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Old 04-23-2009, 03:39 PM   #11
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Re: ISN'T IT TIME TO REVISIT STEAM POWER; ABNER DOBLE

Very Good Paul...................maximum torque at 0 rpm......................That was also the number used for the Doble steam car. No transmission, no shifting, just ever increasing silent power.
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Old 04-23-2009, 03:46 PM   #12
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Re: ISN'T IT TIME TO REVISIT STEAM POWER; ABNER DOBLE

Also I recall now, that it was claimed by some, that the general death knell for Steam, was the invention of the starting motor, or the "electric start".........As injuries from the use of magneto cranking devices were frequent, and painful.............It's rather ironic you look at this 22 Owen, with the "aperture" drive shaft" that spins in a Housing of Horse shoe magnets, and drives the rear wheels, and yet they still needed to manually crank this vehicle in order to get it going.
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Old 04-23-2009, 07:42 PM   #13
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Re: ISN'T IT TIME TO REVISIT STEAM POWER; ABNER DOBLE

Quote:
where did the free electric power from the grid come from, what about the polution from burning the wood?
The plug-in aficionados' published numbers claim grid electric is still cheaper than petroleum, and is reportedly generated more cleanly per watt in large quantities than in small motor gennys. Who am I to argue? I think most of my grid power is water power smuggled in from Quebec Hydro. I have also seen an article by someone who charges his electric-only commuter with off-grid power.

The wood idea is a last resort for if the economy really goes Pffffffffft, and would come from my wife's wood lot. And I have breathed enough smoke to dispute the greens' claim that the smoke is non-polluting. They consider it carbon-neutral because the trees would give off the CO2 anyway if they died and rotted. Go figure.
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Old 04-23-2009, 09:53 PM   #14
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Re: ISN'T IT TIME TO REVISIT STEAM POWER; ABNER DOBLE

grid power is definitely cheaper than genney power, but it's not free, even hydro and wind have generation and distribution costs,
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Old 04-24-2009, 04:28 PM   #15
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Re: ISN'T IT TIME TO REVISIT STEAM POWER; ABNER DOBLE

Typical performance

The 1924 model Doble Series E steam car could run for 1,500 miles (2,400 km) before its 24-gallon water tank needed to be refilled; even in freezing weather, it could be started from cold and move off within 30 seconds, and once fully warmed could be relied upon to reach speeds in excess of 90 miles per hour (140 km/h). In recent years Doble cars have been run at speeds approaching 120 mph (190 km/h), this without the benefits of streamlining and a lighter version of the Series E accelerated from 0 - 75 mph (121 km/h) in 10 seconds.[citation needed] Its fuel consumption, burning a variety of fuels (often kerosene), was competitive with automobiles of the day, and its ability to run in eerie silence apart from wind noise gave it a distinct edge. At 70 mph (110 km/h), there was little noticeable vibration, with the engine turning at around 900 rpm.

Contemporary Doble advertisements mentioned the lightness of the engine, which would lead customers to compare it favorably with heavier gasoline engines, but "engine" in a steam car usually refers solely to the expander unit, and does not take into account the complete power plant including boiler and ancillary equipment; on the other hand clutch and gearbox were not needed. Even so, the overall weight of a Series E was in excess of 5000 pounds.
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Old 04-24-2009, 04:59 PM   #16
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Re: ISN'T IT TIME TO REVISIT STEAM POWER; ABNER DOBLE

Now consider a modern steam engine. I invoke the Cyclone Engine
(see previous post) for reference. Let's look at performance, range,
efficiency, emissions, reliability, longevity, safety, fuel
availability.
1. Performance - Similar to a two stroke gasoline engine, but
starting torque is far greater (and Cyclone is FAR less noisy). A
100 hp Cyclone has a starting torque of 700 ft lbs. The torque
profile is like a gas engine's flipped backwards…. torque is highest
starting out and falls, but always remains at least twice as high as
a 4 stroke gas engine at the same speed and rated power. The torque
curve is such that a transmission is NOT required. Engine is
self-starting (can operate at 1 rpm up to 3600 rpm). Engine can even
reverse itself. A Diesel automotive power plant (including all
auxiliaries…. transmission, emissions controls, radiator, starter
motor, flywheel, etc.) with the same power as a Cyclone automotive
power plant weighs 2.5 times as much as the Cyclone.
2. Range - Higher efficiency and ability to use fuels with greater
energy density will extend range relative to gas autos.
3. Efficiency - Measured at 36% thermal efficiency…. roughly
equivalent to Diesel engines. However, there are fewer power
transmission losses because, well, NO transmission is required, only
a much simpler gear box.
4. Emissions - With no emissions controls at all (no computers,
sensors, catalytic converter, etc) the emissions are far lower than
the cleanest internal combustion engine. Additionally, nitrous oxide
emissions are virtually nonexistent. The Cyclone passes CA smog
standards for the year 2020, and with NO modification.
5. Reliability - A Cyclone automotive power plant has less than
1/5 the parts count of a standard automotive power plant (including
power transmission equipment). The 6 cylinder radial Cyclone has one
cam to operate all 6 inlet valves and there are NO exhaust valves.
There is a single thermostat to control boiler temperature (50+ year
old technology), and a single electric motor driven blower fan.
Steam generator, condenser, and auxiliary heat exchangers are simple
and integrated with the engine. Peak engine temperature is 1200F vs
nearly 2500F in internal combustion. Average speed is lower. Engine
cylinders and bearings are WATER LUBRICATED. NO OIL CHANGES! Water
and steam is in a closed system…. no adding water, either!
6. Longevity - Lubricating quality of water and the composite
materials used in the Cyclone is the same as oil lubrication in
internal combustion engines, but there is NO fouling of the system
as seen in internal combustion. The closed system of the Cyclone is
always clean. Additionally, operating temperatures are lower in the
Cyclone and average speed is lower.
7. Safety - The power plant itself is perfectly safe. But more
importantly, the high power to weight ratio and CRAZY torque
provides no need to compromise on vehicle safety (like electric cars
and hybrids often do). One great application for the Cyclone is the
trucking industry and earth moving equipment.
8. Fuel availability - The Cyclone truly shines here! The Cyclone
has been operated on the following fuels (so far) with no
modification to the engine: gasoline, ethanol, E-85, diesel,
biodiesel, SVO, fuel oil, kerosene, orange oil, acetone, propane,
butane, hydrogen, crude oil… the engine has even operated on solid
fuels including coal dust and wood flour. Additionally, there is no
reason at all why a biomass gasifier cannot be used as well (wood
chips, wood pellets, paper pellets, seaweed pellets). For stationary
applications (a generator for example) the Cyclone can also operate
using concentrated solar (a Cyclone has been operated by heat lamps
just to illustrate the concept).

I can go on and on, but it should be a slam dunk. Steam is the way
to go… and we've only scratched the surface of its potential. ”.

Here's Jay Leno with this Doble:
http://media.popularmechanics.com/image ... d-lg-1.jpg
http://www.damninteresting.net/content/ ... _large.jpg
Rear axel direct drive:
http://media.popularmechanics.com/image ... 2-lg-3.jpg
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