Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 08-25-2016, 12:51 PM   #31
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by chad.nuesmeyer View Post
Any input on the international 7.3L motor? My 466 turned out to be a dud... needs rebuilt (and that might be the best case). My quick research says that the International could be more expensive to maintain than a DT466 or a Cummins 8+ but, it should be less than the Mercedes or Cat... Is that true?

Also, I was looking at traditional Amtran body styles but, prices seem really high when compared to a flat front... This got me thinking about my use case. I don't want a full length, I am thinking about a 28-30 foot length but, winter driving &/or dirt roads will happen nearly every outing. Regular driving up steep canyon roads... I don't want to get a CDL so, scratch the Air Brakes (UT requires CDL for air brakes - as does Canada).

I think, I want the engine up front to put weight on the front wheels for steering control. If it were a rear engine, and I put water tanks in the rear (even if they were mid-body), that would reduce the weight on steering wheels. Although, rear engine and rear mounted water tanks would offer more traction.... What has experience taught this crew? Am I creating an issue where non exists?

The other factor on the front end, one of the brokers I have been talking with says that south american bus exports love the amtran body style and are causing a price inflation on the body style. However, flat fronts are not seeing the same inflation. Just a data point. I am not opposed to a flat front... I get more living space on the total vehicle length of 30'. The shorter flat fronts like the TC1000 have a completely flat surface through the interior (no wheel wells) but, the wheels are smaller... Not sure what the net impact of that would be...

Thanks in Advance - I know I am throwing a lot out there on this one beyond the 466 vs. 444 - Thanks Again.
Rebuild the 466.............cheap to rebuild, easy to rebuild...........
ntrain6942 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2016, 04:35 PM   #32
Bus Nut
 
GreyCoyote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Danglebury, Tejas
Posts: 310
Year: 1999
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: IH 3800
Engine: Navistar DT466E
Rated Cap: 72 passenger
I just drove my 1999 Blue Bird 72 pax from Houston to Reno. It has the DT466 and the much maligned AT545. This thing is a HOSS. Love this engine!

I passed a guy in a short bus with the T444/AT545 on a hill and later chatted with him at a fuel stop. We compared notes. SO glad I got the DT! My bus crawls the hills like a 12 ton leech at 40 mph. His does the same hills about 32 mph, tops, and he has to stop to cool off. He lives in fear of hills. I find them a simple annoyance.

As others have stated, there is absolutely nothing wrong with the 444. Good motor! But if you have to deal with hills, brute torque is king, and that would be the DT466. It is, after all, a motor built for grunt power in tractors, combines, etc.

Yes, I am now officially and unabashedly a DT466 fan boy.
__________________
"You can finally say you have enough horsepower when you leave two black streaks from corner to corner"
(Mark Donohue, famed TransAm driver)
GreyCoyote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2016, 05:42 PM   #33
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 6,760
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International S3800
Engine: DT360
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
what happened to your DT-466? its in fact destroyed from getting hot?
-Christopher
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2016, 07:42 PM   #34
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 485
Year: 2000
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: International
Engine: TE 444
Rated Cap: 12
29 foot bus for sale
http://www.skoolie.net/forums/f14/97...ale-11815.html
$2000
Kubla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2016, 06:40 AM   #35
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 6,760
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International S3800
Engine: DT360
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
Quote:
Originally Posted by ntrain6942 View Post
Rebuild the 466.............cheap to rebuild, easy to rebuild...........
easy to rebuuld if you have the tools to get the head lifted off and transported to a machine shop for work... the rest looks pretty straightforward.. except maybe dropping the tranny to be able to replace the rear main seals which should be part of any rebuild.. (again tools) I think the 466 uses a one piece rear main seal?

otherwise an inframe isnt bad to do.. time, being casreful and paying attention to how it came apart, and reading is the most important thing...

-Chris
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2016, 07:59 AM   #36
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: KANSAS CITY
Posts: 494
DOH! Not very familiar with those flat nose buses as my post revealed.thanks
__________________
Former owner of a 1969 F600 Skoolie.

1998 Ford B700 Thomas body 65 passenger. 5.9 Cummins 12 valve with MT643 Transmission 123,000 miles.
Versatile is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2016, 08:48 AM   #37
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
what happened to your DT-466? its in fact destroyed from getting hot?
-Christopher
This response towards me?

What happened is that on the long hill up, I thought there was no antifreeze in the engine. What actually happened now that Ive had time to go through the bus mechanically is that the throttle linkage and transmission kickdown line were quite worn, so up that hill the transmission never kicked down out of OD. I had nearly an inch of play between the transmission kickdown linkage and throttle to the engine. The engine didn't get destroyed. It did overheat briefly, but after doing a full fluid check, all is well.
ntrain6942 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2016, 08:56 AM   #38
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
easy to rebuuld if you have the tools to get the head lifted off and transported to a machine shop for work... the rest looks pretty straightforward.. except maybe dropping the tranny to be able to replace the rear main seals which should be part of any rebuild.. (again tools) I think the 466 uses a one piece rear main seal?

otherwise an inframe isnt bad to do.. time, being casreful and paying attention to how it came apart, and reading is the most important thing...

-Chris
Not many tools needed for the in frame engine rebuild, but obviously you will need a friend to help lift the head off, lol. Mechanical diesel engines are about as easy as it comes to repairing/rebuilding/maintaining. I was quoted $8-10k for a rebuild on my DT466 in frame if I ever needed one done. No way, the rebuild kit is about $1k shipped on ebay. Having the head checked at a machine shop(magnaflux, decked if needed, valves checked, cleaned and replaced if needed: $250-500 tops)..............2 day job for a novice in reality with a service manual and a 30 pack of his favorite brews, and about $1500-$2k in parts.........cheap, easy to do.
ntrain6942 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2016, 08:57 AM   #39
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 6,760
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International S3800
Engine: DT360
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
Quote:
Originally Posted by ntrain6942 View Post
This response towards me?

What happened is that on the long hill up, I thought there was no antifreeze in the engine. What actually happened now that Ive had time to go through the bus mechanically is that the throttle linkage and transmission kickdown line were quite worn, so up that hill the transmission never kicked down out of OD. I had nearly an inch of play between the transmission kickdown linkage and throttle to the engine. The engine didn't get destroyed. It did overheat briefly, but after doing a full fluid check, all is well.

oops I got the people mixed up... for some reason i thought the OP had overheated their engine... yeah the Transmission cable can definitely casuse Lugging indeed.. im glad your engine is ok.. what it means is your engine is strong and ready to rock since it got hot and no ill effects.. if it was weak you wouldve seen it then.

-Christopher
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2016, 09:31 AM   #40
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Steve View Post
Hey Everyone,

I am on a quest for a bus and have been looking for a good conversion candidate.

I am really stuck on having an MD3060 or an MT643 transmission and a DT466 or 8.3 Cummins.

I have found some 40' Thomas & International busses with the appropriate transmission but the DT466 equipped that I have looked at have all been 300-400k mile rigs. I have found a couple that are under 200k miles, priced right and look good but they have the T444 engine.

What do you all think of the T444 in this application versus the DT466?

Thanks
IMO take the DT466(regardless of HP/TQ version) all day long regardless of mileage over a T444 or a 6BT 5.9l Cummins engine(regardless of their HP/TQ versions). Both the smaller engines are good, but they are technically light to medium duty quarter to half million mile engines with SOLID maintenance..........not million mile engines like the DT466 with SOLID maintenance. The DT466 is a medium to heavy duty motor. As for the Transmission, the MT643 is great, if you can get a DT466 with one, great, but if it has the AT545 don't fret, that transmission is ALOT more rugged than a lot of ppl give it credit for, in reality its basically as strong as the MT643.
ntrain6942 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.