A Biodiesel kit that works

[lapeer20m]

good news for me.......From what i've been reading , apparently the bosch fuel injector pumps are very tollerant of svo. That makes me feel better. I'm still a bit nervous about the conversion causing premature engine falure. (premature at 265,000 miles??? is that some kind of joke?)

The guy at the bus garage says an entire rebuild kit including rings, wristpins, gaskets, seals ect can be purchased for the DT 366 for under a thousand bucks. Unfortunately i don't have an international motor. I have a Ford. The price for a rebuilt ford 6.6 liter is about $10k according the the bus garage mechanic.

My next bus (if i purchase another one) will almost certianly have a DT series motor in it.

I'm very happy with my braziallian made 6.6 liter ford, but parts are rediculously expensive !

[Steve]

So Jason, it looks like the trip to burning man this year wont be so expensive

[busone]

If you are worried about the engine gumming up you can always take a sample of your oil to a lab and see if there is anything bad going on. You can always put some solvent in the crankcase before you change the oil. If you can find Ron Morrison he has been running his bus on WVO for a long time now. I will try to find out what happened to him.

[lapeer20m]

Since my engine is made in brazil, i'm hoping that it is more tolerant than an engine from the USA. I think the quality of fuel from poorer countries is probably not as good as the fuel we have here in our country and would require an engine that can handle differences in fuel as well as increased impurities.

Maybe I just have a wild immagination !

[Eric von Kleist]

Originally Posted by lapeer20m

<snip>

Then the oil will be forced through a 20 micron filter followed by a 5 micron water filter. These filters are about 3 dollars each (but $30 for the filter housing)

Why not use an automotive oil filter? They should be cost competetive, and I think they filter down to a smaller level than the filters you mention. Except they may not filter water. Not sure about that.

Originally Posted by lapeer20m

The end product should be ready for the tank. The tank can't really be much bigger than 30 gallons. The amt of time it takes to heat the oil enough to switch from diesel to veggie will be extended as the tank gets bigger. I think i will mount one or two more 30 (or 35 ?) gallon drums under the bus to hold clean oil. A fuel pump could be used to refill the main svo tank. This would allow quick switching of fuel, but also allow long range between fill-ups.

How about a solar heater? Put a passive solar collector on the roof, and use a small pump (solar electric powered?) to run automotive motor oil through the collector and a heat exchanger in the tank. If the tank is insulated, the solar heater may be enough to keep the WVO liquified adequately most of the time.

Originally Posted by lapeer20m

How does one go about paying road tax on bio fuel??

Check your state code online. Search for keywords related to motor fuel taxation. In my state bio-diesel may or may not be exempt....most likely not.

The tax applies to fuel commercially available for use as motor fuel....there is *one* outlet in SC that sells biodiesel commercially. That may be the 80/20 diesel/biodiesel, so *PURE* biodiesel would then NOT be available commercially. This would be a potential loophole. Straight WVO would be a potential exemption, under my state law, too, becase it is not *commercially available* as motor fuel. The term, "commercial", implies "commerce", as in buy and sell, not what someone gives you for free as trash. This could be a potential loophole.

The tax applies to "petroleum products", and biodiesel is NOT a petroleum product; HOWEVER, the legal definition of "petroleum product" in the state law is *anything* that can be used as fuel in a motor vehicle, and THAT would include biodiesel even though it is not technically a petroleum product.

The fuel distributor is the one who must collect the taxes (in my state), and this would be you (if you consider that the WVO is the "raw" product, and not usable until you filter/crack it into a suable product.) You are also the manufacturer, or refiner, and there are laws that apply to the refining of "petroleum products" that you should check out. In my state, where the manufacurer is the distributor, the manufacturer has to report inventory information and collect taxes, etc.

Check your state laws. There may be "alternative fuel" exemptions or reductions for alernative fuels.

Or just make your biodiesel tank look like a blackwater tank. Glue a dummy drain system on it and hde the linkage to the fuel line. As long as you don't put a big sign on the bus saying "I use WVO for free and don't pay road taxes on it!", probably no one will ever know. If you get pulled by teh cops on the highway just switch back over to diesel and idle the engine really fast for a minute or two.

[Eric von Kleist]

I just looked up some information on the spot prices for vegetable oils.

Interestingly (if you could buy in bulk quantity), SVO is price competetive with diesel. 27cents a pound for refined soybean oil is about $1.89 per gallon.

Anybody live near a SVO oil processing plant?

LATE SPOT PRICES


CRUDE VEGETABLE OILS *

Coconut oil, t.l., N. Y. lb. 26c
Corn oil, Midwest lb. 29c
Cottonseed oil, West Texas lb. 50c
Linseed oil, Minneapolis lb. 41c
Peanut oil, Southeast (rest.) lb. 45c
Soybean oil, Decatur, Ill. lb. 22c

REFINED VEGETABLE OILS

Coconut oil, t.w., N. Y. lb. 31.25c
Corn, jumbo tanks, N. Y. lb. 38c
Palm oil, N.J. lb. 31.75c
Peanut oil, jumbo tanks, N.Y. lb. 55c
Soybean salad oil, N.Y. lb. 27.11c

[lapeer20m]

i started with an oil filter to clean the material. It seemed most logical, and i had a few new ones around.
Interestingly enough...................
In my research, i read that oil filters have a special valve inside that opens to allow oil to pass through after the filter gets plugged up. This allows an engine to never be starved for oil.....This also allows wvo to not be filtered once it's filled the oil filter with contaminates.

[lapeer20m]

I just can't leave well enough alone !
My system works, but it takes a long time to switch from diesel to veggie. It takes about 7-10 miles of driving before there is enough heat to make the switch. Diesel's just don't produce much heat compared to a gas engine.
I've thought of an idea that would allow me to switch over almost instantly. Just before the oil goes into the fuel pump, i'm going to install a deep fat fryer (The Fry Daddy) It holds about a half a gallon of veggie oil. The fryer after some modification will be sealed with a steel lid. The lid will have two "ports" and an engine temp probe that allows the driver to see the temp of the oil in the appliance. This will just simply be a component of the veggie oil fuel system. There will be a line coming in from the veggie tank, and one going out to the injection pump. The plan is to plug in the deep fryer about 5 minutes before starting the rig. Once the electricity heats the oil up to 150 degrees or so , unplug the fry daddy, and start the bus on diesel. After a minute or so, i should be able to switch to my prewarmed veggie oil. By the time the engine burns the 1/2 gallon of preheated veggie oil, it should be generating sufficient heat to warm the remaining veggie oil utilizing engine coolant.

Soon i'll try to post drawings and photo's

[lapeer20m]

Today i purchased a 110 volt water pump to filter the oil. I had been borrowing the 12 volt pump that feeds the injection pump whenever i needed to filter more oil. This was inconvenient to say the least. Here's a photo of the water filter i'm using to filter the oil.

I built a floating strainer for the suction end. After filtering the oil through a water filter, it goes directly into the veggie tank on the bus. My first test batch was at 110 degrees. Next i went right to the veggie oil container behind one of the local restaurants. They have a really clean supply of waste veggie oil. With the clear filter housing, i can monitor the oil to make sure there isn't water or other contaminates noticable to the eye. The oil was maybe 50 degrees. I passed 25 gallons through one filter, but the oil flowed way slower than the 110 degree test batch. I don't think it is necessary it is to heat it prior to filtering, but it would make the job quicker. When summer finally gets here, the oil should flow a lot better.[/img]

[lapeer20m]

Had a bit of a good adventure today on my way home from picking up a tank of fuel at the restaurant.

I was cruising through town, on the busiest road in the county, M 24. I decided to switch from diesel to veggie. After about a quarter mile, the bus started to die. Looking down i instantly realized I had forgotten to turn on the 12 volt fuel pump. Fearing that it was too late, i switched on the pump, and opened the valve for the diesel hoping to not stall the engine. The engine died, but i was still cruising about 30 mph. The drivetrain kept the engien spinning. I was sure she'd come back to life at any second! She didn't. I started looking for a place to pull off, but there's a curb on the edge of the road. The bus won't fit in most of the driveways along that stretch. I was able to coast to a side street. I got off of the main highway, but completely blocked the side road. UGGGGGG! I turned the key, trying to restart the engine while i was coasting down, but to no avail. Quickly i grabbed my 3/4 inch wrench, opend the hood, and cracked the line going to the injector for cylinder # 6. Then i climbed in the bus and turned the key. She sputtered, then died. I turned the key again, and she fired. With the hood still tilted forward, i drove the bus to a nearby parking lot and tightened the nut for the injector.

The rest of the ride home was uneventful.

A month ago, i didnt' have any idea how to bleed injectors!

[busone]

I hate when something like that happens. Well at least you got it running again and made it home safe.

[lapeer20m]

veggie oil conversion photo's are now in the gallery. They'e on the last 2 pages.

[lapeer20m]

as far as the State of Michigan is concerned, there is not tax on veggie oil. Tax is only applied to gasoline and diesel. There is no mention of other types of alternative fuel, including alcohol or veggie oil.

"207.1008 Tax on motor fuel; rates; collection or payment; exception; manner and time; imposition of rate on net gallons; legislative intent.
Sec. 8.

(1) Subject to the exemptions provided for in this act, tax is imposed on motor fuel imported into or sold, delivered, or used in this state at the following rates:

(a) Nineteen cents per gallon on gasoline.

(b) Fifteen cents per gallon on diesel fuel. "

the act does go on to talk about marine/aviation fuel and LPG as a motor fuel. There is nothing that refrenses vegetable oil, alternative fuel, or expiremental fuel.

I wonder what the federal govt has to say about this subject?? Eventually i'll get to their site

[Eric von Kleist]

Way cool! Excellent photos.

What are all the copper wires in the engine compartment? Are those going to individual injectors, or to an injector manifold (rail?) of some kind? I'm not familiar enough with diesel engines to identify what was going on in that picture.

What are you using for a holding tank under the bus?

One guy I read about provided each location where he collected WVO with an oil drum for disposal. The drum had a locking lid (rim lock, if you're familiar with oil drum lids.) When he went to collect the oil, he would remove that lid and substitute it with a similar lid that had a nipple for compressed air and a pipe (attached to the transfer hose) that reached to the bottom of the barrel. Then he would just hook up the lid to the compressed air supply he had, and the compressed air would force the WVO up the pipe and into the transfer hose.

I like the pump set up you have. Less hoses to worry with than the compressed air version. If your bus had rear heaters, you might be able to modify the system that fed them with hot coolant to run the coolant from the engine through a heat exchanger inside the WVO holding tank to heat the WVO. You'd still have to wait a while for the oil to heat up, but it wouldn't require you to create any heat for the WVO as with an electric set up.

Have you noticed any mileage difference with the WVO?

Great job!

[lapeer20m]

Those copper lines are the ones i installed. there are two sets. Each set has one wvo line, and one diesel fuel line. One set is connected to the inlet of the injector pump, the other set it connected to the outlet (return line) from the injector pump. I'll draw a diagram in the near future.

Under the bus, i'm using a plastic 30 (or 35?) gallon drum. It's the smaller cousin of the standard 55 gallon drum. I would like to insulate the drum so the oil heats up faster.

the wvo i've been using is really runny at room temperature. With my electric fuel pump pushing the juice tward the injector pump, i've had zero problems switching just after starting the engine, before the oil has the chance to warm up (except the few degrees it gains by going through the electric heated fuel filter)

[lapeer20m]

It's been a couple weeks, and a few hundred miles since the conversion. Things are ok, but not perfect. I've had a couple of problems with air leaks in the fuel system. This would cause the bus to not want to start after being parked for several hours. It was an easy fix, cracking an injector and priming the system, but this is highly annoying. I finally took apart all the veggie fuel connections and re-installed them very carefully with fresh new pipe joint compound. So far so good.

I also tried a few different veggie oil pumps to feed the oil to the injector pump. Gasoline fuel pumps apparently are not rated to pump veggie oil. Two vairations of these brand new out of the box failed within less than an hour of pumping. Currently i'm using a 12 volt diaphram type water pump rated @ 1.8 gpm and max 40 psi. This seems to work fine, but i'd like to find a replacement to make for less trouble if this one fails. I believe that early chevy light duty diesels had an electric diesel fuel pump. Perhaps i should just invest in one of those.

I'm very happy with the conversion so far. With diesel prices @ $1.78 per gallon it's nice to drive around on free fuel. I've been trying to drive the bus as much as possible for research and development purposes, but also because i love driving a vehicle that emits the lovely smell of fried food. It's difficult to convince people that the engine truely runs on used veggie oil until they get a whiff of the exhaust.

[Steve]

I thought most places were still having to pay to get rid of this stuff anyway.

[lapeer20m]

I always ask before i take the used oil.

I've visited about six different restaurants now, and all of them were more than happy to get rid of the stuff. (one cook told me that i could take it if i wanted, but they have some really bad degreaser mixed in.) Here in michigan, they have to pay about 25 bucks to get rid of one container full. That's about 2-3 hundred gallons. I'm not doing them a big favor by taking it, but most restaurant owners are very intruiged with the idea of veggie oil as motor fuel. Besides, everyone loves the bus !

I have a bad habbit of looking in grease containers whenever I go to a restaurant. not all used oil is created equal !!!

If that story wasn't from such a reputable source, i'd be very inclined to think it was urban legend.

[lapeer20m]

I added some more photos, here are a few.
The Veggie Fuel Pressure Guage
These are the return valves coming out of the side of the injector pump

This is the veggie line zip tied to the engine coolant hoses. You can see the copper veggie line at the bottom as it enters the protective covering for the coolant hoses.

[lapeer20m]

photo's always seem to make things under the hood look more confusing that they are in real life. I drew this simple diagram by hand to show what i did in my conversion.


The one thing missing from the diagram is the coolant lines that are attached to the veggie fuel line all the way from the tank to the engine compartment. Actually, the veggie line is attached to the coolant lines that were already in place for the rear heater.

The next diagram shows the original design from the kit offered in the first post on this topic.


The return line in this (the original) design is connected directly to the fuel line going in. I know nothing about diesel engines, but it seemed to me that auto makers wouldn't install 15 feet of steel diesel fuel return line from the injector pump to the tank if they didn't have too. Auto makers don't spend more money than necessary. The return line is under some pretty serious pressure as far as i can tell. What happens when the fuel enters the injection pump under high pressure??? I don't know, I am not a diesel mechanic. Just to be cautious, I added the return line to the veggie tank. This way i choose which tank the fuel is returned too.

One thing i have noticed is the oil being returned to the tank is significantly hotter than the oil is before entering the injection pump, even when the veggie tank is heated up to 160 degrees or so.

Both the veggie fuel line and the veggie return line run near the driver inside the cab. I can reach down and feel the copper lines when i'm driving.