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Old 09-10-2019, 09:58 PM   #281
Mini-Skoolie
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bapos View Post
I think all they can do is work with what they have in your TCM. I do not know if it is like other programmers that leave "finger prints" like say a diesel programmer does when you flash your ECM. The dealership can see info that tells them it has or has not if they look hard enough. This is why you probably dont want to use a flash on a diesel motor that is under warranty.

I will ask them and see what PCM says?
When I got mine back from PCM it had a new sticker over the original one where the CIN number was. It had a lot of code speak that Cadillac Kid would probably understand but I didn't have a clue what it was all about. I'm assuming if I had a problem and went to an Allison authorized shop they would hopefully understand it.

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Old 09-10-2019, 10:27 PM   #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1dmpo View Post
When I got mine back from PCM it had a new sticker over the original one where the CIN number was. It had a lot of code speak that Cadillac Kid would probably understand but I didn't have a clue what it was all about. I'm assuming if I had a problem and went to an Allison authorized shop they would hopefully understand it.
I assume it works well and had no issues?
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Old 09-10-2019, 10:33 PM   #283
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Originally Posted by Trailer2 View Post
5.38 ratio 11r22.5. Under 2000rpm at 70 mph. An rpm calculator is a really handy tool to find out what will get your rpms where you want them. Mine worked out being very close.


This is the best ratio calculator I have found. http://www.grimmjeeper.com/gears.html
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Old 09-10-2019, 10:36 PM   #284
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I have a 98 blue bird csre with 8.3 and b300 transmission. Mine is wtec3 but early version. PCM could not program my tcm because he said he did not support the old 250k units. I would need to get a newer 500k tcm programmed with my cin and 6 speeds. I went this route $795 for programmed tcm that has 6 gears. It was cheaper and easier than re-gear.
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Originally Posted by TJones View Post
What is your gear ratio and what rpm are you running at 65? I have a similar bus and want to go to 5.38 if I can get 6th unlocked.

Trailer2, maybe if cadillackid will teach us how to clone the software out of your TCM then TJones and I could help reimburse some of your cost!


Mine is a model year 2000 Blue Bird CSRE, also with the ISC8.3 and B300 combination. The CSRE seems to be somewhat rare. One of these days I gotta slide under the bus and find my TCM to see what labeling it may have -- I wonder whether it's the 250k or 500k model.
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Old 09-10-2019, 10:49 PM   #285
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The tcm is on the outside of the frame rail on driver side close to transmission. It is held on with 4 1/4 bolts. Just get the numbers printed on it and email pcm and he can tell you if it can be programmed. I am open to helping others.
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Old 09-11-2019, 08:48 AM   #286
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Cloning the software from a TCM is actually pretty easy..



you'll need a laptop with the internet DIsabled..

a copy of the Allison DOC software with reprogramming enabled.. it is "available online"..


a Nexiq USB link2 or chinese Clone RP1210 to USB hardware device.



running the DOC software you can read a TCM's complete data into your laptop and save it as a file.



you can then run the programmer routine and write a file to a TCM..


so simply cloning one was i read both TCM's into the computer.. and then I wrote the 6 speed one to the TCM of the 5 speed bus..


I cleared the ADAPTs which essentially clears out the meager auto-learning functions of the TCM.. Auto learn .. this may not have really done anything as the earlier versions of code didnt support it.. but since these busses are newer than 99 when it was introduced i did it..





take the bus out and floor it shifting up to at least 4th gear each time for several times to set the adapts..




adaptive learn is a shift-quality learning process.. Allisons dont have Bands.. they are clutch-only transmissions.. in this configuration Flare shifts and Binding can become a problem if the calibration is off.. the TCM protects itself from damaging the transmission by taking generally "looser" shifts.. in later revisions adaptive learning was created to "tighten" up the shifts without creating binds..



Flare shift - clutch 1 disengages and there is a lag before clutch 2 engages.. you'll notice a lag and surge feel to your shift and your tach may jump up a couple hundred RPM before dropping down into next gear.


Bind - clutch 2 engages before clutch 1 disengages enough to allow good slippage.. you'll notice a sharp quick snap back and forth (not a forward surge or push like a solid shift but a back N forth once quick snap).. this is dangerous because you are tryingto slip a clutch that is engaged and also slip a clutch that wants to spin faster as it engages.. causes fast wear of clutches and extra heat..


not all shifts in an allison require release of 1 clutch and then grab of another.. some shifts are simply a grab of another clutch (some gears actually use 2 clutches at once purposely).. that is why different shifts in allisons feel different from each other apart from the ratio changes..



-Christopher
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Old 09-11-2019, 09:24 AM   #287
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cadillackid,

Thanks for the info.

Never thought that reverse engineering transmission bits would be in my wheelhouse.

Looks like I've got another project to tinker with.
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Old 09-11-2019, 11:14 AM   #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
Cloning the software from a TCM is actually pretty easy..



you'll need a laptop with the internet DIsabled..

a copy of the Allison DOC software with reprogramming enabled.. it is "available online"..


a Nexiq USB link2 or chinese Clone RP1210 to USB hardware device.



running the DOC software you can read a TCM's complete data into your laptop and save it as a file.



you can then run the programmer routine and write a file to a TCM..


so simply cloning one was i read both TCM's into the computer.. and then I wrote the 6 speed one to the TCM of the 5 speed bus..


I cleared the ADAPTs which essentially clears out the meager auto-learning functions of the TCM.. Auto learn .. this may not have really done anything as the earlier versions of code didnt support it.. but since these busses are newer than 99 when it was introduced i did it..





take the bus out and floor it shifting up to at least 4th gear each time for several times to set the adapts..




adaptive learn is a shift-quality learning process.. Allisons dont have Bands.. they are clutch-only transmissions.. in this configuration Flare shifts and Binding can become a problem if the calibration is off.. the TCM protects itself from damaging the transmission by taking generally "looser" shifts.. in later revisions adaptive learning was created to "tighten" up the shifts without creating binds..



Flare shift - clutch 1 disengages and there is a lag before clutch 2 engages.. you'll notice a lag and surge feel to your shift and your tach may jump up a couple hundred RPM before dropping down into next gear.


Bind - clutch 2 engages before clutch 1 disengages enough to allow good slippage.. you'll notice a sharp quick snap back and forth (not a forward surge or push like a solid shift but a back N forth once quick snap).. this is dangerous because you are tryingto slip a clutch that is engaged and also slip a clutch that wants to spin faster as it engages.. causes fast wear of clutches and extra heat..


not all shifts in an allison require release of 1 clutch and then grab of another.. some shifts are simply a grab of another clutch (some gears actually use 2 clutches at once purposely).. that is why different shifts in allisons feel different from each other apart from the ratio changes..



-Christopher
Hey hero, is this it https://allison.noregon.com/downloadsite14/ ?
__________________
If you would like to check out my website that has all sort of information especially for the T444E/7.3PSD engines check out www.PatrickTheSalvageGuy.com I've got helpful downloads and articles as well as a link to my YT for other how to videos mainly on the F series trucks.
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Old 09-11-2019, 11:40 AM   #289
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Originally Posted by bapos View Post
I assume it works well and had no issues?
Works perfect, no issues. Shifts out right in "performance" mode and when I push the mode button for "economy" mode there is a noticeable difference in the shift. Upshifts earlier and down shifts later. Picked up right at one mile per gallon in fuel milage. I run with the mode button on almost all the time. Bus is a little slower but the bus isn't fast in either economy or performance and I'm not running any races when I'm in the bus.
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Old 09-12-2019, 09:17 PM   #290
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How quick are the guys at PCM to answer emails? I emailed early this week and have yet to get a reply? Is there another way to get in touch with them?

Hoping to move forward on this.
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Old 09-13-2019, 09:27 AM   #291
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Originally Posted by bapos View Post
How quick are the guys at PCM to answer emails? I emailed early this week and have yet to get a reply? Is there another way to get in touch with them?

Hoping to move forward on this.
They were right on it when i dealt with them. When you Google PCMPerformance you get two of them, one out of North Carolina and one out of New York. You want the New York folks, I think the address I used was: programmer@pcmperformance.com
Hope that helps.
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Old 09-14-2019, 09:16 AM   #292
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Originally Posted by 1dmpo View Post
They were right on it when i dealt with them. When you Google PCMPerformance you get two of them, one out of North Carolina and one out of New York. You want the New York folks, I think the address I used was: programmer@pcmperformance.com
Hope that helps.
That's who I've emailed twice now and have heard anything. I guess all I can do is wait? Anyone who has dealt with them if you can screen shot this and send it to them if you would?
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Old 09-14-2019, 03:00 PM   #293
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I actually spoke to them on the phone, but can't find their number listed anywhere now, sorry.
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Old 09-14-2019, 03:21 PM   #294
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I actually spoke to them on the phone, but can't find their number listed anywhere now, sorry.
I am sure they have it not posted for a reason. Guess I'll sit and wait or maybe send a mail to the other email address
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Old 09-14-2019, 04:30 PM   #295
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Originally Posted by bapos View Post
That's who I've emailed twice now and have heard anything. I guess all I can do is wait? Anyone who has dealt with them if you can screen shot this and send it to them if you would?
It's actually one guy in a fourth floor apartment in Jamaica, NY so I guess any sort of personal problem comes up it's going to put him in a bind. But even if you're not doing any work work it's not that hard to respond to emails.
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Old 09-14-2019, 05:09 PM   #296
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Originally Posted by 1dmpo View Post
It's actually one guy in a fourth floor apartment in Jamaica, NY so I guess any sort of personal problem comes up it's going to put him in a bind. But even if you're not doing any work work it's not that hard to respond to emails.
I emailed the other guy also..... so I will just wait and see? Not much else I can do
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Old 10-27-2019, 10:27 AM   #297
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Update.....

It is amazing when you get enough people involved in problem solving and you come up with a solution. Yesterday I had a very well skilled allison master remote in to my bus ( via laptop) and performed my flashing of my 3060 and we now have 6th gear. So yes it can be done.

I have talked with this person and he is able to help others do this same thing for a reasonable (more than any others in that have been brought up in here) price to get it done. Now there are some things you need to have on your end. You need a windows based laptop.... internet access.... and an adapter that will communicate with your bus. We did find out that a Cummins inline 6 adapter DOES NOT work with the pccs flashing software. So to be safe you need to have a nexiq, dearborn, or noregon and will have no problems. He is working on a way to connect to the persons computer and have all the software on his end but thats not always a 100% possible and you have to go back to old school on it.

So if you have a WT3 tcm.... you are in good shape. Contact me if you wish for me to put in touch with him. This will happen via email and he will make plans after that.

Bapos
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Old 10-27-2019, 11:47 AM   #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bapos View Post
Update.....

It is amazing when you get enough people involved in problem solving and you come up with a solution. Yesterday I had a very well skilled allison master remote in to my bus ( via laptop) and performed my flashing of my 3060 and we now have 6th gear. So yes it can be done.

I have talked with this person and he is able to help others do this same thing for a reasonable (more than any others in that have been brought up in here) price to get it done. Now there are some things you need to have on your end. You need a windows based laptop.... internet access.... and an adapter that will communicate with your bus. We did find out that a Cummins inline 6 adapter DOES NOT work with the pccs flashing software. So to be safe you need to have a nexiq, dearborn, or noregon and will have no problems. He is working on a way to connect to the persons computer and have all the software on his end but thats not always a 100% possible and you have to go back to old school on it.

So if you have a WT3 tcm.... you are in good shape. Contact me if you wish for me to put in touch with him. This will happen via email and he will make plans after that.

Bapos
Was he able to reprogram using allison software? I have been in contact with Alex from PCM and he writes his own code or modifies the code on the tcm. He does not use allison doc. My concern is if I used his calibration file I would lose the ability to connect to allison doc if I needed to do transmission diagnostics.

Ted
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Old 10-27-2019, 12:06 PM   #299
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Certain TCMs can be programmed using other tools.. for instance i program my TCM directly using EFIlive. and I can get at the complete calibrations and adjust everything from pressures to shift points.. im guessing PCM is doing something similar..



what im interested to know is if this guy used PCCS and flashed a different CIN onto his TCM.. I was able to copy a 6 speed cal from one bus to another using pccs (TCM reprogram part of DOC)... I didnt try to edit those calibrations with EFIlive as I didnt have a bench TCM to work with.. I knew if I FUBAR'd the second bus I could write the original 5 speed cal back without issue.. of course I saved the 6 speed cal so I could use it on another EXACT bus if I want to..


-Christopher
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Old 10-27-2019, 12:12 PM   #300
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Originally Posted by TJones View Post
Was he able to reprogram using allison software? I have been in contact with Alex from PCM and he writes his own code or modifies the code on the tcm. He does not use allison doc. My concern is if I used his calibration file I would lose the ability to connect to allison doc if I needed to do transmission diagnostics.

Ted
Ted....

I had that same conversation with Alex and he was less than cordial about it. I asked with out giving trade secrets what kind of is your process cause I know in some trucks with tuners the dealer can see code of having a tune in your ecm that would void warranty? He was not overly nice about his answer and we will leave it at that.

As for this guy.... he uses nothing but allison stuff to do it. He is a allison specialist so he REALLY knows what he is doing. There has been no question he could not answer. I pointed him to this thread and has pointed out some very no so correct information. Its not wrong but said in certain ways that is not the way to do it.

I feel that what he did is no different than if you were to go to a legit dealer that has access to all the tools allison would give to that dealer. This was a very good and powerful learning experience. Also if you have no clue of what you are doing dont attempt this. You can brick this transmission pretty easy if the wrong thing happens.
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