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Old 06-13-2017, 03:35 PM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
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What's your opinion on this?

Hey guys,

I wanted to get some opinions on my new bus. I bought a 2001 International FE w/ the DT466E and Ally Md-3060 tranny. Drove it ~1000 miles home. (Well, drove it after some MAJOR problems, more on this later) When on the Interstate, at the governed 65mph, she cruises at ~1650rpm. Pretty sure this is in 5th (OD). At the slightest hint of a hill, and I mean slightest, like maybe 1% grade it'll drop a gear to 4th, then shift right back to 5th. It does this 3 times, before staying in 4th for a few minutes, until it kicks back into OD. I'm thinking the cruise rpm's are just too low and it thinks it needs to downshift too keep the power up, but at 65 the governor kicks in a cuts engine power until it slows to about 63 then it'll kick back in. I thought I read somewhere that this engine needs a cruise rpm of 1800-2000rpm to operate at peak efficiency. Am I wrong in thinking this??

I was thinking of getting the governor taken off so she'll cruise at 70 or 75 mph, which should put me around 1800 rpm. What do you all think??
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Old 06-13-2017, 03:44 PM   #2
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Any international dealer can change the governor speed
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Old 06-13-2017, 03:57 PM   #3
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Hi Kubla! That was a quick reply!

I already have the ServiceMax software, just need the interface cable so I can go in to the ECM and remove the governor setting. I guess what I was more or less getting at is does that "behavior" seem normal for the ally or should I look at something a little more serious, like maybe slippage, worn parts, etc. that might require a tranny rebuild.
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Old 06-13-2017, 03:58 PM   #4
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Wonder if Catterpiggle would do the same.
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Old 06-13-2017, 04:38 PM   #5
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A fluid And filter change won't hurt a bit and a good starting point as a new to you bus.
You can smell if the fluid is burnt when you change it.
Also tranny fluid temp. Guage's would tell you a lot if you don't have one I would look into getting one as well as looking at the tranny cooler if you have one to see if the fins are stopped up with dust,dirt,debris and anything else.
Basic preventative maintenance stuff.
Good luck
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Old 06-14-2017, 12:17 PM   #6
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Thanks Jolly Roger!

Yes, PM issues are on the plate. I guess maybe I should just get the filters and fluids changed first and then see how she operates. That might just take care of the "issue." I wanted to put Ally's Transynd fluid in it but can't find it locally, which means I'll probably have to purchase from the nearest Allison dealer which is about 2 hrs. away. I have never driven a bus of this size before, so the trip home was getting used to her! The last few months in the military I drove a smaller BB shuttling folks around, but that was 17+ yrs ago now!

As far as the tranny visually, she doesn't look to bad. The cooling lines on the front are pretty caked with gunk but I am not sure if that is from leaking lines or the engine oil that dumped all down the underside and all over the front axle (major problem referenced to in the first post). Coming home, the tranny temp gauge never broke about 200-210?, even on longer uphill climbs. This 3060 is extremely loud though. The only time I could actually hear the engine was when the torque converter was locked up in 5th, on nearly flat stretches of road or going downhill. The rest of the time she sounds like a freakin' jet engine, completely drowns out engine noise, road noise, etc. On a few of the mountain passes I manually selected 4th on the shift pad and the engine rpm kicked up to about 2100 rpm, and I still could not hear the engine over the tranny! I was just unsure if this was "normal" for the 3060. After the engine fiasco I do not have the money to get her into the ally dealer to be checked out, -sigh- so I'll start with fluids and filters and go from there!
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Old 06-15-2017, 10:08 AM   #7
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Has anyone used Shell's Spirax S6 fluids for the tranny? It's on Allison's approved TES-295 fluid list. If so, what are your impressions? The local NAPA can order this fluid. How much does the 3060 take and what filters do I need? Sorry for all the questions but I don't have any manuals for this bus, so nothing to cover regular service intervals, types and amounts of fluids, etc., etc. Thx
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Old 06-15-2017, 11:14 AM   #8
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Sorry, don't have any answers for you but hopefully this helps.

My Transmission
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Old 06-15-2017, 11:25 AM   #9
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I am no expert but seems a little warm to me, I drove about 200 miles when I got my bus and it I went over the continental divide the trans temp did not even brake 100 hardly.

I agree with everyone I would start with a fuild and filter change.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mattn75 View Post
Coming home, the tranny temp gauge never broke about 200-210?, even on longer uphill climbs.
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Old 06-15-2017, 11:48 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigskypc50 View Post
I am no expert but seems a little warm to me, I drove about 200 miles when I got my bus and it I went over the continental divide the trans temp did not even brake 100 hardly.
My gauge starts at 100 but I have the 643. It's never gone above 150. The bus following me (when purchased) has the 3060. Her gauge starts at 150, never went much above that with a severe leak (crushed hose fitting unknown at the time).
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Old 06-15-2017, 12:20 PM   #11
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Md3060

I have a '98 TC2000 (37ft) with a 5.9FE and the MD3060. We're about 24k lbs. usually. I've sat literally right next to it for about 8k miles now. I can't say I've heard the tranny AT ALL over the purr of the 5.9. I've driven most of the mountain passes in CO and Raton in NM (several times). I get a downshift on climbing, sometimes down to 3rd. It does seem, that the tranny WANTS to be in 5th. It will upshift any chance it gets, even as low as 40mph. If I'm entering a sustained climb, or switchbacks with up and down, I usually will auto select no higher than 4th to stop the 'hunting'. I talked to a seasoned Allison guy here in town at one of our Alison shops, and he said the TCM is sometimes too smart for it's own good, and if you change your weight, it will hunt around a while as the TCM is collecting data to alter the shift points based on load. He said this can account for early or late, or hard clunky shifts. As far as trans temp, I only have the warning light, so cant help there. I wish I was running at 1800-2000rpm up the hills! With the 5.9, I have to run upwards of 2900rpm! Let us know what you find out please! And, congratulations!
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Old 06-15-2017, 02:31 PM   #12
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You sure it's the transmission and not something simple like the fan engaging? All the 3060's I've ever been around were all very quiet compared to the engine.

Fluid will get warm if it's shifting back and forth trying to decide on a gear. I'd bump up your speed limiter to like 70 and see what you get then.

We use the s6 in all of the newer allison transmissions. No problems with it whatsoever. Napa used to carry a valvoline equivalent(name slips me) that we used a few times with no issues. It just wasn't tes295 certified although it supposedly met the specs according to valvoline.
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Old 06-19-2017, 02:00 AM   #13
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Hope the fluid and filter change improve the situation. And that is not something worst.
Best of luck,
Raul

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Old 06-19-2017, 02:05 PM   #14
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Thanks for all the replies folks! Sorry I didn't post over the weekend. I've been busy gutting the interior. Few pieces of plywood floor left to pull up, and some interior skins to pull down in prep for spray foam insulation. Plus I spent the better part of a day finding an air leak and trying to fix it. After the second attempt at fixing the air leak (its coming from a protection valve behind the drivers side wiper access panel) we took it out for a quick test drive. The tranny is operating much better in this cooler climate (Wyoming) as opposed to Phoenix. Temp gauge stayed below 150 on a 20 mile drive over some of our "smaller hills"! Haven't changed out the fluids and filters yet, wanted to concentrate on the conversion first since it won't be driven much until that's done.

@Booyah - My first thought was the fan kicking on too, but the fan engages long before the tranny noise picks up. We have a few small drives planned to move the bus around and to dispose of the seats and other stuff gutted from the interior in the next couple weeks and I'll keep an eye and ear out for problems.

I did check the fluid levels and they were fine, fluid didn't smell burnt, and was bright red in color. I may leave these fluids in for the time being, try bumping up the governed speed to get the rpm's up a little more so it's not trying to hunt for the right gear so much and go from there. I'll keep everyone posted as to what I find out.
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Old 06-19-2017, 05:16 PM   #15
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most generally the TCM wants to shift early than late but floor-boarding will generally tell the TCM you are looking for more power and it will downshift.. if that downshift plasces you over the Maximum shift RPM thats put in the TCM, it will generally upshift up again.. and repeat because it then thinks you are looking for more power... at some point all this shifting lowers your speed enough that the RPM goes below Max upshift and it will hold in the lower gear for you...

alot depends on how the ECM-TCM communication is handled.. and what the TCM is programmed to look at.. if engine loading factor is one of the parameters used and the engine de-rates due to speed limiter or RPM limiter you may get the hunting effect then..

the TCM "learns" your normal driving habits.. so if the norm for your bus is generally flat ground then you go take it in the Big-Boy hills, its going to take a bit to Learn to run the mountains...

-Christopher
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Old 06-19-2017, 06:02 PM   #16
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Are you sure the whining is from the tranny?
I drove a box truck for awhile that had a whine to it and a clunk every now and then. after several attempts from shops to find and repair it. it ended up being the rear end going out. And the sound vibrated up the drive shaft which made it sound like the tranny.
Check the oil in the rear end or just drain and fill with some new stuff to see if it helps?
Good luck.
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