I’m not finding where this has been covered before.

[nocturnalnasty]

I’ll admit I seem to be challenged when it comes to the search engine on this site. So apologies if this information already exists.

I have a 1995 International AmTran Genesis FE flat nose. DT466/MT643 with 190,000 miles. It was a church bus from down south. So, no rust issues.

I have noticed most skoolie conversions involve removing the factory heaters and air conditioning units. My bus has three split AC units. The ones that are midship and in the rear get “cool” but not enough to really help in 90+ degree weather. The third is located just behind the driver and it got cool for a couple of minutes then began blowing hot air. The bus also has the heat and defrost for the drivers area in the dash plus midship and rear under seat heaters that appear to use hot water from the engine cooling system to heat exchangers with electric fans for circulation of warm air.

I have plans to put solar on part of the roof and a deck on the rear of the roof. That makes the split AC units that do not go through the roof attractive to me (I think) if they can be fixed for a reasonable investment. However, if I am going to do the traditional “gutting” of the interior, it will be difficult to work around these wall/ceiling mounted AC units. Does anyone have any links to or personal experience with bus conversions that deal specifically with this issue?

Next for heat I was wondering if anyone has used a diesel fired heater like the Dickinson units with the water loops to not only tap into the factory heater water lines to preheat the engine and heaters but also plumb into underfloor hydronic radiant heat tubing? Again anyone know of project links or have personal experience doing this?

I’m just getting started and would like to have a solid plan before beginning the demo phase. Any help or advice will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
John

[djdalfaro]

Following this thread because I also have an A/C unit that needs to be uninstalled and reinstalled for insulation purposes.

Sweet bus BTW. Good find.

[o1marc]

because the factory A/C units are so large and bulky and inefficient they are usually removed and replaced with smaller mini splits, window or roof A/C.
The same with the heaters, remove the 2 rear ones but loop the coolant hoses back to the front heat/defrpst.
I believe cost was a limiting factor on the diesel heaters. Though having heat without adding another fuel source is always a good thing.

[somewhereinusa]

Those factory AC units require the engine to be running. My build thread as info and pictures about in floor heat.

[nocturnalnasty]

Originally Posted by djdalfaro

Following this thread because I also have an A/C unit that needs to be uninstalled and reinstalled for insulation purposes.



Sweet bus BTW. Good find.

Thanks djdalfaro

[nocturnalnasty]

Olmarc

My idea was to use them while on the road and maybe on occasion while sitting. The other systems you mentioned, can they be used while driving?
Thanks
John

[nocturnalnasty]

Originally Posted by somewhereinusa

Those factory AC units require the engine to be running. My build thread as info and pictures about in floor heat.

Thank you.

I found a short thread that had your heating system in it. WOW!!!! That is an incredible piece of engineering and craftsmanship. Extremely impressive. I’m going to have to spend some time digesting all of that.

One question. I cannot find a build thread for your bus. Does one exist? If so, I’d really appreciate a link. Again I have to apologize for my terrible search engine skills on this site.

John

[brokedown]

The factory AC units are probably HUGE capacity units. I have dual air in both my buses, and anyone who suggests I remove them would get a swift kick in the bean bag. You may need to do some maintenance on them to get them nice and cold (I ended up doing quite a bit of this!) but it's relatively straight forward. Christopher helped me a LOT with figuring out my issues.

One thing that really helped was getting a set of manifold gauges from Harbor Freight. if you only have the low pressure side (the single gauges you get otherwise) you only get a small part of the story. i also needed to upgrade my condenser fans and the electric supply running to them, now my bus gets COLD when it's hot out.

[magnakansas]

I dont have a large bus. Calculated at 648 cubic feet. I am going to have a dash air conditioning/heating/defroster unit in the front.

I am going to have a biggish, ceiling mount, engine driven, air conditioning unit that does not go through the roof at the rear. The condensers for the rear a/c will be skirt mounted. I still dont know if I will have one or two a/c compressors.I will have two heaters (heatexchanger) with fans, one mid ships, one rear. I will be using a webasto heater. It has a built in water pump and fuel pump. This uses the engine coolant, and engine fuel, diesel, and thus is plumbed into the engine also. I will have shut off valves in the engine compartment for drivers heat, and shut off valves next to the driver for rear cabin heat. Actually the valve is going to be under floor and the control next to the driver. In this summer heat I do not think I could keep 7 to ten people comfortably cool on the road.

I will have to run the engine for cooling, not a big deal for me, because most of the time the needed cooling will for driving on the road. Heat does not need the engine running but that is likely to be used more during stand still.

Sounds to me, your a/c systems are working correctly, but need some refrigerant added. One of the systems may have a leak. Time to call in an a/c guy and get things inspected, diagnosed, and estimate for repairs/service. then go from there.

william

[nocturnalnasty]

Originally Posted by brokedown

The factory AC units are probably HUGE capacity units. I have dual air in both my buses, and anyone who suggests I remove them would get a swift kick in the bean bag. You may need to do some maintenance on them to get them nice and cold (I ended up doing quite a bit of this!) but it's relatively straight forward. Christopher helped me a LOT with figuring out my issues.

One thing that really helped was getting a set of manifold gauges from Harbor Freight. if you only have the low pressure side (the single gauges you get otherwise) you only get a small part of the story. i also needed to upgrade my condenser fans and the electric supply running to them, now my bus gets COLD when it's hot out.

Broke down,
I was thinking if I can get them to work that it sure would be nice to ride down the highway in cool comfort. I have a ‘95. Any idea of what kind of refrigerant it most like would have in it?

And if you have a bus build thread I’d love to see how you handled the ac units. It looks like in my bus it’ll take major surgery to strip the interior and insulate with these wall/ceiling mounted units.

Thanks
John

[nocturnalnasty]

Magnakansas
Which Webasto unit are you using? This might be a better way for me to go.
John

[o1marc]

Originally Posted by nocturnalnasty

Olmarc

My idea was to use them while on the road and maybe on occasion while sitting. The other systems you mentioned, can they be used while driving?
Thanks
John

As I understand it the large factory units are extremely large space taking units that are not that efficient and only run off the engine. So they don't cool great while driving and the motor would need to be running for you to A/C while sitting. The aftermarket units everyone chooses they say are not efficient while driving, at least not up in the front. Many would rather have the space for storage that the A/C units take up. If you plan on living in it at all you will need more than the factory units.

[nocturnalnasty]

Olmarc
So properly working factory units work for driving. And the mini-split system for stationary “in-camp” use? Could a mini-split be run off of a generator for driving? Or are these units capable of operating while being bounced down the road?

John

[brokedown]

In general terms I've been using my road air as my only AC (not the case while I'm building my new bus in the Florida heat, but that's another story!) and came to terms with it pretty quickly. Part of it is that we travel, and we can make a good attempt at being where it's less hot, so not where we would generally be running the AC all day long. Factoring the the expense of buying an additional AC, buying a generator, maintaining and fueling the generator, etc, it makes a lot of sense to just run the bus engine when you need AC. Plus, my road air gives me something like 55k BTU, that's a crazy amount of cooling power... And I don't have to worry about carrying a gas cat etc.

If you're stationary, shore power makes a ton of sense. A generator is kind of halfway between. The bigger ones are pretty loud, you're filling gas cans to keep it running, and as we've found even a 14k BTU unit can't keep up in the Florida heat and sun.

[nocturnalnasty]

Brokedown,
Thank you and all good points. My factory air units are looking better and better if I don’t have to break the bank to fix them.
John

[somewhereinusa]

Originally Posted by nocturnalnasty

Thank you.

I found a short thread that had your heating system in it. WOW!!!! That is an incredible piece of engineering and craftsmanship. Extremely impressive. I’m going to have to spend some time digesting all of that.

One question. I cannot find a build thread for your bus. Does one exist? If so, I’d really appreciate a link. Again I have to apologize for my terrible search engine skills on this site.

John

My build thread is here, many pictures were lost when Photobucket closed free accounts.
http://www.skoolie.net/forums/f11/so...nusa-6318.html

I also have a web site of my own with lots of pictures although, I haven't updated it lately.
SomewhereinUSA

More pictures here.
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm3y9ius

[nocturnalnasty]

Somewhereinusa,
I have been reading your build thread and I’m only about half way through and all I can say is WOW!!!! What an inspiration. Just incredible ingenuity, workmanship and resourcefulness. I cannot wait to get all the way through it. I have already seen several ideas that I want on my project. Thank you for sharing that.
John

[golfersmurf57]

Originally Posted by brokedown

The factory AC units are probably HUGE capacity units. I have dual air in both my buses, and anyone who suggests I remove them would get a swift kick in the bean bag. You may need to do some maintenance on them to get them nice and cold (I ended up doing quite a bit of this!) but it's relatively straight forward. Christopher helped me a LOT with figuring out my issues.

One thing that really helped was getting a set of manifold gauges from Harbor Freight. if you only have the low pressure side (the single gauges you get otherwise) you only get a small part of the story. i also needed to upgrade my condenser fans and the electric supply running to them, now my bus gets COLD when it's hot out.

Broke: I have serviced several of those factory units they're big but cool extremely well. I did two on a church bus. In a 90 degree ambient the bus was 47 degrees in 5 mins. We had to install a thermostic control on the ducts because they came back from a Florida trip complaining of the ducts dripping water on the outside. I have 2 trans airs on mine after I insulate I will get one cold and assess its effectiveness before removing the other.