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Old 04-15-2018, 04:00 AM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 17
just bought a 1977 gillig transit bus

I know there is a Caterpillar engine in it and a allison transmission how do I find out which caterpillar engine and which allison I have? Please if anyone knows how to find out. Thank you.
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Old 04-15-2018, 07:40 AM   #2
Skoolie
 
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Location: Brunswick, GA
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Year: 1999
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: TC2000
Engine: 5.9 Cummins
Rated Cap: 84
The newer Allisons have a dataplate on the side of the transmission. Mine had a few layers of crud built up, but was legible with a little cleaning. Hopefully the CAT has one as well.
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Old 04-16-2018, 12:35 AM   #3
Mini-Skoolie
 
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Thanks I'll check it out. It's an older one so I hope it has it.
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Old 04-16-2018, 12:43 AM   #4
Bus Crazy
 
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I assume you are talking about a Gillig Classic Schoolcoach with the engine in the rear.

What model is your Gillig? The three digit number denotes which engine was in the bus originally.

If it is a Cat it might be a 1160 or the newer 3208 V-8. There were not a whole lot of other Cat engines used in school buses back in the day.

Many of those buses came from the factory with the Cummins 555 which were later repowered to a lot of different engines with the 3208 the most common repower.

Less common were the Detroit 8.2L and the Detroit 6V-53.

Still available in 1977 was the Ford Super Duty 534 gas V-8. Most of those were repowered as well and usually with the 3208.

The most likely automatic transmission would be the MT643. It will have lock up in 3rd and 4th gear so it will shift like it has six speeds forward with the top gear 1:1. Less likely would be the MT653 which would have a deep low first gear and the top gear a 1:1 gear.
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Old 04-16-2018, 01:34 AM   #5
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
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Wow thank you for this info! Yes it is a classic gillig school coach. Excuse me for my lack of knowledge i'm just starting the bus life. Where is the model number located on the bus? I've looked on the title and can't find it. Also what is lock up in 3rd and 4th gear mean? I don't think I have that. It has numbers 123DNR on the automatic stick shift lever. And again i'm sorry, but what is a top gear 1:1 mean. Any more schooling is much appreciated. Thanks
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Old 04-16-2018, 07:23 AM   #6
Bus Geek
 
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Location: Owasso, OK
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Year: 1999
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Saf-T-Liner MVP ER
Engine: Cummins 6CTA8.3 Mechanical MD3060
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buster13 View Post
Wow thank you for this info! Yes it is a classic gillig school coach. Excuse me for my lack of knowledge i'm just starting the bus life. Where is the model number located on the bus? I've looked on the title and can't find it. Also what is lock up in 3rd and 4th gear mean? I don't think I have that. It has numbers 123DNR on the automatic stick shift lever. And again i'm sorry, but what is a top gear 1:1 mean. Any more schooling is much appreciated. Thanks
There will be a data plate on the side of the transmission. The type will be on there.

A lock-up toque convertor is one where the clutches "lock" mechanically in certain gears removing the fluid from the drive-train.
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Old 04-16-2018, 08:22 AM   #7
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 18
1:1 means one revolution of the engine equals one revolution of the tranny output (drive shaft). On a rear engine model, that would be the pinion gear in the transaxle, not the output shaft to the wheel.
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Old 04-16-2018, 08:28 AM   #8
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 18
On "some" vehicles, there is a "Build Tag" which has codes that tell all the equipment used to build the bus. Including axle gear ratios, tire sizes, engine and tranny data, etc.... Usually located in an inconspicuous place.
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Old 04-16-2018, 09:58 PM   #9
Bus Crazy
 
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If your shift quadrant has RND321 then you will most likely have the MT643. It will shift from 1st (torque convertor), to 2nd (torque convertor), to 3rd (torque convertor), to 3rd (lock up), to 4th (torque convertor), and finally to 4th (lock up). When you are climbing a hill you want to be in one of the lock up gears if at all possible. You will generate a whole lot less heat in lock up than in torque convertor mode.

Gillig bus model #'s were originally found in the little chrome rectangle found just below the Gillig name plate on the front of the bus.

The model #'s can also be found on the builder's tag inside.

If the bus came from the factory with a diesel engine the model number was preceded by a "D" before the number.

534=Ford Super Duty gas V-8
501=IHC Red Diamond gas I-6, either rear engine or pancake
450=IHC Red Diamond gas I-6, either rear engine or pancake
590=Hall-Scott gas I-6 pancake
636=Cat 1160/3208
318=Detroit Diesel 6V-53
555=Cummins Triple Nickel V-8
170/180/190=Cummins I-6
426=Detroit Diesel 6-71 pancake
743=Cummins small cam 220/262 HP pancake
855=Cummins big cam 270-400 HP pancake
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Old 04-18-2018, 02:35 AM   #10
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
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Thanks, much appreciated.
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