05 H3 Hummer that gets 60MPG on WVO?

phillbus914 · 11-02-2007, 10:10 PM

Don't believe it? Check out this article I just stumbled upon. <-- this is a link for a cool program that finds cool websites for you... Below is the link.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/10/30/14161/066

crazycal · 11-02-2007, 10:40 PM

"When you start a diesel engine up on vegetable oil," Goodwin says, "you turn the key, and you hear nothing. Because of the lubricating power of the oil, it's just so smooth. Whisper quiet. And they're like, 'Is it running? Yeah, you can hear the fan going.'"

This guy has crap overflowing from his head into his ear canals. That's why he can't hear the diesel engine running.

swinada · 11-02-2007, 10:53 PM

hmm, and why dont you believe it? Because you might have been indoctrinated by the automotive industrie that it is impossible?
Remember the claim for the 60MPG is from a car that will mostly be running on its electrical motor only burns fuel for charging the "batteries".
I believe it is possible.
But then most people probably would consider me as an conspiricy guy in such questions. For I firmly believe that the automotive industry / oil / gas etc. is not interested in too fuel effcient vehicles yet. Yes they make improvements to satisfy the "green demands" but I'm sure if they really wanted to, they could do way better. Just my opinion.

phillbus914 · 11-02-2007, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swinada

But then most people probably would consider me as an conspiricy guy in such questions. For I firmly believe that the automotive industry / oil / gas etc. is not interested in too fuel effcient vehicles yet. Yes they make improvements to satisfy the "green demands" but I'm sure if they really wanted to, they could do way better. Just my opinion.

I am with ya on this... Ever see that documentary who killed the electric car. If not I highly recommend it.

I don't necessarily buy into all conspiracy hype but think about it. A 1986 Ford Taurus gets the same fuel mileage as a 2006 Taurus, doesn't it seem that something could have improved the fuel mileage over the course of 20 years? The same could be said about most cars in this time frame, I just happen to know my fords a little better.

It just really grinds my gears when we see all these hybrids all over that get 40-50 MPG and Europe has had small diesel engines getting the same mileage for the past decade. And they don't have $4,000 battery banks that need replacement every 5(ish) years.

Anyway, I just thought it was an interesting read that someone out there is thinking outside the box - trying things that the auto industry says can't be done. Regardless with how quiet the engine is running, the stuff that this guy is doing is amazing.

By the way Crazycal, have you heard some of the new diesel engines they're putting in the pick up trucks? They're almost as quiet as a gas motor.

crazycal · 11-02-2007, 11:46 PM

That's not the part of the story that I quoted. I am well aware of what electric cars are capable of. Look here. http://www.plasmaboyracing.com/videos.php

When someone says that you can't here a diesel running, running on wvo or diesel, I say

As far as the newer pickemups with diesels, I have driven them all. I have a 05 Dodge with a Cummins, and yes it is quite, but I can still here it.

phillbus914 · 11-03-2007, 12:31 AM

uhhh what?

I was referring to swinadas comment about the automotive industry / oil / gas etc. not interested in fuel efficient vehicles...

I do agree that not being able to hear a diesel engine run is BS, but the quietness of the motor is not the point of the article, and I don't think it necessarily means the whole article is BS.

crazycal · 11-03-2007, 01:12 AM

I agree with you, but I still think they are stretching the truth a bit. 2000 ft lbs of torque. Is that from electric or diesel. Diesel/electric hybrids are the way to go. If I am reading a story and I find facts tweaked to make things seem more sensational, then I have a problem with the story. I have seen people use numbers as high as 200 miles per gallon. They are counting only the couple of gallons of diesel they bought divided into all the miles they drove including those on wvo. The drag race with the Lambo is no big deal. That car is made to drive at 180mph, not win 1/4 mile drag races. Too many things in the story are stinky, so I take it with a grain of salt. I have a simple mind. Just give the facts and I'm happy.

phillbus914 · 11-06-2007, 11:32 PM

Here's another story on this guy's work, very interesting read.

http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/120 ... ssiah.html

the_experience03 · 11-07-2007, 12:24 AM

"Conservatively," Goodwin muses, scratching his chin, "it'll get 60 miles to the gallon. With 2,000 foot-pounds of torque. You'll be able to smoke the tires. And it's going to be superefficient."

The turbine thing has been done.

Now I understand that it wasn't a hybrid, but it failed for any number of reasons. Turbines are expensive when parts fail and require a VERY competent technician to work on them. On top of that they're loud, can be difficult to start, etc. A turbine just doesn't lend itself well to starting and stopping like in a hybrid vehicle.

My other issue is with the 2000 ft lbs claim. Yes, electric motors are capable of tremendous stalled torque, but at the expense of horsepower. If you want that thing to go fast you're going to be giving up torque. If you want it to pull a load you're going to be giving up horsepower and speed.

The other thing...it's an H3. There isn't a component on that vehicle that is matched to even 400 ft lbs of torque, let alone 5 times that. 2000 ft lbs and you're talking Dana 70 snapping power, even under something that light. Just look at what the diesel pickup guys are able to do with 1000 ft lbs. Sure, they have more weight, but they also have 1-ton components...which the scatter about on the ground when they get on it.

I applaud people for trying, but in this case...man...hubris be thy name.

crazycal · 11-07-2007, 01:38 AM

Quote:

He drove it over to a local restaurant and mooched some discarded oil from its deep fryer, strained the oil through a pair of jeans, and poured it into the engine. It ran perfectly.

For about 5 miles until his filter clogged. I think this story is about 90% fluff. I still say...

phillbus914 · 11-07-2007, 09:40 AM

Yeah I do agree that 2000 ft.lbs. of torque will grenade the drivetrain, but it's not finished. The article says it's something he's working on. This guys regularly puts duramax diesels in H2's - something GM said couldn't be done. When he's done with them they get twice the horsepower and twice the fuel economy... yeah who'd want that?

Why does everyone look at the numbers and say "oh that can't be done, this is BS" Thats the same thinking of the auto industry in this country, and frankly I'm tired of it. I remember sitting in my auto management class about 5 years ago in college and a rep from Ford was there, at the end of his presentation he asked if there were any questions. I asked "why doesn't a domestic car company (like ford) make diesel cars? They're all over in Europe." He answered, "there really isn't a demand for that here." Really? No one wants a car that gets 50mpg here...

I thought a board of guys building their own motorhome/party bus/ect... would be a little more open to learning about what other new and exciting "can't be done" projects are out there.

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazycal

I think this story is about 90% fluff. I still say...

Yeah crazycal I got it, you're not buying it.

lapeer20m · 11-07-2007, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazycal

"When you start a diesel engine up on vegetable oil," Goodwin says, "you turn the key, and you hear nothing. Because of the lubricating power of the oil, it's just so smooth. Whisper quiet. And they're like, 'Is it running? Yeah, you can hear the fan going.'"

This guy has crap overflowing from his head into his ear canals. That's why he can't hear the diesel engine running.

I ran about 1000 gallons of wvo in my ford 6.6 liter diesel. One thing that i noticed is how extremely quiet the motor would run. If you were used to how it sounded on veggie, when you switched it back to diesel you'd think the motor was gonna detonate! But even on wvo that ford motor was far from silent.

Those newer vw diesels are super quiet. You almost have to look at the TDI tag on the back bumper to determin if it's diesel or ga. I'd be curious to see how much quieter they get on wvo.

I don't agree that hte story is completely true. I worked at the GM proving grounds and there were several H2's runnnig around with duramax diesels in them. Also had them in surbans and tahoe's and at least 1 van type ambulance.

the_experience03 · 11-07-2007, 02:06 PM

Kind of a sidebar thing, but is that guy offering any sort of warranty with his Duramax H2's and such? The Duramax is a pretty damn amazing powerplant (probably the quietst of hte pickup diesels out there too), but lets face it...every manufacturer has had some issues with their diesels, especially after going electronic. Ford has had headgasket and turbo issues, Chevy has had injectors and oiling problems, and you can't keep a VP44 injector pump in a Cummins. With the amount of money a person would spend on that conversion I sure would want some sort of warranty from the guy. You know GM isn't going to give you a crate motor warranty even since clearly he is bombing those things electronically.

crazycal · 11-07-2007, 03:13 PM

Going by memory, the story said something like, "I shut the truck down the night before and I was afraid it wouldn't start on wvo, but it started right up and it was sooooo quite that 20 GM engineers thought the motor wasn't even running. Yeh, right. I don't have time now, but I will go back a read the article later. If I am wrong, I offer a thousand apologies.

DizzyIzzy · 11-07-2007, 06:54 PM

I agree with philbus.

Great to see things that cant be done being done.

the_experience03 · 11-07-2007, 07:09 PM

I'm all about the small diesel cars. I was up at the hunting shack this last weekend and happened to find a 1985...er...adult training manual. It was more fun just to look at the advertisements than anything. Notable were the "hi-fi" car stereos, the 1985 Toyota pickup (I own one and have an affinity for all things 4wd and Toyota), and one for a VW diesel Rabbit. They were claiming 48 mpg with the 5 speed on the Rabbit.

No demand in our country? I beg to differ. TDI Volkswagens are plenty popular. I think people are finally over the 350 Olds diesel thing and are ready to give it a try again. Then again, the CRD Jeep Liberty didn't do so well.

swinada · 11-08-2007, 07:48 AM

what I don't understand about the American market is that there is hardly any Diesel car or trucks available except from the 3 American brands. Yes European cars sell good with diesel engines. But how many Japanese (korean whatever) cars or truck can you get on the american market? hardly any, Why????
Toyota, Nissan, Mitsubishi etc. all have Diesel engines available in the European market they are good and efficient and last forever. Why aren't they available here?

lapeer20m · 11-08-2007, 08:28 AM

NPR did a story on a European vw that gets 80 mpg that cannot be sold in the US because it doesn't meet emissions.

phillbus914 · 11-08-2007, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lapeer20m

NPR did a story on a European vw that gets 80 mpg that cannot be sold in the US because it doesn't meet emissions.

How could a car that gets 80 mpg and not meet emissions? That makes no since, when the car uses so little fuel. Even if it didn't pass for some reason, I'm sure there's a small change that could be made to make it pass... if they really wanted it to.

Matt · 08-19-2008, 09:13 AM

The cat is out of the bag,with the WWW you have people exchanging info very fast on a one to one basis.
Before that things could be hidden from us by simply buying the idea and sitting on it.
I converted my truck to SVO and had several diesel guys tell me it would kill the motor.That was four years ago.

Keep an open mind you just never know what someone can do.

If you say you cant then ,you dont.
Why not go for 100 MPG?????

Matt

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