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01-15-2018, 01:42 AM
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#3281
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Almost There
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 99
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01-15-2018, 01:59 AM
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#3282
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Almost There
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 99
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01-15-2018, 02:01 AM
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#3283
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Almost There
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 99
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Can you tell I am looking for a bus?
I hear gas are peppy. A small 4 window easier to drive. Single lady.
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01-15-2018, 06:51 AM
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#3284
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 23,764
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ben2go
There is potential to build a powerhouse Skoolie right there. I think it's priced about $2000 to high.
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Those Ford chassis buses aren't my favorite. Had one and hated it.
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01-15-2018, 06:57 AM
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#3285
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 23,764
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid
they do because most people dont maintain them, (or any engine) correctly.. that engine is obviously very sensitive to oil and coolant maintenance.. 2 things that get forgotten the most.. esp coolant..
I do know of some that run long.. but they were boiught brand new and are single owner to this day.. telling skoolies here to avoid them is probably good advice.. though id still buy one if the right bus came along cheap enough..
just like my 444E, I can replace it wit ha completely all reman unit turbo to oil pan t owater pump.. bolt it up and go for well under 10K. if I were to blow mine up..
a LOT of an engines failure rate is how it was cared for in its first life..
just like your 466E, its obvious the schools botched the maintenance.. along with a somewhat known issue, spells trouble.. doesnt mean the 466E is bad motor.. its up there as one of the good ones.. the known issue doesnt plaugue them all.. but will shpw up in the slacker-maintained ones first..
there are plenty of cummins 5.9's out there that have never had their tappet cover leak or the dowel pin pop out.. yep they are known issues.. but in my opinion how they are treated has a lot to do with it.. esp the tappet cover leak.. bad oil - eats the seals.. the dowel pin is probably luck of the draw.. some will be tight enough to never move out.. others will..
some say the 8.3's have a timing cover cracking issue.. no RED-DOT had an issue with the A/C brackets (dual compressor) that caused it to crack.. since 8.3's were put in a lot of the busses that ran trips.. higher percentage were AC'd and therefore makes some people think it was a stay away from engine..
-Christopher
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The techs at the dealer said they'd never own one. We even talked about all the "clean late model buses" selling cheap. To me its pretty telling when the service manager calls the VT a boat anchor. Seems like if they were worth anything those techs would be flipping them for $$$.
Every engine has potential issues to watch for. Some engines are just best avoided.
Knowing what I know now, I'd not buy another DT made after 99.
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01-15-2018, 02:37 PM
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#3286
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 18,758
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EastCoastCB
The techs at the dealer said they'd never own one. We even talked about all the "clean late model buses" selling cheap. To me its pretty telling when the service manager calls the VT a boat anchor. Seems like if they were worth anything those techs would be flipping them for $$$.
Every engine has potential issues to watch for. Some engines are just best avoided.
Knowing what I know now, I'd not buy another DT made after 99.
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so the easy way is that the 365 Busses are cheap enough at auction to just buy 2 with running engines... keep one, part the other one out.. sell iuts tranny, A/C units, tires, rear end , etc. scrap the body and probably have a free spare engine.. like I was going to do with that wrecked IC (for a 444E) the local schools have stuck in lawyer-land..
-Christopher
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01-15-2018, 03:15 PM
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#3287
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Dawsonville, Ga.
Posts: 10,482
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Genesis
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466/3060
Rated Cap: 77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trailer2
Intake direction makes no difference. 5.9 has 6 individual valve covers and 8.3 has one.
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Contacted seller with your concern and they replied that they were told it was an 8.3 and took it at face value. After inspecting it they agree it is a 5.9. I'm out.
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01-15-2018, 04:07 PM
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#3288
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Dawsonville, Ga.
Posts: 10,482
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Genesis
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466/3060
Rated Cap: 77
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01-15-2018, 04:48 PM
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#3289
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Weeki Wachee, FL
Posts: 3,056
Year: 1997
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: TC2000 FE
Engine: Cummins 5.9
Rated Cap: 72
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Accepted wisdom is to avoid basically everything they have on their list, due to age. Only a few of those buses are on the "easy" side of emissions controls.
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01-15-2018, 04:54 PM
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#3290
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 18,758
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
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Quote:
Originally Posted by o1marc
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and while I admit id buy a VT365, I wouldnt buy one for those prices
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01-15-2018, 04:55 PM
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#3291
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Traveling
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,573
Year: 2003
Coachwork: BlueBird
Chassis: TC2000
Engine: 5.9L Cummins
Rated Cap: '00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brokedown
Accepted wisdom is to avoid basically everything they have on their list, due to age. Only a few of those buses are on the "easy" side of emissions controls.
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Unless, of course, you prefer newer vehicles and are handy enough to delete any extra hoses, gizmos and blue jugs of urine.
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01-15-2018, 04:59 PM
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#3292
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 18,758
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty
Unless, of course, you prefer newer vehicles and are handy enough to delete any extra hoses, gizmos and blue jugs of urine.
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the computers are the issue on the real new stuff.. on the consumer side there are plenty of tuners, gizmos, pipes, and fake sensors to delete that stuff.. on the big rig class 8 side there are even some of the same things..
but on the Medium duty / school bus side there is very littkle out there that can help get around the computer turning off the engine if something emission related.. esp relating to a regen of a DPF goes wrong.. or it thinks so anyway,..
-Christopher
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01-15-2018, 05:00 PM
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#3293
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Dawsonville, Ga.
Posts: 10,482
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Genesis
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466/3060
Rated Cap: 77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brokedown
Accepted wisdom is to avoid basically everything they have on their list, due to age. Only a few of those buses are on the "easy" side of emissions controls.
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How new should I be looking for? I hear to stay away from anything newer than 2004. So I'm looking for a 98-04, they have plenty in the $2500-$5000 range
Fortunately for me I live in a county that does not require emission inspections on any vehicle.
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01-15-2018, 05:03 PM
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#3294
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Eustis FLORIDA
Posts: 23,764
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Freighliner FS65
Engine: Cat 3126
Rated Cap: 15
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My 04 has an 03 engine and its definitely as new as I'll ever be buying.
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01-15-2018, 05:08 PM
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#3295
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Traveling
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,573
Year: 2003
Coachwork: BlueBird
Chassis: TC2000
Engine: 5.9L Cummins
Rated Cap: '00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid
but on the Medium duty / school bus side there is very littkle out there that can help get around the computer turning off the engine...
-Christopher
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Where there is money to be made....
https://heavydieseltuner.com/Cummins_Medium_Duty.php
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01-15-2018, 06:34 PM
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#3296
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Bus Geek
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 18,758
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty
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cummins has a lot of love in the world since they have penetrated the market well.. and on class 8 the big detroits and cats. have a lot of tuning available..
the little cats, navistar, and MBE have very little support at the medium duty level..
-Christopher
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01-15-2018, 07:09 PM
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#3297
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Traveling
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,573
Year: 2003
Coachwork: BlueBird
Chassis: TC2000
Engine: 5.9L Cummins
Rated Cap: '00
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01-15-2018, 07:48 PM
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#3298
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Weeki Wachee, FL
Posts: 3,056
Year: 1997
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: TC2000 FE
Engine: Cummins 5.9
Rated Cap: 72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by o1marc
How new should I be looking for? I hear to stay away from anything newer than 2004. So I'm looking for a 98-04, they have plenty in the $2500-$5000 range
Fortunately for me I live in a county that does not require emission inspections on any vehicle.
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2003 is about as new as you want to go. Early to mid 90s is kind of the sweet spot. Mechanical engines are simpler than ones with electronics. WIth that said, I have an early electronic engine, a 1995 vintage T444E.
After 2004 things started going wonky with emissions and you find silly things like plastic parts inside your engine and muffler juice (DEF).
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01-15-2018, 08:56 PM
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#3299
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Bus Nut
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Montana/Texas
Posts: 682
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Crown by Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: 230 HP DT 466e/MT 643!
Rated Cap: 16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty
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Big question is do they actually work and will they screw up your engine...
John
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
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01-15-2018, 09:05 PM
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#3300
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Bus Geek
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Owasso, OK
Posts: 2,627
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Saf-T-Liner MVP ER
Engine: Cummins 6CTA8.3 Mechanical MD3060
Rated Cap: 46 Coach Seats, 40 foot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnbloem1974
Big question is do they actually work and will they screw up your engine...
John
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
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Mild tuning almost always works and doesn't screw up the engine if done right.
For example, my Cummins 8.3 is tuned to 250 hp. The same engine also shipped from the factory with 300 hp for RVs, and 450 hp for marine use.
Taking mine to 300 hp is probably doable by shifting the fuel plate and advancing the timing. Changing the governor springs would also release more revs, and the engine is safe to at least 3000 rpm, even with the standard valve springs
The main area to be careful of is keeping a very close eye on the turbo exhaust temp. If it goes over 1300F, expensive bits start to melt, but a simple pyrometer takes care of that.
As with all things, the more power you extract from an engine, the faster it wears.
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