AM   #1
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Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

Ok, I'm sure most folks on this site have heard about the Hytech insulating paint beads and the many knock-offs. Now, looking at Hytech's website, I can't help but feel that it's a scam.. I mean, just LOOK at this page: http://www.hytechsales.com/testimonials.html. It looks like something cobbled together on Geocities. The claims and testimonials seem a bit outlandish, as well, possibly even made up. It also seems unlikely that a random scattering of ceramic beads in paint will insulate, unless they were very densely packed and multi-layered.

Anyway, I'm looking for some real feedback from people who have tried it. Everyone who uses it mixes it with white paint. Is it possible that the "cooling" effect that is felt is entirely due to the roof going from deep yellow to white (and thus reflecting sunlight), not the beads? Has anyone done a side-by-side comparison?

What can I say.... I'm skeptical..
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Old 06-02-2014, 09:22 AM   #2
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

I'm seeing that most of the coatings are rubber-like (elastomeric). I could realistically see that contributing to the insulating factor...
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Old 06-02-2014, 10:05 AM   #3
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

I ordered their Bus Kote, primer and an extra 12 lbs of ceramic beads for the body paint. One thing I learned when I was in Iraq 10 years ago, every little bit of thermal protection helps. All our tan vehicles were still hot as hell, and let's not even discuss any of our trucks that were still woodland camo'd or straight green.
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Old 06-02-2014, 10:09 AM   #4
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

I agree that every bit of thermal protection helps, but what I'm wondering is if the insulating beads actually offer ANY measurable thermal protection, or if the perceived cooling effect is entirely due to the white, elastomeric paint, not the beads.

Has anyone done a side-by-side comparison?
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Old 06-02-2014, 11:38 AM   #5
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

http://www.diy-review.com/IDLqLHowTo...nstration.html

Can't say it's entirely true but this video seems to show some effectiveness.
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Old 06-03-2014, 02:09 PM   #6
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

I'm using Bus-Kote to paint my roof this weekend. I have a section of the roof that is not insulated and will measure before and after it is painted.

Over on Project "Brutus" Jake used it and was very impressed.

Quote:
"Temperature update... It has been pretty hot here. 90's during the day and over 80% humidity. It's 94% humidity right now The difference in the bus is borderline unbelievable. It is remaining about 5* cooler than outside, which has NEVER even come close to happening. Previously, even in the 80s, I would walk in and it would feel like a SAUNA! The rear 1/2 is in the sun and the roof would get hot and heat the bus. Now it is cool and adding no heat to the bus whatsoever. So impressed with the Bus Kote. The sides feel cool to touch as well. I feel the aluminum paint actually is reflecting some of the heat, but that is purely speculation."
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Old 06-03-2014, 11:09 PM   #7
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

OK, ok...we can use my bus as a test ground. Just let me know when you want to come do it.
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Old 06-04-2014, 10:11 AM   #8
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

Quote:
Originally Posted by opus
OK, ok...we can use my bus as a test ground. Just let me know when you want to come do it.
I'm having a roof painting party this weekend, come on over and we can do both.
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Old 06-05-2014, 09:03 PM   #9
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

Hey Everyone,

So we haven't painted the roof of the bus yet, but we have painted the metal floor, the subfloor (both sides) the walls under the foam insulation, and part of the metal ceiling inside. We've only been able to do the ceiling in the back half of the bus though. We mixed ceramic beads with regular Bullseye primer. The beads we used are Insuladd beads. http://www.insuladd.com/ We first used them when painting the bedrooms in our house as they're either the hottest or coldest rooms in the house, depending on the season. Because they're reflective, they don't make a difference in the summer because we don't have anything outside the house painted, but during the winter, there was a noticeable difference in how long the rooms stayed warm. They were typically getting much colder much more quickly than the rest of the house.

As for the bus, we use a space heater. When it's running, you can put your hand on the painted surface and the other hand on the unpainted surface and noticed a very measurable difference. Literally inches apart, one feels pretty warm and the other feels pretty cold. We also haven't painted the roof yet. So I can't say it'll keep the bus warm when it's cold outside, but I can say it makes a difference. We keep the heater in the middle and heat either the front or back of the bus depending where everyone is. The back of the bus will stay warmer longer than the front of the bus will.

Now, we have all the stock windows, 1" white Styrofoam insulation on the walls below the windows and under the plywood floor, and all stock insulation in the bus was left as is. We do have pretty heavy felt curtains over all the windows.

The reason we add the beads to the primer is because it actually changed the tint of the paint a bit. When we used two different cans of paint, it changed the tint in both cans, but not in exactly the same way so you can tell a bit when one can ran out and the other started being used. I guess if you had a big enough container to every drop of paint you were going to use for the whole job, it would be a big deal, otherwise I'd recommend putting it in the primer. The primer is just white and eventually covered up, so it doesn't matter what it looks like.

I browse the site almost every day and feels good to finally add $0.02.
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Old 06-09-2014, 07:38 PM   #10
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

To date the only real-world experience I've had with the HyTech ceramic beads was on a very old tin roof. A couple that owned an old warehouse converted to living had mixed the beads with leftover/mistake latex paint from the Depot and applied two coats using brushes and small rollers. Was well over a hundred the day I saw it and was sold. No other insulation on the 50+ year rusty old tin but with the HyTech beads on the inside it was barely warm to the touch. Any other roof would have scalded my hand that day.

I'm putting a couple of coats on both layers of my body metal as well as using the white "roof coat" on top. And I do plan a little test here soon. I have a small infrared thermometer that reads surface temp and will take a few readings on both sides of a sheet of the treated 16g steel after it has been in the sun for an hour or two. I will let you know what I discover.
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Old 06-09-2014, 10:47 PM   #11
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

Tango and all. When I was working on the hot air exchange ducting for my genny, I discovered that I got very different IR temp readings when the outside and inside of the ducting were different colors than when they were the same color. I suspect that the IR reflectivity of the non matched colors was different. For example, I found that bare steel, bare aluminium and bare galvanized metal gave far lower IR temps than did the same parts under the same conditions when painted. Much as I love my IR temp gun, I now take its readings with a grain of salt--on the other hand, perhaps using your hand to detect heat differences between similarly treated (beads) and untreated (no beads) surfaces is the best way to settle the "should I or shouldn't I use glass beads" question. Hows that for tossing mud into the water? Me, I can't afford the beads so I just went with white paint on the roof--my hand says it makes a huge difference
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Old 06-10-2014, 01:32 AM   #12
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

Roger the "Palmer Method" Jack --- Likewise, it was just my hand that said..."man...this is a whole lot cooler than it oughta' be".
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Old 06-10-2014, 07:22 AM   #13
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

I have not used the insulating beads. I put Henry's SolarFlex (reflective elastometric) on our bus roof. It reflects the sun and does work well. We coated the roof of the Class C with Snow Roofing's elastometric and it was similar results. I wore pants the day I roled the first coat on and I sunburned under my pants up to my knees from the reflected sun. These are both white elastometric roof coatings for residential use. The most dramatic result was when we used leftover Snow on our uninsulated white cargo trailer we used to have. It went from not being able to touch the interior ceiling with out raising a blister, to the next day (coated) and a hand could be laid in the interior metal and it was very warm but you could leave your hand on it. Both days were similar temps and clear sunny skies. Henry's was easiest on my rather lean pocket book. A 5 gallon can was spread (in several coats) on a 40 ft bus. These products are the ones I decided on after a lot of research. I think the reflective nature of the SolarFlex elastometric helped provide a barrier to the thermals and with the addition of the PVC/air pocket strips over the interior rivets, the thermal transfer has been greatly reduced. I know temps inside have dropped with the addition of the PVC/air pocket strips over the rivets.
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Old 06-10-2014, 10:23 AM   #14
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

I do have photos of my temperature testing. Thursday afternoon it was 87 outside and full sunlight. The exposed steel was 109.9 and you could feel the heat coming off it. I painted on the Bus-Kote with the beads and Sunday at almost the same time and temp of 87 and full sunlight. The exposed steel felt cool. The temp… 89.9 Almost a twenty degree drop. This paint is a bright white I had to wear sunglasses when painting.
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Old 06-11-2014, 05:07 PM   #15
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

Here is the proof.

Before Bus-Kote



Same spot same temp and weather three days later, after Bus-Kote.



Today it is in the 90's, bus shut up all day. The inside is same as if you where in the shade. Steel still feels cool to the touch. I'm sold.
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Old 06-11-2014, 06:32 PM   #16
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

Now all we need is the same test without beads and then we could say one way or the other with some actual science to back it up--at this point it is too early to say the beads really work. All that can be said for sure is that there is a big positive improvement as far as the test has gone to date.
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Old 06-11-2014, 06:35 PM   #17
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

My thoughts exactly, ol' trust. We know white paint works, white elastomeric paint probably works better, now we just need to know if:
(beads + elastomeric white paint) > (elastomeric white paint)
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Old 06-11-2014, 09:04 PM   #18
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

It may take awhile, but I can slowly pick all the beads out of the paint and do a re-test for you.
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Old 06-11-2014, 09:13 PM   #19
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

Haha. Excellent! We'll have the results by 2030. Which, at the rate I'm going, is probably when I'll be rolling that paint on the roof!
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Old 06-11-2014, 09:57 PM   #20
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Re: Insulating paint beads: Feedback from REAL people please

W/B That was both a humorous and very polite response to some old SOB (me) picking flaws with your statement. It is truly the mark of a mature individual who can allow for different opinions without getting his knickers in a knot--thanks. Jack
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