|
|
09-01-2015, 10:29 PM
|
#61
|
Bus Nut
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Lexington sc
Posts: 482
Year: 1994
Coachwork: carpenter
Chassis: international
Engine: 466dt
Rated Cap: 59
|
Looking at my power usage
1040w microwave (10a)
Fridgfd (maybe 6a)
Kettle 10a
Slow cooker & steamer & coffee maker - unknown.
I'm highly unlikely to want to use more than 2 appliances simultaneously.
|
|
|
09-01-2015, 10:32 PM
|
#62
|
Bus Crazy
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Adirondack Mountains NY
Posts: 1,101
|
Heating appliances and air conditioners are the heavy current draws.
Lights and entertainment devices not so much.
Since you are likely to want to have two cooking devices on at once, you may just want to set up a 30-amp shoreline and be done with it.
__________________
Someone said "Making good decisions comes from experience, experience comes from bad decisions." I say there are three kinds of people: those who learn from their mistakes, those who learn from the mistakes of others, and those who never learn.
|
|
|
09-01-2015, 10:47 PM
|
#63
|
Bus Nut
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Lexington sc
Posts: 482
Year: 1994
Coachwork: carpenter
Chassis: international
Engine: 466dt
Rated Cap: 59
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbear
Heating appliances and air conditioners are the heavy current draws.
Lights and entertainment devices not so much.
Since you are likely to want to have two cooking devices on at once, you may just want to set up a 30-amp shoreline and be done with it.
|
Yup. Wiring for 30+30, fusing for 15+15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zephod_beeblebrox2
Looking at my power usage
1040w microwave (10a)
Fridgfd (maybe 6a)
Kettle 10a
Slow cooker & steamer & coffee maker - unknown.
I'm highly unlikely to want to use more than 2 appliances simultaneously.
|
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 05:58 AM
|
#64
|
Bus Geek
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: MNT CITY TN
Posts: 5,158
|
thanks redbear for correction
__________________
Our build La Tortuga
Accept the challenges so that you can feel the exhilaration of victory.
George S. Patton
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 09:23 AM
|
#65
|
Bus Geek
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 8,462
Year: 1946
Coachwork: Chevrolet/Wayne
Chassis: 1- 1/2 ton
Engine: Cummins 4BT
Rated Cap: 15
|
One quick note when sizing your system...take the "start-up" amp draw into account for things like fridges & a/c's. They are typically several times what the running amps are. This true for both supply and wiring according to an electrician buddy.
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 11:33 AM
|
#66
|
Bus Nut
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Lexington sc
Posts: 482
Year: 1994
Coachwork: carpenter
Chassis: international
Engine: 466dt
Rated Cap: 59
|
The start up of my potential fridge is 5.6a, apparently. I think that is ridiculous. At 120v, that's 672W. That's one of those haier things. At that rate, I might be far better off with a Peltier cooler. Incidentally, if you use 13 Peltier elements, you can get -50 centigrade!
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 12:36 PM
|
#67
|
Bus Crazy
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Salt Lake City Utah
Posts: 1,635
Year: 2000
Chassis: Blue Bird
Engine: ISC 8.3
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zephod_beeblebrox2
The start up of my potential fridge is 5.6a, apparently. I think that is ridiculous. At 120v, that's 672W. That's one of those haier things. At that rate, I might be far better off with a Peltier cooler. Incidentally, if you use 13 Peltier elements, you can get -50 centigrade!
|
High start-up current is common with motors. Some small refrigerators are work on a heat cycle instead; they're essentially an electric-only version of the RV propane fridge. Those wouldn't have high start-up current.
And yes, a stack of thermoelectric/peltier elements can get cold...... so long as you have a few kW available to power them, and don't need to chill anything more massive than a single raindrop or snowflake. For all the power they take in, they don't move very much power (heat) from the one side to the other.
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 12:56 PM
|
#68
|
Bus Geek
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: MNT CITY TN
Posts: 5,158
|
maybe glue them all over the inside metal roof of the bus
__________________
Our build La Tortuga
Accept the challenges so that you can feel the exhilaration of victory.
George S. Patton
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 01:33 PM
|
#69
|
Bus Crazy
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Farmington Hills, Mi (Detroit area)
Posts: 1,968
Year: 2000
Coachwork: Eldorado Aerotech 24'
Chassis: Ford E-450 Cutaway Bus
Engine: 7.3L Powerstroke
Rated Cap: 19
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zephod_beeblebrox2
One breaker feeds the left side of the sub panel. The other feeds the right side. The cable for each side is 30A.
Advantage... When I'm on a 30A circuit, both breakers in the mini box can be on. On a 15A circuit, I turn one off and just have two active sockets.
|
When you plug into 30 amp shore power your system up to the individual breakers will be protected by a 30 amp SP breaker as long as you use 10 gauge wire up to the box. When you plug into 15 amp SP you will be limited to 15 amps by the breaker at the SP panel. Thus, the weak spot in your system, your 15 amp rated extension cord, will be protected at the SP panel. No need for your second breaker box. Just be sure you run 10 gauge wire from the outside bus receptacle to the breaker box. As stated before, you don't need a main breaker in your bus breaker panel, just connect your incoming hot wire to one lug and jumper from it to the second.
Here's a 30A inlet receptacle similar to what you'll see on most newer RVs these days
30 Amp 125V Boat Power Inlet
Here's a good quality 30A power cord that will make a water tight seal to the Marinco receptacle
Marinco 30 Amp Shore Power Cordset
You can build your own cords but the price is almost what a manufactured cord will cost and you still have to find a good way to weather seal the connectors to the wire. These cords can be found used on eBay considerably cheaper than the new price.
Here's the correct way to wire 15A or 20A outlets
Wire An Outlet
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 04:52 PM
|
#70
|
Bus Geek
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 8,462
Year: 1946
Coachwork: Chevrolet/Wayne
Chassis: 1- 1/2 ton
Engine: Cummins 4BT
Rated Cap: 15
|
Excellent info...thanks Roach!
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 07:11 PM
|
#71
|
Bus Nut
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Lexington sc
Posts: 482
Year: 1994
Coachwork: carpenter
Chassis: international
Engine: 466dt
Rated Cap: 59
|
Wow! I just looked for male wall socket s. Damn! A $6 piece if plastic and metal that's decidedly low tech going for $70. Can you say rip off?
I can see that my cables are most likely going to be inline sockets hidden behind an access panel. Just plug extension cables in!
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 07:52 PM
|
#72
|
Bus Crazy
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Salt Lake City Utah
Posts: 1,635
Year: 2000
Chassis: Blue Bird
Engine: ISC 8.3
|
Yeah, the power inlet sockets are kind of outrageous. Especially the marine style. Here are a few that are more down-to-earth:
Reliance Controls PB31 for $49
Legrand L620 for $17, but it's just 20A and only 3-pole, so 120V with ground and neutral
Hubbell HBL2616 30A for $24 again 3-pole, 120 volt
but.. if the shore power cord has to be removable, there isn't anything wrong with having a short pigtail in the bus with a male cord end so that you can plug it to the female end of a shore power extension cable. With that, or with any of the other inlets as well, a proper transfer switch would be needed "some day" when an inverter finds its way into the bus to prevent the male terminals being energized when the inverter is turned on, or the inverter being turned on while the shore power is plugged in.
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 07:54 PM
|
#73
|
Bus Nut
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Lexington sc
Posts: 482
Year: 1994
Coachwork: carpenter
Chassis: international
Engine: 466dt
Rated Cap: 59
|
I was thinking that if I put some foirm of self contained power source, the pigtails coulkd becvome useful.
|
|
|
09-02-2015, 11:43 PM
|
#74
|
Bus Geek
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Stony Plain Alberta Canada
Posts: 2,937
Year: 1992
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: TC2000 FE
Engine: 190hp 5.9 Cummins
Rated Cap: 72
|
Home made cords just increase the risk of something being wired wrong by the individual that does not understand North American wiring standards.
Please for the sake of everyone, just buy the right stuff.
Nat
__________________
"Don't argue with stupid people. They will just drag you down to their level, and beat you up with experience."
Patently waiting for the apocalypses to level the playing field in this physiological game of life commonly known as Civilization
|
|
|
09-03-2015, 02:45 AM
|
#75
|
Bus Nut
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 308
|
As someone who has halfassed a lot of things in life (including electric projects) I have come to learn a couple of things via first hand experience.
On a project the size of a bus buy the best things you can as you don't need much of it.
When it comes to electrical stuff oversize the wire and conduit sure it will cost more but make it so much easier to deal with later.
Try really really really hard not to have exposed live male adapters (more a problem in computers, thanks 3 pin fan connections).
Some times the exact thing you need is made, but only 10 other crazy people in the world buy one on any given day, therefore it is rare and rare things cost an absurd amount of money. Simply be happy you have a rare plug, it makes you special.
Other times the thing you need isn't made so you have to make it yourself. Don't cut corners when you do. It won't be easy, there is a reason they don't make what you are trying to make.
Also as long as you stick to one standard you will be just fine. If you use inches always use inches, if you always use centimeters... same goes for wiring if you use north american std then don't try to add other standards.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD LABLE IN SHARPIE OR PAINT PEN!
|
|
|
09-03-2015, 06:59 AM
|
#76
|
Skoolie
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 100
|
And when you label, label everything.
This means that the breaker gets a label of which items it protects frim surge and the item gets a label of which breaker its connected to.
If you have more than one panel, label the source and feed of the panels so in an emergency you know exactly which panel breaker to open.
That's what we do in many buildings we manage and it make everything easier...
|
|
|
09-03-2015, 07:39 AM
|
#77
|
Bus Crazy
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: EHT New Jersey
Posts: 1,134
Year: 2003
Coachwork: AmTran
Chassis: International 3000RE
Engine: T444E/AT545
Rated Cap: 75
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainInsaneo
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD LABLE IN SHARPIE OR PAINT PEN!
|
Or even better, get a P-touch style label maker.
|
|
|
09-03-2015, 08:24 AM
|
#78
|
Bus Crazy
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario
Posts: 1,793
Year: 1997
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: B3800 Short bus
Engine: T444E
Rated Cap: 36
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zephod_beeblebrox2
The start up of my potential fridge is 5.6a, apparently. I think that is ridiculous. At 120v, that's 672W. That's one of those haier things. At that rate, I might be far better off with a Peltier cooler. Incidentally, if you use 13 Peltier elements, you can get -50 centigrade!
|
If you piggyback 13 thermoelectric units (which would draw 65 amps @ 12v, or 780w) you could get -50c on the surface, but that wouldn't be enough to bring even a cooler down anywhere near that cold. Maybe 13 piggybacked units times 13 could bring a cooler close to that cold... And would draw 845 amps @12v (10000 watts) constantly!
A have a small compressor driven refrigerator that has a spike on startup, but levels out at around 5amps for its entire run and can bring the contents down to - 20c. I wouldn't even consider the thermoelectric units. They are Way too inefficient.
|
|
|
09-03-2015, 09:11 AM
|
#79
|
Bus Crazy
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Farmington Hills, Mi (Detroit area)
Posts: 1,968
Year: 2000
Coachwork: Eldorado Aerotech 24'
Chassis: Ford E-450 Cutaway Bus
Engine: 7.3L Powerstroke
Rated Cap: 19
|
Deleted message.
|
|
|
09-03-2015, 09:24 AM
|
#80
|
Bus Crazy
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Farmington Hills, Mi (Detroit area)
Posts: 1,968
Year: 2000
Coachwork: Eldorado Aerotech 24'
Chassis: Ford E-450 Cutaway Bus
Engine: 7.3L Powerstroke
Rated Cap: 19
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zephod_beeblebrox2
Wow! I just looked for male wall socket s. Damn! A $6 piece if plastic and metal that's decidedly low tech going for $70. Can you say rip off?
I can see that my cables are most likely going to be inline sockets hidden behind an access panel. Just plug extension cables in!
|
It appears that you're mounting all your outlets in one spot. If that's the case I can save you a lot of money. Just buy a 12 ga. 15A extension cord and a multi-outlet power strip like the ones people have under their desks at work. When you get to the campground, run the extension out the window and plug in your power strip. Walla! you have breaker protected, multi-outlet power at a fraction of the cost. Even better, you can move the power strip to the appliance instead of running those kludgy extension cords all over the place.
|
|
|
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
» Recent Threads |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|