Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 09-18-2016, 12:17 AM   #11
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Kent, WA (Seattle)
Posts: 228
Year: 1987
Quote:
Originally Posted by leadsled01 View Post
Check youtube for a guy using metal studs to frame his shuttle bus. He has several episodes. I liked it because metal studs are galvanized and very light weight.
Thank you! I learned the critical vocabulary word I was looking for-"studs", I have spent weeks trying to figure out why I couldn't find what I was looking for now I have found a lot of nice leads. Perhaps the guy you were talking about was "FixItWithMike" on youtube, you

After using this same search term with google via "site:skoolie studs", I then re-discovered The Great White Buffalo Thread. Where he does all his framing with steel studs which starts on page 4.

I also came across some funny threads where Nat condemned the poster for not using the search function properly. However I did find some good stuff which I wanted to copy pasta here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronsb View Post
I've found that steel studs (like the kinds you would use in a commercial building or other fixed structure) are not optimal for a vehicle like a bus. They take up too much space given their size and application.

It would be more apt to think of metal studs as formed sheet metal channels (since that's what they are) and are structurally strong in specific ways that force you to construct your interior parts on a bus in a specific way that isn't always optimal.

The 2x4 (and smaller) wood construction that you see in skoolies is more versatile to constructing the shapes and parts that need to fit than the steel studs simply because they can be combined and used in nearly any orientation.

After evaluating steel stud, 2x4, plywood, and other media, I personally settled on 1"x1"x0.065" thick cold roll square tubing. With a welder I can quickly assemble small frame pieces and attach mounting flanges cut from 1/8" flat bar stock.

I can also use nut-serts in the square tubing, which let me build large assemblies that can be deconstructed and reassembled for installation, maintenance, and plain changing my mind about something.

Per linear foot, 1" square steel tubing has a much higher modulus of elasticity, lower weight, and takes up less space than both wood or sheet steel box (steel stud) construction.

To go even further in optimization, a panel formed from fiberglass or sheetmetal would probably be stronger in-situ, but the specialized construction techniques, and planning requirements for building those components is far more effort than bolting or welding together some square tubing.
One of my favorite things I learned from this quote is regarding "nutserts", I will look into these later and possibly report back into this thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
when you use a lot of metal is it clangy when you drive the bus?

not that school busses arent clangy and rattley already stock..

-Christopher
YES! I wanted to bring this matter up, would it be practical to put in some cheap foam or rubber between the metal and the floor/walls to dampen some rattling and sound? Would anyone have experience with something like this? Conceptually it makes sense to me, it may also increase insulation values somewhat? Maybe.

This now brings more questions to mind, but makes me think the following. Maybe I should do cabinets with the studs and appliances with steel tubing? Or maybe I'll do everything with steel tubing. I guess I should take a welding class first and decide how long until I am capable of welding together the steel tubing as desired. Anyway at this point I'm rambling so I'll shut myself down here. Thanks again all, your input is awesome.
TAOLIK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2016, 01:45 AM   #12
Site Team
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 648
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: TC2000 RE
Engine: 8.3l Cummins
Rated Cap: 78
Nutserts are super awesome! To ensure success use them in shear applications as much as possible.

I tested some nutserts in a tension rig (bottle jack) and I stripped the threads on the bolt and dimpled 1/8 steel plate - the insert did not release from the hole.

I have tons of steel and nutserts and everything is very solid - thud, not clang.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TAOLIK View Post
Thank you! I learned the critical vocabulary word I was looking for-"studs", I have spent weeks trying to figure out why I couldn't find what I was looking for now I have found a lot of nice leads. Perhaps the guy you were talking about was "FixItWithMike" on youtube, you

After using this same search term with google via "site:skoolie studs", I then re-discovered The Great White Buffalo Thread. Where he does all his framing with steel studs which starts on page 4.

I also came across some funny threads where Nat condemned the poster for not using the search function properly. However I did find some good stuff which I wanted to copy pasta here.



One of my favorite things I learned from this quote is regarding "nutserts", I will look into these later and possibly report back into this thread.



YES! I wanted to bring this matter up, would it be practical to put in some cheap foam or rubber between the metal and the floor/walls to dampen some rattling and sound? Would anyone have experience with something like this? Conceptually it makes sense to me, it may also increase insulation values somewhat? Maybe.

This now brings more questions to mind, but makes me think the following. Maybe I should do cabinets with the studs and appliances with steel tubing? Or maybe I'll do everything with steel tubing. I guess I should take a welding class first and decide how long until I am capable of welding together the steel tubing as desired. Anyway at this point I'm rambling so I'll shut myself down here. Thanks again all, your input is awesome.
aaronsb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2016, 03:56 PM   #13
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Kent, WA (Seattle)
Posts: 228
Year: 1987
*googles shear applications*

So I'm shy to clarify but what do we mean by shear applications?
TAOLIK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2016, 04:40 PM   #14
Bus Crazy
 
Stu & Filo. T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Vacaville, Ca
Posts: 1,136
Year: 1988
Coachwork: Crown / Pusher
Engine: 8.3 Cummins
You can purchase them in 2 1/2" studs also
Stu & Filo. T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2016, 05:48 PM   #15
Skoolie
 
GreyCoyote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Danglebury, Tejas
Posts: 202
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: IH 3800
Engine: Navistar DT466E
Rated Cap: 72 passenger
Quote:
Originally Posted by TAOLIK View Post
*googles shear applications*

So I'm shy to clarify but what do we mean by shear applications?
Press the palms of your hands together. If a bolt is now drilled through both palms as they move in opposite directions, that bolt would be in shear.
__________________
"You can finally say you have enough horsepower when you leave two black streaks from corner to corner"
(Mark Donohue, famed TransAm driver)
GreyCoyote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2016, 06:52 PM   #16
Bus Nut
 
Jolly Roger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: North carolina
Posts: 515
Year: 1986
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Ford
Engine: Detroit 8.2
Rated Cap: 60 bodies
Example for discussion. If you put a bolt through a piece of metal where there lower metal has to support the upper metal and then the two foot piece(roof raise ) bolted have to support the roof raise roof? Then your shear weight is on the lower bolts.( with of the structure is on the lower bolts? Your upper bolts will might give up before the lowers?
Bolts are yugoes. Rivets are better and welding is solid.
Shear weight is two pieces fastened together with several methods and each method is tested to there shear point which means until they break?
Shear test.
A 1" steel plate vertical concreted in with a 10"x10" x10" X 1" piece of angle bolted with 1/4" home improvement bolt test at 150' the same piece with solid rivets test at 250',with grade 8 bolts 5000' ,with a solid weld joint 10,000
Jolly Roger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2016, 07:16 PM   #17
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Utah
Posts: 122
Year: 1990
Coachwork: BB
Chassis: TC2000
Engine: Cummins
Rated Cap: 25.999K
clangy....

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
when you use a lot of metal is it clangy when you drive the bus?

not that school busses arent clangy and rattley already stock..

-Christopher

Its a bus... Noise is a part of the experience! (that what I tell myself anyways). I have metal file cabinets for storage, and a Stainless Steel countertop on and between them. As of now, still rather noisy. I'm not sure how they will hold up to twisting and vibration either.... I plan to glue carpet or sound deadening foam to the bottoms and backs just for sound reasons.
SDR76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2016, 08:34 PM   #18
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 3,113
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International S3800
Engine: DT360
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
an open propane or natural gas flame indoors produces a TON of moisture...

ever notice houses that have gas or propane heating systems all that white steam that comes off the flue? all moisture that would be Inside your bus if you use a portable propane heater...

if you run a heat exchanger you will lose a little bit of the heat produced by the flame but also exhaust that moisture...

the ultra high efficiency furnaces like the one in my house with a 3 stage heat exchanger condense that moisutre inside the exchanger and gain a lot of extra heat from it.. its entirely possiuble to build your own high efficiency heat exchanger..

-Christopher
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2016, 05:44 PM   #19
Bus Nut
 
syke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: from: Prescott, AZ currently: Denver, CO
Posts: 467
Year: 1992
Coachwork: BlueBird
Chassis: All American RE
Engine: 8.3 Cummins
Rated Cap: 72
I'd recommend metal studs.

It's more expensive than wood but so much easier to work with.... at least for me as I'm neither a framer nor a carpenter. It was so easy to make the radius up at the ceiling.

There are no rattles (none from the metal studs) and no foam or any sort of thermal break between the studs and the bus walls.

If I had to do it over again I would go with the same gauge metal but probably just a 1" stud and track if there is such a thing. (The track is the bottom and top "stud" that has a different profile to allow the "studs" to snap into place.)

Metal is the way to go....
__________________
Ryan
Bluebird All American RE: Great White Buffalo
Our build thread: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10065
syke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2016, 06:54 PM   #20
Site Team
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 648
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: TC2000 RE
Engine: 8.3l Cummins
Rated Cap: 78
This isn't the best video in the world, but gets the idea of what you can do with a simple tube bender. I have a cheap one with dies for square tube. It's a little tricky to make a progressive curve like a bus roof but it's just a matter of measuring off some points with a sharpie pen and turning the crank.

aaronsb is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:17 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.