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Old 03-08-2019, 05:59 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Tawdbb View Post
When I say short bus, I think under 30 probably with a wheelchair lift. Is a 7.3 or a t444e enough for a full sized chassis around 25 long to feel reasonable up mountain grades? I understand that a full sized chassis will have a significantly larger payload for building out. I likely wont tow anything besides a small 3-4hundreds pound boat and trailer

alot has to do with the transmission you end up with.. towing and mountains and an AT-545 with a T-444E is going to be a lot tougher than if you have one of the Lock-up transmissions.. (ie a 2000 series)..



I have the software that can pump up the power on the 444E and then they move a shortie pretty well..



my own case is that I play with my 444E.. so ive got the power turned up to 250 and i have the allison 1000 trans.. I dont tow a car with it, I just returned from a 2700. mile road trip.. I was able to climb the mountains in tennesee in kentucky at pretty much full speed ahead.. I dropped it down to 4th gear and ran it 65 up the hills and kept my EGTs in check..



now lets go back to when that was a 190HP and an AT545.. I climbed those hills at 52 or 53. .. whcih really isnt bad but you wont fly.. now obviously in REAL mountains its not recommended to haul ass anyway..



V-8 diesels in their stock form just dont have much brute low end torque compared to the inline 6 counterparts like the DT-466 and CAT 3126. that you often find in full chassis short busses.. older full chassis short busses (87-93) you can find a DT-360. and thats a pretty torqwuey inline 6..



fairly often I see the 6 or 7 window thomas, amTran and bluebird full chassis shorties come up on the auctions.. the thomas will often be freightliners and have the inline 6 CAT-3126, the bluebird or amTran will be a mix typically of T-444E or the lower spec DT-466E. many of these shorties got the AT-545 trans.. which people can do their own research.. you will find debates of all kinds for and against that transmission.. if you are going to tow then look for a newer (usually 03-04) with an allison 2000, although you could order a 2000 since typically the 01 model year..



im a fan of AT545s for weekend warriors but not for cruisiong the country time and time again.. I put a lot of miles on my busses, most of it highway or back-roads 2 laning . I have 3 busses, at one time all 3 of them had AT-545.. now only 1 does... thats just MY experience with them..

that said both busses made multiple trips over mountains, through cities, and everything in between before the AT-545 called it quits...



your van cutaway busses will have that respective manufacturers Van transmission.. the chevy 6.0 / 5.3 / 4.8. depending on the year likely has the 4L80E (possible 4L60E) transmissions.. these are 4 speed lockup single Overdrive transmissions and in my opinion are good.. I put these transmissions in my hotrods over the years.. cars that I went out and lit the tires up on a regular basis.. the later model vans. got the 6L series transmissions which are 6 speed offerings similar to the above.. I cant remember what year they started those.



the fords typically got the 4R100 (I believe) in the 7.3s.. im not sure what trans were used in the 6.0s and after in the vans..



-Christopher
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Old 03-08-2019, 11:01 AM   #22
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the fords typically got the 4R100 (I believe) in the 7.3s.. im not sure what trans were used in the 6.0s and after in the vans..

-Christopher
My '04 6.0 Diesel Ford has a 5R110W
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Old 03-08-2019, 07:34 PM   #23
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Engines

If your not dead set on a diesel look at the Chevy and CMC cutaway buses. Can be had for cheap and are typically cheaper to own and operate. I picked up a shorty 2002 3500 Chevy with 65,000 miles and plenty of power. Gets about 14 mpg and gas is cheaper. Plus anywhere I take it I know parts and mechanics will and can work on it.

Ive also heard good things about the newer 6.0 Chevy gas engines and mpg
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Old 03-13-2019, 03:24 PM   #24
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Id find a 25 long bus with the DT466 and The 3036 Allison. (That transmission is a 6 speed and adjustable). The 17 passenger amtrans bus I picked up can flip a u turn easily- very maneuvereable in the city. Plus its a truck chassis, 25,800gvw. The smaller busses are practically at gvw as they are. Cheers
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Old 03-13-2019, 04:20 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Dirtdoctor View Post
Id find a 25 long bus with the DT466 and The 3036 Allison. (That transmission is a 6 speed and adjustable). The 17 passenger amtrans bus I picked up can flip a u turn easily- very maneuvereable in the city. Plus its a truck chassis, 25,800gvw. The smaller busses are practically at gvw as they are. Cheers
I found a 6 window IC that was around 23' long. It had an Allison 2000 and DT466E rated at 215 hp. That's the most "hot rodded" shorty I've found.
I bought it and man its got POWER for being a school bus. Soon as I saw it I knew I was gonna buy it. Usually the short buses don't come with more than 170-190 hp ratings.
A real shorty with a 3060 is probably very rare. I'm sure there are some out there somewhere but I've never seen one.
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Old 03-13-2019, 05:33 PM   #26
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Looking for bus

Have you looked at my
Bus Im selling? I posted it up here a couple weeks ago.
https://ventura.craigslist.org/cto/d/ventura-small-mid-size-bus-ready-for/6820881505.html
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Old 03-13-2019, 06:12 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
I cruise my red shorty with the 'E' 7.3, aka powerstroke 7.3 cousin, T-444E, etc.. its a full chassis shorty.. I drive that thing all over the country(just finished a 2700 mile trip) despite people telling me its a "pickup truck engine".. im over 182K miles now and it still runas good and starts in the cold weather easily.. I cranked up the Juice on mine so it even climbs mountains pretty good now.. I like it well enough that if / when i ever blow it up i'd build / rebuild / or drop another T-444E right back in....



ive had a brand new set of stage 1 injectors to put ion it for a year.. the originals are still in it and one or 2 is a bit "lazy" when the engine is cold.. I can hear them they sound diferent.. injectors on the E powerstroke or T-444E are probably the single biggest expense people have to do to them seemingly somewhere in the 175-225k range... although there are plenty running fine on original injectors well past that..



totally agree with ECCB's post that most of the reliable solid diesels were built before the 04 / 05 first stage emissions went into effect.. where IH got EGR, and CAT went ACERT.. that started the downfall of many


-Christopher
What did you do to make it climb mountains better.... I have an 03 7.3 and it climbs NC mountains just fine but had a hard time on the big passes in Colorado at high elevation. Almost losing power at the tops of passes. Would love to know what you did to get better mountain climbing
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Old 03-14-2019, 11:02 AM   #28
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I have a 1999 Bluebird short bus with a DT466E. It is basically the same as a long bus, except only 42 passenger, 7 rows of seats, with air rear suspension, air brakes, and the slushbox 545. The best advantage it has over the longer buses is it turns very sharp if you need it, and parking isn't as tough to find. It only gets 7 - 7.5 mpg, which is about what a long bus gets. Pretty much every engine you will find in front of a 545 is detuned to 200 hp or less, my 466 is rated at only 190 hp. even though a laptop can set it a lot higher.
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Old 03-14-2019, 02:45 PM   #29
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From what I've seen on the forums, the bigger engines aren't often found on the short(er) buses. I think I've seen some smaller cummins engines in some short buses, but not the larger ones with the greater reputation.

There are a couple people on here who have the T444e engines, who've re-programed them and boosted the power a little bit (10hp or so) and were very happy with the results. (Enough of a boost to make a difference, not enough to kill the engine reliability/longevity.)

Someone found a shortie Freightliner with Mercedes engine spec'd for a full-size bus a month or so ago, but that's the only one people have seen like it.

That was me: I have 2007 Freightliner Shortie Bus with a MB 900 engine and its powerful enough to do 65 down the road.
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Old 03-14-2019, 03:33 PM   #30
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That was me: I have 2007 Freightliner Shortie Bus with a MB 900 engine and its powerful enough to do 65 down the road.
HP rating isn't the real determining factor for top speed. Gearing is.
My 5 window with a Cat 3126 will do 80+. Its got 3.42 in the rear and full size tires. 190 hp 7.2 liter.
What's the mercedes you have rated at? its a 7.2 liter.
Around here the full size buses have the same engines as the short buses that aren't van-based. Usually a 170-190hp rating.
Highest rated shorty I've seen is 215.
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