What have I done!?

[spmccormick85]

Yes, I’ll look into them some more. Thanks for the link. This is great intel!

[superken]

I wish I had spent $15k on my bus. Instead I spent $5k. I have since spent an extra $10k on mechanical and it’s still nowhere near what I could have gotten for $15k. Meanwhile I have spent $35k converting it so there is no turning back. You may not fully regret it now,,, but you will.
I only spent $5k originally because I wasn’t sure it was going to be a viable solution. I can now say spending $15k originally would have made it more viable, and been a safer place to invest $35k.
Let me tell you they are viable. We figure we save $18k a year living in it, and our spot is nicer than any place we have ever rented.
Sell it and get one that will last a lifetime. I intend on my children living in mine when I am long gone!
Welcome to the club... let’s call this your initiation

[spmccormick85]

Damn, thanks for the honesty! That must have been super frustrating and I can totally foresee this is in my future with my current bus. It’s now starting to blow smoke from the exhaust fairly heavily and it’s a little overwhelming. I was told by the mechanic this thing was rock solid but I’m discovering very expensive little things that certainly don’t make me feel that way.

[EastCoastCB]

Originally Posted by Mekanic

This type of hyd brakes work quite well. The only reasonable way to convert to another type of brake system is to buy another donor vehicle



This is completely false. a much more likely scenario is for the pump to die or belt break and you will see a red light on the dash before the rear parking brake engages.
OR you start the engine and park brake pump will not make the required pressure to release the park brakes and you stay parked.

There is much more info on these brakes at https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum232/ (ford Truck enthusist )

My pump was bad and the truck BARELY stopped.

[EastCoastCB]

Originally Posted by superken

I wish I had spent $15k on my bus. Instead I spent $5k. I have since spent an extra $10k on mechanical and it’s still nowhere near what I could have gotten for $15k. Meanwhile I have spent $35k converting it so there is no turning back. You may not fully regret it now,,, but you will.
I only spent $5k originally because I wasn’t sure it was going to be a viable solution. I can now say spending $15k originally would have made it more viable, and been a safer place to invest $35k.
Let me tell you they are viable. We figure we save $18k a year living in it, and our spot is nicer than any place we have ever rented.
Sell it and get one that will last a lifetime. I intend on my children living in mine when I am long gone!
Welcome to the club... let’s call this your initiation

Buying a NICE bus from the get go is totally the way to go.
But price doesn't always mean a better bus. The same buses that dealers are selling for ten grand or more can be bought for a fraction of that at the same auctions the dealers are buying from.

[Thomas1985]

Yet there is a benefit to replacing everything yourself. For example I know that my transmission will now last me the duration of my ownership.

[Versatile]

Sell that TURD and get a good bus with good brakes. That 5.9 Cummins mechanical is your friend and a selling point. Do what you need to get by with getting a Motorhome title and add a $1k to selling price.

[superken]

Even with air brakes, I have hit ups and downs that had me sweating as the pedal got softer. Had to stop several times from them overheating.
I see nice flat noses with 50k miles for under $10k all the time on eBay, sometimes under $7k. Considering that a tranny rebuild at an Allison shop is 4 grand, fuel pump rebuild $2800. I had to spend $1300 just on my driveline bearings.
I say knowing things are freshly done is only as good as the person who does it and how much you shouldn’t have had to spend.
Your safety is paramount, you don’t need to be barreling down the road loaded with 30,000lbs wondering if your brakes are gonna hold, or if it’s gonna start after a week boondocking way out of range of a cell phone connection!
Good luck!

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by Rivetboy

"Someone told me THATS what causes those truck tire marks on the interstate that you see sometimes"

What those skidmarks you see are is a driver trying to slow down with the trailer brakes which the "Company" pays for as opposed to using up the brakes on their own rig which the owner operator pays for.

often what causes those long black trailer marks is an air brake cylinder failing on the trailer, this will cause the wheels on that side of the trailer to just lock up.. with only one set of wheels locked the drag on a fully loaded rig isnt as much as you might think. it may take the driver a bit to realize just whats going on and pull it over to the shoulder, thus thiose long black marks only on one side..

-Christopher

[Miles O Roads]

If you need to move it try getting ahold a export company they buy any that run.

[Mgulley82]

Almost every issue becomes a big one when you have to pay someone else to fix it for you

[Johnny Mullet]

I work on those Lucas Gerling brakes quite often. They were spec'd on a lot of trucks in my region and yes, they do suck because of parts and labor, but they can go many years trouble free. Normally when a truck with these brakes come into our shop with a brake issue, it's a leaking wheel cylinder and there are 2 per side. We buy the entire backing plate complete with everything new and just swap it out.

[spmccormick85]

Interesting. What would you estimate your repair price on the repair?

[cowlitzcoach]

I am the wrong person to ask about what to do with a Ford chassis bus.

IMHO, I would sell it for what I could get for it and get a better bus.

I have driven them all and Ford bus chassis do not ride as well, the steering is not as precise and tends to feel clunky, and the Lucas Gerling brakes area are a total PITA. In short, I don't like Fords and wouldn't have one if it was given to me. I will admit that it is a bit of a Ford vs. Chevy vs. Dodge sort of prejudice. But in my experience the IHC/IC chassis buses just performed better over time than any other OEM vendor supplied chassis under a Type 'C' school bus.

I always recommend air brakes for anyone contemplating a bus conversion for one main reason. With air brakes when you park for extended periods of time the worst thing that can happen is the linings rust and stick to the drums and it can be a challenge some times to get the brakes to release.

With hydraulic brakes, because the brake fluid is hydroscopic the brake fluid attracts water. The more water in the system the lower the boiling point. The lower the boiling point the more likely you can boil all of your brake fluid dry and end up with no service brakes half way down a long hill. The more water in the brake system the more problems you will encounter due to rust in the system. It will show up as leaking wheel cylinders, failing master cylinders, and rusted out steel brake lines. To combat the water problem you will need to invest in a water meter than can test the brake fluid for water contamination. When it reaches a certain point you will need to do a whole system flush. And hope that in the meantime the water hasn't rusted the wheel cylinders enough to case the seals to fail.

Johnny Mullet suggested that they are not a problem as he works on Gerling brake equipped trucks all the time. But those are rigs that are on the road all the time. A bus that could sit for several years as the conversion is completed and then sits more than it runs after the conversion is completed is a completely different animal from one that is on the road every week. I personally would not want to spend the time and $$$ necessary to go through the brakes on a Ford only to have to do it all over again three years later even though the bus has only traveled less than 10K miles all because the brake cylinders failed due to rust.

So my vote is to ditch this bus and look for a bus with an IHC/IC or Freightliner chassis as parts and service for them are available everywhere with affordable prices. The IHC S-series and 3X00 series of chassis set the standard for sightlines, steering cut angles, ride, and driver position. The Freightliner is a close second.

Good luck and I hope you make the decision on what to do based on what is best for you!

[EastCoastCB]

Originally Posted by cowlitzcoach

I am the wrong person to ask about what to do with a Ford chassis bus.

IMHO, I would sell it for what I could get for it and get a better bus.

I have driven them all and Ford bus chassis do not ride as well, the steering is not as precise and tends to feel clunky, and the Lucas Gerling brakes area are a total PITA. In short, I don't like Fords and wouldn't have one if it was given to me. I will admit that it is a bit of a Ford vs. Chevy vs. Dodge sort of prejudice. But in my experience the IHC/IC chassis buses just performed better over time than any other OEM vendor supplied chassis under a Type 'C' school bus.

I always recommend air brakes for anyone contemplating a bus conversion for one main reason. With air brakes when you park for extended periods of time the worst thing that can happen is the linings rust and stick to the drums and it can be a challenge some times to get the brakes to release.

With hydraulic brakes, because the brake fluid is hydroscopic the brake fluid attracts water. The more water in the system the lower the boiling point. The lower the boiling point the more likely you can boil all of your brake fluid dry and end up with no service brakes half way down a long hill. The more water in the brake system the more problems you will encounter due to rust in the system. It will show up as leaking wheel cylinders, failing master cylinders, and rusted out steel brake lines. To combat the water problem you will need to invest in a water meter than can test the brake fluid for water contamination. When it reaches a certain point you will need to do a whole system flush. And hope that in the meantime the water hasn't rusted the wheel cylinders enough to case the seals to fail.

Johnny Mullet suggested that they are not a problem as he works on Gerling brake equipped trucks all the time. But those are rigs that are on the road all the time. A bus that could sit for several years as the conversion is completed and then sits more than it runs after the conversion is completed is a completely different animal from one that is on the road every week. I personally would not want to spend the time and $$$ necessary to go through the brakes on a Ford only to have to do it all over again three years later even though the bus has only traveled less than 10K miles all because the brake cylinders failed due to rust.

So my vote is to ditch this bus and look for a bus with an IHC/IC or Freightliner chassis as parts and service for them are available everywhere with affordable prices. The IHC S-series and 3X00 series of chassis set the standard for sightlines, steering cut angles, ride, and driver position. The Freightliner is a close second.

Good luck and I hope you make the decision on what to do based on what is best for you!

I was given a 1985 Thomas on a Ford chassis. Totally correct on ALL that you just posted sir!
The thing rode horribly.

[cadillackid]

so is that 1975 Ford Superior im looking at getting likely to have these same Lucas brakes or were they an anomoly and not the norm?
-Christopher

[cowlitzcoach]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

so is that 1975 Ford Superior im looking at getting likely to have these same Lucas brakes or were they an anomoly and not the norm?
-Christopher

A Ford that old would have something even worse than the Lucas Girling brakes. It will have Ford brakes. The system Ford used on their medium duty trucks and bus chassis were F-350 style sized up appropriately. In other words very basic hydraulic brakes. The problem for Ford owners is that when Ford sold their medium duty line to Freightliner Ford sold all of the NOS parts and pieces as well. Freightliner sold all of the older than 10-year old NOS parts to other sources. If you need any parts and pieces for old medium duty Ford parts you have to go to the aftermarket or determine what parts from IHC will fit your Ford.

Wheel cylinders are available if you go into medium/heavy truck parts stores. I don't know if CARQUEST or NAPA would be able to help. I am thinking places like Potter Webster or Brake Systems, Inc. are going to be your best choices. Best being the operative word--if they don't have it you are probably SOL.

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Brake Systems Inc. - Manufacturers of Blue Ox Exhaust Brakes

The biggest problems with the Ford buses of that era is most were woefully underpowered. Most were sold with the Ford FE engines--331/361/391. I have never seen a school bus chassis that had from the factory the FE429 and definitely none with the Super Duty 534 V-8. Most had the 331 and it defined slow and thirsty. We had one Ford with the 331 and it always used to go 1-2 miles less per gallon than either the IHC or GM chassis buses.

If they had diesel power a lot were delivered with a Ford badged Cat 1160/3208. The Cat powered buses were much better for power than the gas buses. But it was a Cat V-8.

Those older Fords really defined rides like a truck. A day in one made you feel like you had been thumped all over. Part of what was fatiguing was the driver's position made you feel like you were sitting on the floor and your view was through the spokes of the steering wheel, no matter how high the seat was set. Part of what made the ride so hard was the geometry--it seemed to transfer a lot more of the road shock into the steering wheel and into the front of the bus. It just seemed to thump, thump, thump wherever you went.

[EastCoastCB]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

so is that 1975 Ford Superior im looking at getting likely to have these same Lucas brakes or were they an anomoly and not the norm?
-Christopher

I'd think a hotrodder like you would probably figure out some way of having the most technologically advanced brakes known to man on your classic bus.
If this bus is just for vintage nostalgia/collector type purposes I'd say follow you dream and built it to suit your needs.

[spmccormick85]

Thanks to all who posted in here. A lot of varying opinions that helped me make my decision to hopefully sell this thing.

[Nomadusa]

Love my hydraulic brakes