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Old 05-25-2019, 08:28 PM   #1
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Securing ceiling

I'm planning on using some underlayment in 1/4" down the center of the bus and then 1/4" T&G boards from there down. Would I be making a mistake gluing these boards and panels. I don't want a bunch of fasteners showing.
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Old 05-25-2019, 09:16 PM   #2
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I'm debating the same issue. Thought of screwing nailing blocks beside the metal ribs but I feel like a bouncing bus might shake loose finish nails. maybe not with construction adhesive. I'm leaning towards self-tapping screws into the metal ribs though I'm not crazy about the visible screws either. I've always been a build it once- build it (too) strong kind of guy.
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Old 05-25-2019, 10:09 PM   #3
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I'm debating the same issue. Thought of screwing nailing blocks beside the metal ribs but I feel like a bouncing bus might shake loose finish nails. maybe not with construction adhesive. I'm leaning towards self-tapping screws into the metal ribs though I'm not crazy about the visible screws either. I've always been a build it once- build it (too) strong kind of guy.
If you're intend on using a T&G board you can go with a combo of glue and blind fastening the boards to the nailing blocks. Between the adhesive, holding and limiting the twisting action, and the nails aiding in holding the boards for a tight bond until the glue dries you should be fine. Given the shape of most bus ceilings as you wedge the boards together, the curvature of the ceiling should aid in the arch principle to assist in holding things up.

If you're concerned, step up into Titebond III it's typically what is used for cutting boards, they claim you can put your cutting boards through the dishwasher if you used Titebond III for the build......Not sure who would put a handmade cutting board through a dishwasher.....but that's the claim. But if it can survive the dishwasher, it should survive the hot/cold, moisture/humidity and whatever else a bus ceiling gives it.
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Old 05-25-2019, 10:34 PM   #4
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Blocking along the curvature of the ribs, a bit of glue in those spots and then brad nail it all. A bling man would be glad to see those fasteners but others with sight likely won't even notice. They may ask "What holds that ceiling up?"


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Old 05-25-2019, 10:35 PM   #5
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Keep in mind my intent is to glue right to the rib, so nails are not in the equation. I'm trying to keep weight to a minimum, so I'm using 1/4" x 3.5" T&G. No benefit to me having flooring that is 3/4 or 5/8", or ceiling that is 1/2".
There's not a whole lot of room for nailing or screwing through the T&G of a board only 1/4" thick.
I found them on HD.com They come 6 to a pack. I get to HD and go where I think they should be and see they have 1/4" x 8", basically the same thing as 2 of the 3.5 boards. I don't want 8's the thinner the width, the more radius I can get in the ceiling, an 8" would look too, flat, flat, flat, flat, if you know what I mean. I pull it up on the phone to show them what it is,because as usual my local HD has no effing clue. I now notice on the phone it says "not available in stores". Well crap, I went there for those boards and a 4" hole saw, and some more rigid board. When I found I had to order it I decided to look at the 8" pieces and see if they would bend much. They come 3 boards to a pack wrapped in plastic. I grab the pack and bend it to find it is actually the same freaking 3.5" boards, they just put 3 pairs stuck together in the store pack, and stack 6 separate boards in the web pack, same price. So I grab a couple of them to finish the garage. I go to the hole saw section and they lots of sizes of hole saws, a rack with every size in 1/8" increments. There are 4 slots for 4", all 4 rows are empty. I swear, no other size was out. I keep looking and spot a clear plastic bin up on top of the rack with hole saws in and cross my fingers. There's an attendant taking care of another customer as I stand in the middle of the aisle obviously waiting for him to finish with that customer in tools, He does but then they ask about a grill on the end of the aisle, okay , no biggie. He looks my way and I'm still standing in the middle of the aisle watching him. He finally finishes with that customer and someone else walks up, asks him a question and they disappear out of sight. I had to go get another floor clerk to get a ladder and pull down the crate that did indeed have a 4" which I grabbed and left that store. I hate that place and we don't have a Lowes within 20 miles.
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Old 05-25-2019, 10:40 PM   #6
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Blocking along the curvature of the ribs, a bit of glue in those spots and then brad nail it all. A bling man would be glad to see those fasteners but others with sight likely won't even notice. They may ask "What holds that ceiling up?"


John
You're saying glue the boards to the blocks and brad nail? Is there a negative to gluing straight to the metal rib? If I glue to anything it will be semi non removable at that point. Would it be easier to pry the wood from the metal or pry wood from wood. Hopefully there will never be a reason to have to go back under the ceiling, famous last words, I know. There are some quick grab adhesives that I think would do the job with no visible fastening, with the exception of where the underlayment meets the T&G, but those fasteners will be covered in trim.
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Old 05-25-2019, 10:47 PM   #7
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You're saying glue the boards to the blocks and brad nail? Is there a negative to gluing straight to the metal rib? If I glue to anything it will be semi non removable at that point. Would it be easier to pry the wood from the metal or pry wood from wood. Hopefully there will never be a reason to have to go back under the ceiling, famous last words, I know. There are some quick grab adhesives that I think would do the job with no visible fastening, with the exception of where the underlayment meets the T&G, but those fasteners will be covered in trim.

Yes, brad nail into the blocks, 2' brads, stainless steel.

No matter what, if you have to open the ceiling there will be damage from adhesives, but only on the back side of the T&G. Easy and cheap fix anyway should you need to open in the future.
I did this on a travel trailer but brad nailed into the T&G and into the joists. Used liquid nails also, good grippage with that stuff.


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Old 05-25-2019, 10:55 PM   #8
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Yes, brad nail into the blocks, 2' brads, stainless steel.

No matter what, if you have to open the ceiling there will be damage from adhesives, but only on the back side of the T&G. Easy and cheap fix anyway should you need to open in the future.
I did this on a travel trailer but brad nailed into the T&G and into the joists. Used liquid nails also, good grippage with that stuff.


John
I'll look at it again tomorrow. To do what you recommend is a bunch more work in that 100* bus. Adding blocks not only adds the labor of cutting and fitting the blocks, now I will have to custom fit the once perfect rectangular rigid board to fit.
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Old 05-25-2019, 11:16 PM   #9
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I'll look at it again tomorrow. To do what you recommend is a bunch more work in that 100* bus. Adding blocks not only adds the labor of cutting and fitting the blocks, now I will have to custom fit the once perfect rectangular rigid board to fit.

Was just a suggestion, looks good with no fasteners showing though..good luck, yeah, it's hot but just pick away at it slowly.


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Old 05-25-2019, 11:23 PM   #10
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Was just a suggestion, looks good with no fasteners showing though..good luck, yeah, it's hot but just pick away at it slowly.


John
I can only do about 1-1/2 hrs in the oven before I about fall out, take a long break and hit it again in the afternoon for another 1-1/2hrs. I''ll throw the window AC in there while I work on the garage. It's suppose to be mid 90*'s for the next 7 days.
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Old 05-26-2019, 01:31 AM   #11
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hey bud,

if it was me i'd be hesitant to use only adhesive on anything that gets a good bit of mileage in a bus, not sure how long your build is but mine tends to flex quit a bit from front to back and gets a fair amount of vibration from the road. what looks good in the driveway vs what looks good 100k miles later ya know?

not sure if/how you were planning to finish the 1/4 ply but they make a wood putty you can cover the fasteners with, sand it smooth, and paint over that works pretty well for hiding that stuff - then you'd have the benefit of both fasteners and adhesive holding those ceiling panels up... also I've had great success with locktite brand insta-grab caulk in the red tube, powergrab ultimate or some such. best of luck however you decide to go man
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Old 05-26-2019, 01:47 AM   #12
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I’d use an airless pin gun and putty the holes, but maybe these are what you need

https://www.frueh-schnellbautechnik....aubkrallen.pdf

The depot sells them in a couple sizes. Maybe they can get the size you need.

PL400 might stick them to the ribs, but I don’t think it would last too long
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Old 05-26-2019, 01:54 AM   #13
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what about pre-drilling holes in the ceiling ribs and using those drywall anchors? the ones with the fin that expands as you turn the screw, those would probably provide better longevity and holding power than any other fastener type I can think of, for a specific metal rib+1/4 ply application... the fastener heads would almost certainly be very visible though.


https://www.tmshardware.com/products...%7C%20%2431.76
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Old 05-26-2019, 03:08 AM   #14
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I was thinking of using the thin bead board that come in 4x8 sheets. FWIW... I still have to get my bus.
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Old 05-26-2019, 07:09 AM   #15
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Yes, brad nail into the blocks, 2' brads, stainless steel.
Two foot brads? You'll probably want to put some seam sealer on the ends of those.
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Old 05-26-2019, 07:19 AM   #16
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I don't mind having fasteners showing as long as they're laid out precisely and regularly in pre-drilled holes. If you freehand the screws and then leave them showing it will look terrible. I'm planning on pre-painting my 1/4" ply and attaching it to the furring strips with brass screws.
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Old 05-26-2019, 07:56 AM   #17
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Two foot brads? You'll probably want to put some seam sealer on the ends of those.



Fat fingers make those errors, 2" works better in the nailer.


Sorry folks,


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Old 05-26-2019, 10:52 AM   #18
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has anyone thought of using pre-finished paneling, cut to the exact length needed to cover the ceiling side to side. then using a strip of wood or what ever, attached to where the ceiling meets the walls, bend the paneling up until it pops into place against the curve of the ceiling - it could then be screwed into place and then, use fake decorative wood plugs to cover the screw heads, or alternatively, leave the strips in place along the edge of the ceiling/wall and use glue on the trusses ( hat channel ) ( you may have to use some imagination to picture what I've written - lol )
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Old 05-26-2019, 11:45 AM   #19
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Well, I'd thought about it... >8' span, wall to wall. (Unless you're talking using a full-width sheet, 4', down the center lengthwise, then yes, that is exactly what I'm endeavoring to accomplish...)
I can see why so many folx use tongue & groove on their ceilings. That inward curvature is a total PITA.
Been battling with the 1/8" Luaun plywood to sheath the ceiling with. Working single-handedly, the stuff's stiff enough that it resisists conforming to the curve, plus it's brittle and friable, particularly along it's edges. Splinters, sadly, are not at all atypical...
If the dang stuff wasn't already dearly bought, paid for, cut, stained, and polyurethaned, I'd be sore tempted to take another route!
One good thing, I reckon, is that I can take a "Do-Over" at a later date...
(Pix are on my DSLR camera, else I'd attach)
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Old 05-26-2019, 12:31 PM   #20
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Well, I'd thought about it... >8' span, wall to wall. (Unless you're talking using a full-width sheet, 4', down the center lengthwise, then yes, that is exactly what I'm endeavoring to accomplish...)
I can see why so many folx use tongue & groove on their ceilings. That inward curvature is a total PITA.
Been battling with the 1/8" Luaun plywood to sheath the ceiling with. Working single-handedly, the stuff's stiff enough that it resisists conforming to the curve, plus it's brittle and friable, particularly along it's edges. Splinters, sadly, are not at all atypical...
If the dang stuff wasn't already dearly bought, paid for, cut, stained, and polyurethaned, I'd be sore tempted to take another route!
One good thing, I reckon, is that I can take a "Do-Over" at a later date...
(Pix are on my DSLR camera, else I'd attach)

certainly ready to learn from your mistakes, problems and successes
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