Wiring spaghetti vomit hell

[Joe45]

That's a lot of information.
Gonna get one of those tone contraptions for sure!


All those wires just seem like a needless nightmare outside of all th blinking lights and flapping things, but I am worried that, upon cutting them, the bus will go into never start again mode.

[Danjo]

Do the wires have circuit numbers stamped in them?

[Joe45]

Originally Posted by Danjo

Do the wires have circuit numbers stamped in them?

Not that I have noticed.





I've also thought of another option, which is to start at the unnecessary lights etc. and remove from there back, labeling the cut. So I could remove the overhead flasher lights, for example, then follow the wire as I remove it, labeling the cut piece left behind just in case.


Don't see the need for having a bunch of wire looms for things I don't need. Seems like leaving them is more of a recipe for confusion in the future if the need arises to trouble shoot.

[rffffffff]

You may find that the ‘school bus lights’ all have big pink wires like mine did, which helped me sort through faster. If you look at the back of the lamp warning panel it can help you identify which ones are which too.

On my bus, at least, the starter interlock did not run through the top of the front so you probably will not have issues starting the bus if you mess up, but you could end up with no brake lights or clearance lights or something else that prevents you from driving so be reasonably careful. If you have a second pair of eyes and check what stopped working each time you cut it’ll help a bit too.

[Rivetboy]

Originally Posted by Joe45

Not that I have noticed.





I've also thought of another option, which is to start at the unnecessary lights etc. and remove from there back, labeling the cut. So I could remove the overhead flasher lights, for example, then follow the wire as I remove it, labeling the cut piece left behind just in case.


Don't see the need for having a bunch of wire looms for things I don't need. Seems like leaving them is more of a recipe for confusion in the future if the need arises to trouble shoot.

I understand that have no need to go this route the tool is reasonable but the tape is pricey. It is a professional tool though and really steps up your electrical installations. It also makes regular labels and the wire markers are heat shrink. Or, a inexspensive alternative is Scotch 33 in white labeled with a sharpie wrapped around the conductor and stuck to itself. Spares are good, they are way easier than pulling new wire in the bus and you can coil them up and just tuck them back out of sight. The label is what gives them future value as you know where both ends are.

[Joe45]

That's a good way to go. If I do remove wires, I will label all of them, at both ends!

[TJones]

Originally Posted by Rivetboy

I understand that have no need to go this route the tool is reasonable but the tape is pricey. It is a professional tool though and really steps up your electrical installations. It also makes regular labels and the wire markers are heat shrink. Or, a inexspensive alternative is Scotch 33 in white labeled with a sharpie wrapped around the conductor and stuck to itself. Spares are good, they are way easier than pulling new wire in the bus and you can coil them up and just tuck them back out of sight. The label is what gives them future value as you know where both ends are.

Now I have label maker envy. Mine doesn't do heat shrink. That would be handy.

Ted

[Rivetboy]

Originally Posted by TJones

Now I have label maker envy. Mine doesn't do heat shrink. That would be handy.

Ted

I totally have 260 HP envy Joe

[Rivetboy]

Originally Posted by Joe45

That's a good way to go. If I do remove wires, I will label all of them, at both ends!

Wait,if you remove them you are going to label them at both ends? I think I know what you are saying also, taking lots of pictures of before and after of wiring or anything is a good idea. Personally has saved my butt countless times.

[Joe45]

For sure. I already had a scare when I disconnected that stinking signal box thing overhead and lost my tail lights.



Seems like the people designing vehicles want to make things as complicated as possible!

[FuzzWantsABus]

I took out all my excess wires because I took out the giant heater core/electrical panel that was next to the driver's door. I also ended up re-wiring the rear lights, and re-routing all the wiring to outside the bus, under the floor. I did this so that I could spray foam the inside, and still be able to access all my wiring and connections, in case of need for repair. HOWEVER, I had the wiring diagram for my bus, and (except for a couple small instances), all the wires were clearly labeled and hadn't been modified post-factory. I didn't have any problems that I didn't create myself being lazy or careless. On the other hand, never in a million billion years would I have attempted that project without the wiring diagram.

[Joe45]

Is there somewhere to find the wiring diagram, or is it one of those pretty much different for each bus?

[FuzzWantsABus]

Mine came with my bus from the factory, but I imagine would apply to anyone with a 2000 International 3800CE. I'm sure they're different from make to make, but I would think would be reasonably similar from model to model.

[Joe45]

Originally Posted by FuzzWantsABus

Mine came with my bus from the factory, but I imagine would apply to anyone with a 2000 International 3800CE. I'm sure they're different from make to make, but I would think would be reasonably similar from model to model.

I'll have to see if I can hunt something down.


Thanks!

[Liveinashortbus]

Originally Posted by rffffffff

I removed the wires and relocated the switches that were up top to the lower switch panel left of the driver. It cleaned a lot up and made room for my bookshelf over the whole front of the bus.

I added a couple of relays so you can turn the front four schoolbus lights on with a switch and changed them to reverse lights so I can have outdoor lighting if I need it in front of the bus, and I used a relay to make the back bus lights additional brake lights. That was a bad plan, because it blinds anyone behind me, so I’m going to disconnect them at some point and do something else, maybe more white reverse lights on a switch.

The wiring up into the front upper compartment contained the warning system for the lights, but also the mirror controls, the stereo, the five front marker lights, additional exterior speaker and all of the switches up there.

Once I got it all apart I just carefully brought the wires down to the other switch panel or got rid of them, mostly at the source if I could as I didn’t want to leave any hot wires tied up in a bundle, and it all worked out okay. The warning system needs to be bypassed carefully because if you just unplug it a lot of your lights just won’t work, maybe even brake lights and reverse lights. I had to trace the wires to the lights themselves and find the hot coming off the appropriate switch (or terminal block for the lights and reverse lights) and complete the circuits one by one as I cut out the monitor system and the flasher system. It wasn’t terribly hard, you just have to stay organized and test as you go so you don’t end up with six things not working at once.

The only thing I forgot was my passenger mirror adjuster but it didn’t work anyway so I haven’t gone back to fix it!

If you’re looking to make modifications to the bus lights where you turn on all four at once just be mindful of the current draw. I wasn’t comfortable with all four being turned on with one 12 or 14 awg wire so the relay was necessary.

If anyone needs to know how to wire the relay to accomplish that let me know and I can make a little picture or describe further... it’s easy and inexpensive, but ultimately of limited value thus far for me.

Could you please make a little picture or describe further?
Thank you.

[Joe45]

Agreed!
Some pictures with further description would be lovely!!!

[rffffffff]

Okay, I made a quick image. I'll explain as best as I can, but hopefully it covers the basics.

figure A is the essential circuit you want to create. Very simple from the fuse to the switch to the light.

figure B is what it looks like in the bus without a light monitor device, usually the switch for a particular function goes to a flasher module and then to the light.

figure C is (from memory) what most of my bus looked like. the wires ran from the switch to the flasher module to the monitor device to the light. For reverse and brake lights the wires came from a terminal block and skipped the switch and flasher module and went directly to the monitor.

I added point A and point B to this one... all you have to do to simplify your life is connect point A to point B. In practice that means finding the wire in the harness near the light and running new wires (or reusing existing) to connect the device to the switch (or terminal block for reverse and brake lights) directly.

figure D is adding a relay, and then there's a relay detail below for a standard automotive 30A relay that are really easy to find and all over cars. Use a relay if the current draw the the load is going to be too much for the normal switch or wiring to handle.

I used this to power all four bus flasher lights with one switch.

You have to connect the switch to the coil of the relay, which will turn the relay on assuming the relay coil is connected to ground on the other side. doing this activates the high current switch in the relay to connect the big fat wire from the fuse box to the load side. You would need this if you are going to turn on all four bus lights at the same time with a switch. I ran #10 wire to the relay contact and then connected all four of the light wires to the other side of the relay. this way the switch is just a signal to turn the relay on and the relay and the fat wire handle all of the current demands.

In order to simplify the wiring you should have at the very least a digital multi meter and understand how to use it in ohms mode to check continuity and voltage mode to measure voltage. You'll have to sort out which terminals on the switch are for the load, which isn't too difficult, and make sure you have a good handle on DC wiring connections, whether that is crimping or soldering or both, and heat shrinking those connections so you don't end up with problems down the road.

If you do one wire at a time and keep things organized you can get rid of the flasher module, the light monitor device and all of the overhead switches and radio, etc. It cleaned up the front of my bus and made me feel a lot more sane only having one bank of switches. I hope that helps!

https://imgur.com/a/ryveIrp