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Old 08-22-2017, 12:51 AM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
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Rivet and skinning questions...

So we have a 1996 International Amtran 77 passenger bus that we are just about to start the roof raise on. I was hoping to get some insight and suggestions on how to tackle a couple specific parts to this.

1. In every single skinning video that I've seen there are 2 rows of rivets above the original bus windows. One row on top of the other a couple inches apart. In those videos they popped out the bottom row of rivets to slide the sheet metal into and then used those original rivet holes to re rivet the sheets in. My problem is that my '96 AmTran has only one row of rivets above the windows and they are super close together. Like 1 inch apart from each other all the way down. So many rivets.. SO I'm wondering if it will be ok to knock out the only row of rivets above the windows to slide our panels in there and re rivet. I'm not sure it is a good idea to knock out the only row of rivets above the windows. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

2. Not really a question but... the other day I talked to a man who teaches welding and auto body classes. I told him that I was raising the roof on my bus and that we were welding new hat channels to lap the existing channels and before I could tell him about any other metal we planned on welding he told me not to weld anything. He said to use a 3m panel bonding adhesive to use between the lap joints on the hat channels and and between the panels all the way around where we were riveting. He said this specific adhesive would be stronger than welding for what we are doing. He then told me they've tested this adhesive against professional welds and the adhesive didn't give way in a vehicle roll over test and the welds did. Has ANYONE ever used this adhesive without any welding? Is this a good idea? The number on the 3m adhesive is
08116. He guaranteed me it would be better than any sort of welding. He also said to use the same rivets that they use on planes.

WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ON THIS? PLEASE AND THANK YOU!
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Old 08-22-2017, 09:52 AM   #2
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I've not used the 3M product or any adhesive structurally, but I have used a similar product by Sika to bond sheet metal (skin) on a 40' BB. It worked great. Properly applied, it has been proven to equal or surpass welding. The only question about these new technologies is long term durability. How will they be holding 10-20-30 years from now? But combined with rivets, it should be more than adequate.

Note: OEM applications have been around for close to 20 years now on autos, trucks, rail cars and aircraft. So far the high-tech adhesives have proven extremely tough, strong and vibration resistant since they retain a measure of flexibility. But...as noted above...the prep & application process is critical. Do it absolutely right or don't do it at all.
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Old 08-22-2017, 12:07 PM   #3
Bus Nut
 
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if you are going to have bus welding is a great skill to acquire. if you want to learn it do it!!! my 2cents if the glue fails how much work will it be to tear it apart and fix? we know welding works for a long time if we did not need to weld cars factory's would have got rid of the welding robots long ago
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Old 08-22-2017, 12:11 PM   #4
Bus Nut
 
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im using carriage bolts instead of rivets after getting them all tight ill put a quick spot weld on the nut to keep it tight so it will look like rivets when im done
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Old 08-22-2017, 12:13 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tango View Post
I have used a similar product by Sika to bond sheet metal (skin) on a 40' BB. It worked great. Properly applied, it has been proven to equal or surpass welding. The only question about these new technologies is long term durability. How will they be holding 10-20-30 years from now? But combined with rivets, it should be more than adequate.

the prep & application process is critical.
Sika makes several specialty sealants and adhesives specifically designed for our applications.

Sika


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