'87 IH Carpenter Project

[cadillackid]

you have the older style dash with the round gauge face instead of the square?

I was surprised to find that my 91 has a backlit dash cluster already which is cool its nice greenish color which is perferct so i wont rebuild that.. though I may put LED's into the slots.. and add a Trans temp gauge.

im also going to use 2812's for the switch panel.. im building a new switch panel that will have backlighting instead of the over-lighting.. esp since I want to relabel some of the switches that I repurpose the slots for..

the chassis to body connector has been the culprit of several of my minor electrical issues.. your backup lights will go through that so if you have good continuity on your trans and the wire isnt busted off, thats the next place to try.

-Christopher

[Jolly Roger]

Thanks for the replies.
My single wire back up lights are 3-1/4" With an 1--1/2" hole behind it And my old flashers are 7" with a 5" hole behind them.
I have been debating buying a cheap led that would be a test candidate as far as trying to make a multi-pin work with a single wire body ground system.
My reverse light problem was the reverse light pressure switch on the right/passenger side of my 545. I jumped the two wires and was able to make them work but it is a pressure switch so make sure your parking brake and wheel chocks are in place if you don't have helping looking at them working or not

[Brad_SwiftFur]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

you have the older style dash with the round gauge face instead of the square?

Yeah, I got the dash with the round gauge openings and mechanical speedometer.

Originally Posted by Jolly Roger

Thanks for the replies.
My single wire back up lights are 3-1/4" With an 1--1/2" hole behind it And my old flashers are 7" with a 5" hole behind them.
I have been debating buying a cheap led that would be a test candidate as far as trying to make a multi-pin work with a single wire body ground system.
My reverse light problem was the reverse light pressure switch on the right/passenger side of my 545. I jumped the two wires and was able to make them work but it is a pressure switch so make sure your parking brake and wheel chocks are in place if you don't have helping looking at them working or not

With a 5" hole, best bet is to stick with the 7" lights as I did ... even though my holes were considerably smaller. My body-to-frame ground seemed OK, as many other lights worked.

So, the back-up switch on a 545 is pressure activated? Meaning the engine has to actually be running to build up pressure in the trans?

[juliol]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

ive got some plastic black wheels that take off the adhesives and nastiness without harming the paint if tyou are easy on it..

-Christopher

Hey cadillackid, can you provide more information on the plastic black wheels?

J

[Jolly Roger]

My 86-545 switch is pressure and when looking for one it seemed like a fairly common item.
The switch is in the normally open position until pressure hits it then it closes the circuit.
If you just want to jump the wires without the switch then i would think that you just need the key on and not running.

[Brad_SwiftFur]

Well, I put some fresh lights in the dash and stuck it back in place. Fiddled around with the connections to get things working again. I don't care for these mylar-backing sheets. Fired it up, checked the outside lights. Oil pressure and temperature looked good. RPM's showed up. Fuel half full. Voltage not reading ... I'll look into it later. Stuck the temp tag on it. Released the brake. Down the road I went. Tranny shifted out all four gears as it should. Speed reading zero. Derp! Forgot to put the speedo cable back in. Came back and did that. Dragged the bumper coming back into the lot. Pulled the exhaust pipe loose from the u-bend over the axle. Also bent the "step" below the bumper. Both fairly easy fixes.

It drove out well enough but a speed demon it ain't. Might do better once the old fuel is driven out and fresh is put in. I was faintly smelling "fuel" as I was driving, hard to tell if it was "burnt" fuel or "fresh" fuel (or some mix of the 2), tried to observe for black/grey smoke as I was going but it was hard to see if there was any. Maybe it's just the stale fuel and will improve with fresh fuel? Once I re-attach the exhaust, that is. I'll check the plumbing on the engine too. Could have a leaking return line or something.

[cadillackid]

always feels good to get out and run it though!!!

International and GM both used Mylar dash-circuit boards and a PAIN they are.. you Can retrofit the newer style dash cluster to your bus if yours gives you pains.. you change your speed cable to a screw on sensor and retrofit the connectors.. everything else is really similar.. you gain a bit better connections and also back-lighting..

My carpenter had 10R22.5 tires on it, when I got new ones I went up to 11R22.5's which is good for a few MPH if you are just plain running out of gears to reach top speed..

run out your fuel then change both your main fuel filter and your water separator if you have one.. After you put a fresh tank of fuel in..

is your driver console heater unit a disaster like mine is? I tore into mine yesterday and its amazing my heater core doesnt leak.. lots of bent fins and nicked tubes where someone over the years changing motors has messed it up.. all of my motors run but squeal and rub... just wondered if yours is a bergstrom and its a mess too?

I get a little bit of a fuel smell from mine too but for the life of me cant find a leak... my neighbor told me last night it may be one of the high pressure lines right at an injector seeping.. run the engine, then climb up and look at those fittings right after its shut off and then give the nut a bit of a tug if its seeping.. those fittings are notorious on many mechanical diesels.. they are pushing 1000+ PSI. yours are probably similar..

sucks about the exhaust but if it came off that easy, better it happened in your yard and not in the middle of the night on some rainy freeway in the middle of nowhere!..

-Christopher

[Brad_SwiftFur]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

always feels good to get out and run it though!!!

Yes. Yes it does.

Originally Posted by cadillackid

International and GM both used Mylar dash-circuit boards and a PAIN they are.. you Can retrofit the newer style dash cluster to your bus if yours gives you pains.. you change your speed cable to a screw on sensor and retrofit the connectors.. everything else is really similar.. you gain a bit better connections and also back-lighting..

If I'm going to go to all the trouble to rework the dash, I'm going for independent gauges. I can snag a chunk of aluminum to bolt 'em to. Isspro, Auto Meter, or ... something. The changing of the speedo to an electronic sensor is quite appealing, as some (many? All?) aftermarket speedo's can be calibrated.

Originally Posted by cadillackid

My carpenter had 10R22.5 tires on it, when I got new ones I went up to 11R22.5's which is good for a few MPH if you are just plain running out of gears to reach top speed..

I'll probably swap out the 20's for 22.5's when I get around to replacing drive tires and wheels ... front is already on 22.5 wheels.

Originally Posted by cadillackid

run out your fuel then change both your main fuel filter and your water separator if you have one.. After you put a fresh tank of fuel in..

It has 2 filters on top of the engine. Different sizes/numbers. One probably does serve as the water separator.

Originally Posted by cadillackid

is your driver console heater unit a disaster like mine is? I tore into mine yesterday and its amazing my heater core doesnt leak.. lots of bent fins and nicked tubes where someone over the years changing motors has messed it up.. all of my motors run but squeal and rub... just wondered if yours is a bergstrom and its a mess too?

I haven't opened mine up yet. From what I can see on top of the core, it's dusty and needs a cleaning, but that's all I can see.

Originally Posted by cadillackid

I get a little bit of a fuel smell from mine too but for the life of me cant find a leak... my neighbor told me last night it may be one of the high pressure lines right at an injector seeping.. run the engine, then climb up and look at those fittings right after its shut off and then give the nut a bit of a tug if its seeping.. those fittings are notorious on many mechanical diesels.. they are pushing 1000+ PSI. yours are probably similar.

That wouldn't surprise me. No idea if any of the o-rings have ever been replaced (assuming it has o-rings). I'll put that on the list of "things to check out".

Originally Posted by cadillackid

sucks about the exhaust but if it came off that easy, better it happened in your yard and not in the middle of the night on some rainy freeway in the middle of nowhere!..

Exhaust clamps aren't expensive. No idea how tight the joint was before (and didn't recall seeing a busted clamp on the ground), so who knows? This is why I'm glad it's in a nearby storage yard, in an industrial area. Even though there's quite a bit of traffic on the roads, it's not far to find a place to safely turn around and return. Yay for shakedown runs! And there wasn't too much shaking ...

[Brad_SwiftFur]

No updates this week, I have been busy and not had much time to mess with it. I have, however, been giving thought as to what exactly I plan to do with it. Either way, I plan to put it to work to make $$. Option 1 - build a party-wagon out of it, jamming sound system, TV, fancy LED lighting, black out the inside, along-the-walls seating all that goes with it. Option 2 - build it into a food truck. Used restaurant kitchen equipment can be found all over Craigslist/Ebay/Govdeals. Plumbing would likely involve a pair of 100 gal aluminum (former) fuel tanks ... one may have to be stainless for the "fresh" water. They would probably go on fuel tank brackets, right in front of the drive axle, one on each side. Probably retain 4 of the seats, build a pair of restaurant-style booths with seats facing a table attached to the wall.

Thoughts?

[cadillackid]

when I was in austim I saw a couple skoolies art food kitchens... carpemnters are decent height ceiling for it... the one mosty notable was a pizza kitchen with the oven vents going out the back.. since pizza is made in a Line-style fashion it works well in a bus...

party busses are tough because of thre size... we have one really fance party bvus here in the city.. im not sure who made the body, the front is a freightliner.. it looks slightly shorter than a skoolie.. it'd driver said its a total pain to drive... not in the city so much but the residential streets csars, parked on both sides, tight corners, etc.. where such it has to pick up people..

obnviously a school bus has done the residential street thing but apartment complexes could prove to be tricky if there are party pickups there...

-Christopher

[Brad_SwiftFur]

Quick check in. It's been rather hot and I've been rather low on funds, so not much has been done. I snagged an exhaust clamp and raised the hood to check on the fuel smell. The center 2 injectors on the driver's side had small puddles of fuel around them, I didn't have much time but I am thinking the fuel return lines are shot. Fortunately, being common rubber fuel line, I can snag a few feet of this at any local parts store for a few bucks. I'll go pull one off so I can match up size. I might as well replace the cheap spring clamps while I'm at it. Even if this doesn't fix the problem - it eliminates one thing to go wrong in the future. And while I'm at it, I'll check the tightness of the high pressure lines. Speaking of which...

My local mechanic seems to think these lines on this particular engine do not use O-rings; they might be a flared fitting instead. All the same, I'll check 'em while I'm up there. And I'll check the ones on the injector pump ... he advised me to take 2 wrenches and be sure to brace the "nut" on the injector pump ... as allowing it to turn might alter the timing of that injector. Good to know, I will be careful to avoid it. Since I did not see much residue around the injector pump, nor any pooling in the intake valley, I am thinking there are no leaks at the injector pump.

[Brad_SwiftFur]

*Supplemental* I am also still considering my options as far as what I plan to use it for. If I plan to build a food truck out of it, in addition to all the necessary commercial grade kitchen things, I will need to consider at least 4 things. Namely:

1 and 2 - fresh and waste water tanks. Both would likely go on the driver's side, using former road-tractor fuel tank brackets (and at least for the waste water) an aluminum tank as well. The fresh will likely need to be stainless for sanitary purposes. Before anyone gets all "Side-to-side weight balance" and reminding me water weighs ~8 pounds/gallon, I am figuring a full fuel tank (being steel, with crash cage), and only one of the water tanks would be full at any one time (or about the equivalent between them both), the weight would more or less balance out.
3 - Power. Not all places will have shore power available, so I will need to consider a generator capable of powering the entire setup. Diesel would be the preferred choice, I would like to set it up to use the same tank as the main engine does. No point in needing 2 fuel tanks when one can suffice. If all the kitchen items are all electric, this can easily go upwards of 20KW. I could consider propane instead ...
4 - Cooling. The bus already has dual A/C systems, driven from engine mounted compressors. Idling the engine could cool the bus, but doing so with a crowd around isn't exactly a desirable option. Running a generator wouldn't be as bad, as the exhaust from it will be considerably less than the main engine, likely "cleaner", and directed away from where a crowd would be congregating. So would there be a way to use the generator to power the current A/C systems, perhaps using the existing belt-driven compressors? In considering this, the A/C systems would be set up to run and work independently of the main engine and ignition circuit.

[Brad_SwiftFur]

Well, a few hours of sweat, 3 feet of 3/16" fuel line and some hose clamps later, the 2" long returns from the injectors to the return rail have been replaced. I saw no evidence of any significant leakage on the passenger side, and only the middle 2 on the driver's side. There's 2 lines (one on each side) going from the return rails to a central line, which I did not (yet) replace, but plan to. It was getting hot, I was getting dehydrated, and neglected to bring any water with me (I was at a storage yard). So I called it quits for now.

Earlier I messed with getting the exhaust back in place and back together. Upon closer inspection, the rear pipe and u-bend going over the axle have rusted through in places. A couple of the hanger bolts have rusted in place. I haven't checked the section from the axle to the engine, but I think it's safe to say it needs to be replaced too.

The straight sections of 4" pipe will be easy enough to find, as for the formed section over the axle, should I look for a factory designed part? Universal part? Have one fabricated locally? Look into flex-pipe? Get a number of 45 degree bends, cut & weld as needed to mimic the original (I don't have the tools and skills to do this)? Ideas? Suggestions?

[cadillackid]

you'll have a tough time spinning those underhood compressors with an electric motor.. most Bus A/C systems are 40k-50k BtuH EACH... that would require a Heck of a motor and a Generator to run those.. if you want electric A/C and attempt to cool a kitchen you will need 3 or 4 rooftop units to do the job which still requires a heck of a generator...

im assuming your food truck setup for cooking would be propane for the fryers, cooktops, ovens, etc.. and then electric for your "hoods".. if you use a real restaraunt style hood (they make them for food trucks) they bring in their own outside air and create an exhaust loop which leaves most of your interior cool air intact...

im not sure how food trucks do where you are.. but around here and most places ive been they have 1 or 2 rather noisy generators and one I know of leaves their truck run to keep their refrigeration cool.. they have an engine driven A/C compressor running their main refrigerator.. that trucks is gasoline.. I guess you have to run your bus at idle and walk around it and see if it is really noisy back where you would be serving and / or smells like diesel smoke..

shore power is rare for food trucks... some of the MAJOR festivals in our city offer shore power but even our food truck festival they are all on generators....

-Christopher

[Brad_SwiftFur]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

you'll have a tough time spinning those underhood compressors with an electric motor.. most Bus A/C systems are 40k-50k BtuH EACH... that would require a Heck of a motor and a Generator to run those.. if you want electric A/C and attempt to cool a kitchen you will need 3 or 4 rooftop units to do the job which still requires a heck of a generator...

I'm thinking if I set up a small diesel generator, the A/C systems could be belt-driven? The blowers and fans would remain 12v electric.

Originally Posted by cadillackid

im assuming your food truck setup for cooking would be propane for the fryers, cooktops, ovens, etc.. and then electric for your "hoods".. if you use a real restaraunt style hood (they make them for food trucks) they bring in their own outside air and create an exhaust loop which leaves most of your interior cool air intact...

Propane would probably be the way to go, using all electric appliances would require quite a large generator. The hood probably wouldn't use all that much power compared to "everything else".

Originally Posted by cadillackid

im not sure how food trucks do where you are.. but around here and most places ive been they have 1 or 2 rather noisy generators and one I know of leaves their truck run to keep their refrigeration cool.. they have an engine driven A/C compressor running their main refrigerator.. that trucks is gasoline.. I guess you have to run your bus at idle and walk around it and see if it is really noisy back where you would be serving and / or smells like diesel smoke..

I see a lot of food trucks and trailers being built and many are completely self contained, many run a 8-10KW generator (and propane for cooking). No idea what (if anything) is done for cooling.

If we do this, we will probably set up at festivals, and set up at one of the local flea markets between times. We don't want to run this 7-days-a-week, more like do it as weekend warriors.

Originally Posted by cadillackid

shore power is rare for food trucks... some of the MAJOR festivals in our city offer shore power but even our food truck festival they are all on generators....

Yeah, unless we are at a camp site, a 50A shore power is unlikely to happen.

[Brad_SwiftFur]

It's been a while since I've done anything with the bus. I went through a job loss and period of unemployment, so everything was put on hold while I got the employment and income back on track. Still getting caught up financially, but better than being broke.

I recently had another thought. As a regional driver, I stopped for food and saw some folks sitting in a parking lot with a bunch of stuff spread out, like a small yard sale. And I got to thinking - could something like this be set up in a bus, like a miniature, rolling thrift store? Would there be any demand for something like that? Would I have any success with it?

Basically the build would be rather simple. Remove seats - install shelves (up to about 3' high, basically up to the bottoms of the windows or so). The first thing that comes to mind is a bunch of loose merchandise that could (and would) easily fall from the shelves. I have a number of plastic crates that could hold the goods and still be easily/quickly secured for travel. Shelves could be reclaimed 3/4" plywood (which I have on hand). Wouldn't necessarily need full shelving on both sides, as I'd probably need room for a few pieces of furniture and larger items.

I have a garage already stuffed with things I don't need but still have some life left in them - the kind of stuff you'd expect to find at a thrift store or garage sale.

Ideas? Thoughts? Feedback?

[Oldmopars]

Originally Posted by Brad_SwiftFur

It's been a while since I've done anything with the bus. I went through a job loss and period of unemployment, so everything was put on hold while I got the employment and income back on track. Still getting caught up financially, but better than being broke.

I recently had another thought. As a regional driver, I stopped for food and saw some folks sitting in a parking lot with a bunch of stuff spread out, like a small yard sale. And I got to thinking - could something like this be set up in a bus, like a miniature, rolling thrift store? Would there be any demand for something like that? Would I have any success with it?

Basically the build would be rather simple. Remove seats - install shelves (up to about 3' high, basically up to the bottoms of the windows or so). The first thing that comes to mind is a bunch of loose merchandise that could (and would) easily fall from the shelves. I have a number of plastic crates that could hold the goods and still be easily/quickly secured for travel. Shelves could be reclaimed 3/4" plywood (which I have on hand). Wouldn't necessarily need full shelving on both sides, as I'd probably need room for a few pieces of furniture and larger items.

I have a garage already stuffed with things I don't need but still have some life left in them - the kind of stuff you'd expect to find at a thrift store or garage sale.

Ideas? Thoughts? Feedback?

I don't know where I saw it, but it has been done. You would need a venue. Best places would be at street fairs, public farmers markets, etc.
Its a good idea especially if you could promote the Green aspect of it. Think of parking places that Green/Hipster/artisan type events would be happening. This would be your best audience.
As a non-profit idea, you could have a mobile clothing and food bus for the homeless.

[Dapplecreek]

Originally Posted by Oldmopars

...As a non-profit idea, you could have a mobile clothing and food bus for the homeless.

Before getting too creative, investigate the need for a CDL for whatever it is you're considering. Might be prohibitive.

[Brad_SwiftFur]

Originally Posted by Dapplecreek

Before getting too creative, investigate the need for a CDL for whatever it is you're considering. Might be prohibitive.

An excellent point. However - (1) I already have a Class A CDL, and (2) this bus is under 26K and has hydraulic brakes, keeping it out of CDL range.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by Brad_SwiftFur

An excellent point. However - (1) I already have a Class A CDL, and (2) this bus is under 26K and has hydraulic brakes, keeping it out of CDL range.

interesting how your full-size carpenter is less than 26k, yet my little 7 row is 27500 with air ... whoever ordered mine mustve wanted one heck of a soilid heavy bus.. LOL..
-Christopher