Which axle?

Evil Morty · 04-25-2019, 10:14 AM

Hi, new here. Intro post later on today. - have a 1990 IH shorty with DT motor and rotten 545 transmission. It's at the shop getting the lift pump and oil changed and hopefully not the main bearings. I want higher top speed. My local yard had hundreds of rear axles, but are listed by the axles name. Eaton xxx or Rockwell xxx. How do I know what axle I have? The tag and bus are 2 hours away, I'm trying to have a rear gear lined up for when I get it back home. Any ideas?

WARGEAR · 04-25-2019, 11:03 AM

Do you know the VIN of your bus? If you’ve got the papers for it on hand it’ll be on the there. Call up International with the VIN and they’ll tel you what they built the bus chassis with.

Evil Morty · 04-25-2019, 11:30 AM

Got it! I'll try that on lunch today. Thanks, I never thought of that.

Brad_SwiftFur · 04-25-2019, 01:32 PM

Not sure when it was introduced, but mine ('01) has the Spicer N175 axle (saw references for this in the mid 90's).

Evil Morty · 04-25-2019, 02:25 PM

Call the IH dealer. It's a Dana with 4.78 gears. Which dana, it didn't say. But that's a big start.

Evil Morty · 04-25-2019, 08:52 PM

I'm guessing it's the N series, n175 n190 n210, and that the gears had been changed at some point. Using their rpm calculator with what I know to be true, rpms, tire size and gps speed, I'm thinking the gears are 5.63. A set of 4.44 would be great. Vander Haags has them for $500-650 for a whole used carrier.

Is there anyway to know the spline count on the axle shaft without removing it?

TJones · 04-25-2019, 10:09 PM

To know what axle you have for sure see if the shop it's at can take a look at the ID tag on the axle. You don't want to guess if your swapping carriers.

Ted

Booyah45828 · 04-26-2019, 07:53 AM

Don't guess on what you need to purchase. Sorry to say it, but you should be there and look at the axle in person before you purchase anything.

If the axle ratio that international has listed doesn't match, who's to say the axle itself matches? I'd hate to see you buy a $500 part that you don't need, can't return, and end up stuck with.

Evil Morty · 04-26-2019, 11:58 AM

After pouring over pages of them, i'm not going to buy anything till I see what I have. Too many spline counts and other possibilities. I'm happy with finding a local source with just about any ration I could want.

Jolly Roger bus 223 · 04-26-2019, 02:57 PM

I have a salvage yard near me that I use off and on that is not a pick and pull ,won't let you in there yard to look at anything before you pay for it. But you have to pay for it before there mechanics will pull it?
Anyway?
They have a sign at the counter that says
If YOU paid for the wrong part.
YOU now have a spare!

FamilyCircus · 05-01-2019, 08:31 PM

Ive got a 2000 Amtran (International) FE and it has a Spicer/Dana N190 with the 39 spline axles.

The N175, N190, N210, N320, N400 all use the same ring and pinion on the rear axle if its a dual axle.

You can get the part number for the set and look on Ebay for ring and pinions for these old axles. They come up from time to time since they are obsolete by today's commercial standards.

I scored a 3.91 set for 175 shipped. My part number was a 1665359c91, I bought this set because Allison wont open up my 6th gear.

If you change the last two digits before the C up or down and google it you will get the different available ratios.
These are pretty easy to change and cheaper than a whole carrier.
Just and Idea

Brad_SwiftFur · 05-01-2019, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FamilyCircus

Ive got a 2000 Amtran (International) FE and it has a Spicer/Dana N190 with the 39 spline axles.

The N175, N190, N210, N320, N400 all use the same ring and pinion on the rear axle if its a dual axle.

You can get the part number for the set and look on Ebay for ring and pinions for these old axles. They come up from time to time since they are obsolete by today's commercial standards.

I scored a 3.91 set for 175 shipped. My part number was a 1665359c91, I bought this set because Allison wont open up my 6th gear.

If you change the last two digits before the C up or down and google it you will get the different available ratios.
These are pretty easy to change and cheaper than a whole carrier.
Just and Idea

What's involved in a simple ring and pinion change? Some axles you have to measure gear lash and shim and such, which I'd prefer to avoid.

Kubla · 05-01-2019, 08:38 PM

if your bus does 62 miles MPH at 2600 RPM, you most likely do have the 4.78 gears, that is what my old bus had with 10R22.5 tires, since there is no lock up, you get about 10 percent slip in the torque converter at speed, you really want some 4.10 gears, which will get you to 70 mph at 2600 rpm

FamilyCircus · 05-01-2019, 08:46 PM

It depends where you get your gears. If they are used then they might come with the pinion bearings with the cups.

To install them you need a $45 bolt kit to bolt the new ring gear to the diff carrier, you need 1 to 3 bearings for the pinion gear then the set up instructions are on the net if you look for spicer N400 or any one of the various iterations of the N axle. There are no shims, the diff carrier bearing housings are threaded which gives you your side to side adjustment of the ring gear.

Then the pinion has a crush sleeve, I think, I cant remember, but its pretty simple just labor really.

Just be careful, the diff carrier is very heavy, treat it with respect.

Bolt kit part number is 1696994C91

If you look at the torque curve of the DT466E, 2600 rpm is way to high, Im guessing more in 1700 - 2000 rpm is best for this engine.

As an example, my engine and tranny are a DT466e with the MD3060 with only 5 speeds. My tires are 41" tall and are the 11R22.5 and my gear ratios are my current 4.44 or my other set 3.91

With the 3.91 and going 65mpg I would be at 1562 RPM
With the 4.44 and going 65mph I would be at 1775 RPM

Food for thought.

Evil Morty · 05-02-2019, 10:38 AM

All good info, thanks! I have the DT360, so I'm thinking I need to be in the 2-2200 range at 65. It might get used to tow my race car if my truck is down.

o1marc · 05-02-2019, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubla

if your bus does 62 miles MPH at 2600 RPM, you most likely do have the 4.78 gears, that is what my old bus had with 10R22.5 tires, since there is no lock up, you get about 10 percent slip in the torque converter at speed, you really want some 4.10 gears, which will get you to 70 mph at 2600 rpm

I have a 99 International with a 4.78. If I was turning 2600 I'd be close to 100mph

EastCoastCB · 05-02-2019, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by o1marc

I have a 99 International with a 4.78. If I was turning 2600 I'd be close to 100mph

1:1 vs OD
I'm pretty sure OP's bus has a 545 or 643.

o1marc · 05-02-2019, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EastCoastCB

1:1 vs OD
I'm pretty sure OP's bus has a 545 or 643.

good reasons not to own a 545.

EastCoastCB · 05-02-2019, 11:36 AM

Pretty tough to find a good old mechanical engine in a bus with OD.

brokedown · 05-02-2019, 12:01 PM

On that note, I just notice all those nicely priced MT643's at LKQ are gone. Guess I missed that chance.

I haven't found an online outlet that will sell a 4.10 knuckle for the spider J190s for under $500 yet. if I do find one I'd be particularly tempted to learn how to do that job.

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