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Old 05-06-2017, 01:56 PM   #11
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gray 6 pin is normally J-1708 which will run on the J-1587 protocol,
if its pin then its a 1939..

the TMS boxes were black-boxes, data recorders for the busses that read the data offd of the computer link... they opften were used for maintenance schedules and sometimes crash investigations.. i didnt see enough pics to know what all is there.. cool stuff though.
-Christopher
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Old 05-06-2017, 02:03 PM   #12
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I just looked that box up.. its maker was sold off in 2008.. it appeared to be a SATNAV based tracking / dispatch system.. makes sense for a new flyer which was likely a city-route bus at some point im guessing?

-Christopher
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Old 05-06-2017, 02:03 PM   #13
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The city of Houston ripped a bit of it out when they sold the bus, but the ZONAR stuff mounted around lends credence to your explanation. I tried to find information about some of this but hit a brick wall. What other pictures do you need?

I'm trying to identify what I should keep and what can go as I start ripping. I'm a techie, but even so the number of wires running to and fro boggles my mind....
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Old 05-06-2017, 02:14 PM   #14
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ZONAR is worthless get rid of it.. its mainly used to make sure the driver does the daily walk through of the bus.. theres usually buttons around the tires, engine bay, sometimes even underneath near the air tank drains, etc..

the orbital stuff is probably worthless now.. 9 years since the company was sold not likely to find any updates or parts for it... houston probably kept the stuff they still use for spare parts..

the round connectors are your diagnostic ports... youd have to trrace the wires to see if those are the main ones directly from the ECM (and possibly TCM(tranny)).. or if they were auxilalries for that TMS unit.. ..

its hards for me to go afyer that stuff remotely through pics.. im used to crawling around and ohming, and imagining how it was designed... often you can tell afterm,arket wiring from factory.. I know on both my busses i figured out what was factory and what was added by the differences in how wiring was routed, the tubing, and the wiring type / quality..

I tend to remove only what I need.. then drive the bus test all functions.. then yank a little more, do it over again till i end up seeing a WARN ENGINE light, or something just goes defunct and doesnt work anymore
-Christopher
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Old 05-06-2017, 02:14 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
I just looked that box up.. its maker was sold off in 2008.. it appeared to be a SATNAV based tracking / dispatch system.. makes sense for a new flyer which was likely a city-route bus at some point im guessing?

-Christopher
Wow, you're good. I hit a brick wall and couldn't go any further.

As for a city-route bus, yes, for the city of Houston. Unfortunately I don't know what the route was. The bus itself is more than capable of highway speeds (I think the rear-end ratio is 4.8.
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Old 05-06-2017, 02:23 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
ZONAR is worthless get rid of it.. its mainly used to make sure the driver does the daily walk through of the bus.. theres usually buttons around the tires, engine bay, sometimes even underneath near the air tank drains, etc..
Will do. I figured that was what that was from the ZONAR website.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
the orbital stuff is probably worthless now.. 9 years since the company was sold not likely to find any updates or parts for it... houston probably kept the stuff they still use for spare parts..
Yea, I figured I'd go ahead and put it up on eBay and see who bites, but I'd like to put a whole "package" up and get rid of it all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
the round connectors are your diagnostic ports... youd have to trrace the wires to see if those are the main ones directly from the ECM (and possibly TCM(tranny)).. or if they were auxilalries for that TMS unit.. ..
Ok. I'm hoping its the main ports. The previous owner said they were, but he also told me they were J1939....

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
its hards for me to go afyer that stuff remotely through pics.. im used to crawling around and ohming, and imagining how it was designed... often you can tell afterm,arket wiring from factory.. I know on both my busses i figured out what was factory and what was added by the differences in how wiring was routed, the tubing, and the wiring type / quality..
I tend to remove only what I need.. then drive the bus test all functions.. then yank a little more, do it over again till i end up seeing a WARN ENGINE light, or something just goes defunct and doesnt work anymore
-Christopher[/QUOTE]

I'll keep that in mind. I may end up following the same process since I'm going to be learning as I go. Thank you for the wisdom....
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Old 05-06-2017, 06:40 PM   #17
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for your ports.. if they have 9 pins in them then they are 1939, if they have 6 pins they are 1708's , most of the 1939's ive seen are green but that doesnt mean anything.. the number of pins calls it..

-Christopher
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Old 05-07-2017, 04:20 PM   #18
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I looked at my schematics and found the J1939 bus on it. It runs between the engine, tranny, and ABS brake controllers. According to the schematics it doesn't go anywhere else.

However, the ABS brake controller seems to have several J1708 ports. Guess I will get one of those USB-to-Jwhatever adapters and see what I can see.

It seems strange to me that New Flyer wouldn't have brought out either the J1939 or some other port for diagnostics - even an OBD/ODB-II. Any idea about that? Is that what the J1708 port(s) were for?
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Old 05-07-2017, 05:15 PM   #19
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that bus may run on J1708 and not use J1939 for the diagnostics.. there may be 1939 between basic controllers.. and then only 1708 for diagnostics.. OBD-II is consumer passenger automobiles only.. you wont find it on anything medium / Heavy duty..

to talk to it you'll not only need an interface but software for it.. I have a SilverLeaf VMSpc that talks 1708 and is a view only type device... i use it for my daily driving on a Tablet moiunted to the dash...

for read / write on my bus I have the Nexiq USBLink2 and then navistar gives away the basic software...

I dont klnow what software you would use for your bus? the VMSpc mioght work as a display only.. would have to hook it up and see what comes across...

-Christopher
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Old 05-07-2017, 05:25 PM   #20
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Yea, I found the sliverleaf from offgr1d's coach build thread and investigated. I like what I was seeing. However, I have programming skills and was wondering how far I could take that, so I'll look into the Nexiq.

Thanks!
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