Lets talk AC again

[Malkieri]

If you are just experimenting, don't spend all the time and money building a wall... Grab a couple of these magnets and a good blanket or curtain and you have a good test wall. It is a bit redneck, but for testing and such it would get you a general idea and is fast and cheap.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Super-Mag...7#.Udjk4PnTogI

[family wagon]

Originally Posted by bapos

You may want to buy... get... borrow a clamp on amp meter Or a multimeter that has a clamp on option. This will show you the amp draw of what its using at various times of operation. Some of the higher end models will have a the highest value able to be recalled. I have a fieldpiece model that I use for HVAC work in the field. I know most wont need it once your set up electrically but in the HVAC world a good multimeter is one of the most used devices for troubleshooting. Most compressors will have all the technical data that you will need to know about amp draw to see if your generator will be able to power it.

I never tried connecting my DVM to measure that. How fast is the startup current transient? I had assumed it'd be fast enough that a USD$200-grade DVM would miss it, or at least substantially under-measure it. The window A/C units I've looked at all had wattage information on a label somewhere, but I've had to peek through the louvers and hope to see the compressor's LRA. Never seen power factor marked anywhere on one.

Originally Posted by bapos

I can tell I need to get the onan mounted up and make a video of this so others may be able to see how to make sure you do not overload a leg of your generator. I can only assume that the Honda EU will only have one output leg on it.

Whaddaya mean I can't pull 1.21 jiggawatts through a single socket on my super-de-dooper genset?? You're right; many people aren't aware of the restrictions on how their genset is rated.

[family wagon]

Originally Posted by Malkieri

If you are just experimenting, don't spend all the time and money building a wall... Grab a couple of these magnets and a good blanket or curtain and you have a good test wall. It is a bit redneck, but for testing and such it would get you a general idea and is fast and cheap.

Oooohhh.. Thanks! I wonder in which direction are they designed to hold 20 lb, and how well they'll stick to a curve (the ceiling). Maybe you missed my notes about A/C testing I did on an earlier bus. I started with window A/Cs sitting on something.. a ladder or scaffold maybe, beside the bus.. and cardboard-duct-taped to the wall. In round two I removed a couple windows and hung the A/Cs in an OSB panel in the open space. Redneck mock-ups for testing purpose are absolutely acceptable! (but it might be intentional that you won't find any photo evidence of those awful-looking test setups!)

[Das Mel]

Originally Posted by family wagon

Redneck mock-ups for testing purpose are absolutely acceptable! (but it might be intentional that you won't find any photo evidence of those awful-looking test setups!)

PICS OR IT DIDN'T HAPPEN!

[Malkieri]

The 20lbs holds pretty well on the roof of my bus.... (holds a lantern anyhow) and it does take effort to remove. They have a 45lbs 1 as well... http://www.homedepot.com/p/Super-Mag...5#.UdkCKvnTogI If you are concerned about hold, I am sure the 45lbs will hold any blanket you got. Maybe set up a hammock for a small child with em when your tests are done.... I am sure you can find a use for a 45lbs magnet with carabiner, and we do expect pics. I can't read.... so without pics I don't know what you did.

[bapos]

Again this is why I LOVE this site.

#1.... good to see people close willing to lend a hand. Malkieri.... TY very much I sent you a PM so take a look there and get back with me.

#2 Redneck testing is always usually cheaper to pull off. There is nothing worse than getting something in nice and pretty then finding out it wont fit your needs. So all the ideas on here about blankets and what not a very good ideas.

#3 I think pics are a good idea. But I hope we have moved past that now days with as cheap as camera are that we can start rolling to video to start showing this stuff. I know you tube is a good way to go but that all depends on how its titled to be searched. Im not a huge digger of things on there but its a cool place to see what and how people are doing things.


Keep the info rolling. I think this is a good thread.

[lornaschinske]

Originally Posted by bapos

#3 I think pics are a good idea. But I hope we have moved past that now days with as cheap as camera are that we can start rolling to video to start showing this stuff. I know you tube is a good way to go but that all depends on how its titled to be searched. Im not a huge digger of things on there but its a cool place to see what and how people are doing things.

I can tell that you have a good, fast internet connection. I do not watch any online video very often. The long buffering times result in lack of interest. Not that it matters that some of us are internet disadvantaged. Some days I can barely upload a still image. Like I have been told elsewhere, I just need to spend a lot of money to get better internet service. It is just money and I can put it on my credit card. The one I refuse to get. Btw, we are on the campground provided wifi and I suspect some dimwit here is streaming video given the way the connection speeds are varying. Most of the time here recently, it's at 1mbps. Y
et my connection is excellant. Insensative clods!

[bapos]

Mine is not the best. When I moved I went from 30 megs down to 3 meg down when the traffic is not super bad. I know plenty of people who stop off at mcdonalds to borrow their internet and do such things.

Sounds like to me the campground does not know how to set up throttling in their router configuration.

Fight the good fight.

[turf]

From what i have gleaned from this site and others......

a standard campground pedestal..... 30 amp service, is required to run a a single AC unit and your camper.

30 amps x 120 volts = 3600 watts generator

for 2 ACs .... a 50 amp service or 6000 watt genset

going smaller will overheat the wires!

hope that helps!

[lornaschinske]

Originally Posted by turf

From what i have gleaned from this site and others......

a standard campground pedestal..... 30 amp service, is required to run a a single AC unit and your camper.

30 amps x 120 volts = 3600 watts generator

for 2 ACs .... a 50 amp service or 6000 watt genset

going smaller will overheat the wires!

hope that helps!

We plug into the 30 amp outlet on the pedestal. We are running the front ac unit, 6,400 btu, thru the breaker panel box. The rear ac unit, 5050 btu, is on a heavy duty extension cord that is plugged into the 20 amp outlet on the pedestal. We run both units during the day at the same time. At night the front unit is turned off. Only the rear unit runs at night. We figure that we will run the front unit while traveling.

[family wagon]

The local meteorologists came through and delivered an especially hot day yesterday for my A/C testing. Here's my report.

The bus was parked facing due east in full sun all day long. I set a window A/C unit on a stool inside against the north wall about 1/3 down the length of the bus and hung a tarp (folded in half, so it's double-layer) to separate the front from the back. Note that I was mistaken on the capacity of this A/C: it's actually a 10000 BTU unit; earlier I had reported it was just 8000. I closed the doors, windows, and roof hatch in the front portion of the bus. In the back portion I opened the window beside the A/C, the roof hatch, another window, and left the rear doors hanging wide open to provide ample opportunity for the hot air off the A/C condenser to find its way out. I finished the setup and turned on the A/C around 10:00 am and left it for the day.

Temperatures were checked at a few times in the afternoon and evening with a "type K" thermocouple attached to my multimeter:
4:30 PM - 103 in the sun outside; 86 in the breeze in the front seat ahead of the A/C
6:20 PM - 99 outside in the shade; 91 in the middle of the conditioned front area inside. Evaporator discharge 59, condenser discharge 151, hottest area near the back window of the bus was 112. The headboard (?) surface above the windshield was plenty hot!
8:00 PM - 89 outside in the shade; 76 inside. Condenser discharge 137 and warmest point in the rear 96.

Because of the orientation of the bus the solar heat gain through the windshield grew as the afternoon wore on. By 8 pm the windshield was fully shaded by a nearby building and the interior air temperature corresponds to that.

Sooo, I learned a few lessons: don't drive east in the morning or west in the afternoon. Removal of most of the side windows and tinting of what remains will help keep gain while pointing north or south under control. Heat gain through the windshield is brutal. Not sure how I'm going to control that.. I wish there were a solar control window film, like the Solar Gard I used in my last bus, but in a static cling form instead of permanent installation so that I could easily stick it up inside the windshield for just a few hours while it's needed and then remove before driving in the dark.

Fighting that solar gain 10000 BTU didn't go very far. Probably the back portion of the bus, after I remove most of the windows and insulate like a madman, will need less than this. But for the front passenger area I'm not sure what I'll do. Probably will end up finding a way to make a bigger generator acceptably quiet so that I have electric power budget to run a larger A/C up there. Sure would be nice to shave off that direct sun peak, though -- once the sun quit shining on the windshield temperatures inside got pleasant really fast.

[opus]

You were still exhausting hot air from the AC unit back into the bus, dont forget that. ;)

[family wagon]

Originally Posted by Malkieri

The 20lbs holds pretty well on the roof of my bus.... (holds a lantern anyhow) and it does take effort to remove. They have a 45lbs 1 as well... http://www.homedepot.com/p/Super-Mag...5#.UdkCKvnTogI If you are concerned about hold, I am sure the 45lbs will hold any blanket you got. Maybe set up a hammock for a small child with em when your tests are done.... I am sure you can find a use for a 45lbs magnet with carabiner, and we do expect pics. I can't read.... so without pics I don't know what you did.

Ok, ok, yeah I don't have any blankets that heavy. Not sure I have any that are 7 feet tall and 8 feet wide, though!
I did got get a pair of those magnets and I was pretty excited about them. My boys were too: they thought that the idea of bouncing in their "johnny jump-up" chair in the aisle of the bus was a great idea. At least, if they could talk, I'm sure that's what they would have said. It turned out that even the 45 lb magnet wouldn't hold the chair and the baby up. And I was so gonna post a picture and/or video for you, but since it didn't pan out.. sorry!

[bansil]

I was experimenting also and added a pc of doubled over UV stable plastic screening
it works awesome and the landscape material is even thicker (if it ever comes in )

[opus]

I bet using that is when your driving skills are best.

[bansil]

Originally Posted by opus

I bet using that is when your driving skills are best.

actually in the day time you can see out very,very good...in not so much

at night it's the opposite

[Das Mel]

Originally Posted by bansil

I was experimenting also and added a pc of doubled over UV stable plastic screening
it works awesome and the landscape material is even thicker (if it ever comes in )

*Waves like a madman*

Bansil! BansilBansilBansilBANSIL! You just gave me a doozy of an idea! Take that plastic screening and roll it around a do-ma-hickey and slid it inside a PVC pipe with a cut in it so it can essentially act like a set of solid blinds. That way ya can hook it up to the top of the windshield on the inside and lower it or raise it while inside. Use magnets (or a stopping clip like in regular blinds) to keep it connected to any metal around the windows so it doesn't roll up all by its onesy. Massive custom solar blinds!

Would that work or had the Engineer in me gone loco?

[Hvbuzz]

I have one 15,000 btu rooftop ac in my dognose bus. It is a 65 passenger bus. It's placed right about in the middle from front to back. With all the factory windows gone, and 2 inches of pink foam in walls, 1 inch on the floor and 1/2 inch in the ceiling, it keeps the bus cool. That was the big thing I was worried about when putting the bus together was going to keep it cool enough. Its black too. I live in Iowa and we have the high heat and humidity too. On a high 90's day it will cool it down to the 73-74 degrees. The biggest problem like been said, is the front ,with the windows, front door and engine. While parked I always put that foil roll insulation in the front windshield and drivers window. Works great. As soon as I pull it out of the window, while the AC is on, you can tell a major difference in temp. Traveling down the road is never as good. We just got back from from a 1400 mile trip. When its in the mid 90's and direction of sun it makes a big difference on temp inside. I keep a cheap themometer right by the driver seat. Hottest I seen it read while going down the road was about 84 degrees. I think alot of that was engine heat blasting at me though. I have added foam around the doghouse, but after this trip I think I might try and add more. Here's a pic of what I have now(from our trip), I'm thinking I need to foam the whole dash.

My family a few feet back were not nearly as uncomfortable then me. Of course I like it cool anyway. The back of the bus is always cool going down the road. I think I might try and block the back of the bus off while driving, to maybe keep more cool air up front.

[bansil]

Uncomfy as pops?.......Hell no!...they got waffles and her coozy matches our drapes

[bansil]

Das mel
It works better outside to cool and shade the glass,inside it will heat up the air between them

Landscape material is as dark as this is doubled up,when parked snap etc to front and leave you can put foil behind it inside the windsheild

Foil wrapin windshield supposedly can pop out glass and cause earlir clouding....dunno...I know the screen is "cooler" in front than just having foiled bubble wrap that surprised me