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Old 02-23-2009, 11:56 PM   #1
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Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Greetings everyone! I've frequented this site for quite a while now. I've finally been able to purchase a school bus for my very own live-aboard conversion. I'm intending to have an onboard ceramic shop, and I'll maybe specialize in making ceramic instruments.

Here's the link off of Ebay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayI ... 0288323294

I'll be picking it up this Saturday!

I'm so nervous, I've never driven anything that big before!

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Old 02-24-2009, 10:30 AM   #2
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Thanks! I would transfer, but I'm already settled in. Are there any good sites or anything you know of where I can go to learn about the throttle, choke, and various other aspects of diesel engines? I've only ever worked with gassers, and I'm hauling my bus about 500 miles this weekend!
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Old 02-25-2009, 01:45 AM   #3
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

I've been doing some research on my Bus. I know it has an Allison 545 transmission, and the engine is a DT360 diesel. It's a 72 passenger bus. It's most likely a Navistar International Vista. It has a hitch on the back, and from the looks of it the radio is still installed. It was supposedly manufactured in 1990, but the tags say 1989. The engine was overhauled 50,000 miles ago, and the odometer reades 160k.

Body
One of the more distinctive aspects of the Thomas Vista was its body. The body design placed the engine half inside the bus and half outside the bus. This allowed the driver more visibility, gave the bus a tighter turning radius and allowed for greater seating capacity while still being cheaper than a transit school bus.

Chassis
Vistas made before 1992 were built on either GMC or a Chevrolet chassis, but the chevrolet was rare.

Engine
Vistas on Navistar International 3600 chassises made before 1994 came with Navistar International DT360 or 7.3 L engines.

Flaws
Despite its wide acceptance in school districts, the Vista was also heavily criticized. The part of the engine that was inside the bus was shielded by a thin metal casing. As a result, a lot of the engine's heat would end up going inside the bus. Diesel engines are not known for being quiet, and a lot of the engines noise also wound up inside the bus. Vistas were also plagued by suspension problems. Because a good portion of the engine was behind the front wheels, this reduced the effectiveness of the bus's suspension. The front wheels in a conventional style school bus are placed in front of the driver. However, because the Vista's engine is partially inside the bus, there was less weight in front of the wheels, making for a bumpy ride.

___

Alright. I'm still trying to find out what kind of chassis I have. I'm trying to find out as much as I can before bringing that bad boy home.

I have a lot of scrap wood, a CB radio, a futon, and a dream.

There's a ceramic studio close by that has expressed interest in donating an old electric kiln to me, assuring me that I could easily convert it to propane, and they've offered to help in the construction of a high fire kiln, which I intend to place on the rear outside of the bus. It will utilize lightweight space age ceramic fibers that cause the tempature to be volcanic hot on the inside of the kiln, and cool to the touch on the outside, so it should work perfectly for my application.

I'm also planning on putting a rack/deck on top. I'm curious about grafting another vehicle on top, although the legal height is only 14' high. I guess I'll have to do some measuring and see what I come up with as far as height. How would I find out about weight limits for the top of my bus?

Naturally, I'll be converting it over to WVO with a two tank onboard filtration system. Right now I'm planning on implementing a switch-over system so I can have the option of flushing with diesel just before shutting her down. The thought was that the engine would heat up the oil until it could use it properly, and then it would be manually be switched over to run off of the veggie oil using a Y coupler valve. Any thoughts on this?

I was thinking about placing a water tank on the roof, since that would allow for the free flow of gravity, but I'm not sure if that would affect driving, or if it would cause any new problems. My biggest concern is the shower. Me and my friend are both used to taking really long showers that use a lot of water. That can be changed, but I would still like to have a huge water tank. Perhaps I could have one that's for drinking, and the other that's just "clean" water to use for bathing and things of that nature? Also, I've heard that you can use graywater to flush your toilet...do you need to install a pump for that, or how does it work?

I'm looking at putting a huge propane tank, a veggie tank (or two), a graywtaer, blackwater, and freshwater(?) tank underneath the bus, in addition to the diesel fuel tank already mounted there. On the inside of the bus, or if height permits, the roof, will have the cermic chop and living quarters. There will also be a marine battery bank inside, and a periscope. Not to mention the astronomy equipment. I'm planning on building it in such a way that it's completely serviceable if something should break inside (like plumbing) and every possible inch of space is utliizable.

First comes the removal of the seats, then the floor and side panels... ugh... Did I mention this bus will be done by May? I'm hoping to get everything donated to me, as much as is possible anyways. Well, if it's not done by May, then I'll be living in it anyways...

I've only ever worked on cars and pickups, but never a Diesel. I do have a lot of experience with carpentry, and I've worked with insulation, plumbing, jerry-rigging, improvising, scrounging, painting, and elecrical systems. I've never worked with propane though, so that's something I'll be asking a lot of questions about.

I work with a a lot of charitable organizations here in Decatur, Illinois and as a result I know a lot of homeless people. I'm also located in the middle of them all, and I know that my bus will be tempting to them. Is there a way to easily lock it up? It seems silly that busses don't really lock. I would hate to have a reason to not want to volunteer my time helping them anymore.

Any comments so far?
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Old 02-25-2009, 05:17 PM   #4
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Thanks Smitty! I didn't think about there being a difference in vibrations at differing points on the bus.

So I've sort of run into a problem. The buss is 500 miles away, and I don't have a school bus license. The lady at the DMV told me that I could use a class B CDL if I removed the seats, but I don't have one of those. I'm trying really hard to find someone willing to drive for me, and we'll see how that works out, but do you guys have any ideas? I just have a regular drivers license.

I would send the title to Tennessse to have Vanguy67 register it as a motorhome for me, but that would take a couple of weeks, and I have two days. yikes.

Worst comes to worse i may just drive it back illegally, but the risks are way too high... Any thoughts?
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Old 02-25-2009, 08:20 PM   #5
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Ummm, is the seller planning to put the alternator back on before you take delivery? Might be kinda tough to drive it very far without one. Look at the pic of the passengers' side of the engine - see the loose belt and empty brackets? I think the alternator is supposed to occupy that space. I'm sure I'll be corrected at least once if I'm wrong.

Oh, and I agree with jimmyaustintx - I believe I'd just throw some plates on it and go. How many times have you seen school buses pulled over by the police? If I did happen to get stopped, I'd play very friendly and very stupid.
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Old 02-26-2009, 12:24 AM   #6
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Zamfir, thanks for pointing that out. The seller said he replaced the alternator, so that's good to go. What concerns me is the tags say 1989 but the dealer says it's a 1990, and is very firm about that. I'm gonna feel a little awkward making sure the title is actually for THAT bus.

I really like the idea of just throwing some plates on it and going. I'm concerned that something may happen though. If I had experience driving a rig that big I wouldn't feel as bad about it, but I've never driven anything bigger than a mini-van before. I haven't been able to find very much information on driving a school bus. I think I just have to remember it's a big heavy vehicle that makes wide turns and has tail swing, and remember to stop at all railroad tracks, and then I'm ok, but I'm uneasy about it.

I have some people looking around for me here, so we'll see what turns up.
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Old 02-26-2009, 12:33 AM   #7
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

What plates would you just "throw" on it? I would not advise putting plates that do not belong on it for the sake of driving it home. Thats gonna get you in trouble. It takes it from being "stupid" and driving it without the right license to an act of deception... the one is a lot easier to get away with, the other will get the book thrown at you.

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Old 02-26-2009, 10:21 AM   #8
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gypsy_Kid
... What concerns me is the tags say 1989 but the dealer says it's a 1990, and is very firm about that. I'm gonna feel a little awkward making sure the title is actually for THAT bus.
I'd say that's fairly common. Mine says it's a 1999 on the title, but the data plate says it was manufactured in 2000. If DMV gives you any grief on the discrepancy you should just point out to them (in a nice way) that the bus manufacturer takes possession of a chassis and has to build the body on it. The bus has to be titled by the year of the chassis but the data plate shows the year of the completed vehicle.
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Old 02-26-2009, 02:25 PM   #9
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Thanks, that makes me feel better. I feel less ignorant now. hehe.

So... apparently school busses don't have 30 days free insurane upon new aquisition like cars do?

So I'm looking at hopefully buying it (without being able to look it over) and getting the title shipped to me overnight, and then I can send that to Vanguy67 to register for me in Tennesee as a motorhome. Then I can have it overnighted back to me and find an insurance provider. After that, I can go pick it up legally. I'm really tempted to just drive it home as is, but not having the proper license is bad enough without the addition of it being uninsured.

Well, that's that I guess. I'll let you guys now how it works out.
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Old 03-02-2009, 12:59 PM   #10
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Safely home!

So, me and my girlfriend found someone to help us get the school bus last Saturday (a couple days ago). On the way back from Minnesota we accidentally took a wrong turn and ended up going through downtown Chicago! I remember reading somewhere on this site that they have really low bridges there, well, that's true.

So yeah. The conversion process will start soon! I'll post pictures as soon as I can!
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Old 03-10-2009, 01:12 PM   #11
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Progress Report:

We've been working hard on removing the seats, it's difficult though because me and my fiance are both in college still. By the way, we got engaged last week!

I think I'm just going to give up and take an angle grinder out after those seat bolts.

I aquired a lot of foam insulation board, and fibreboard this afternoon. I was reading that fibreboard is used as an insulator, and was thinking about putting it down on the floor. It's rated as being able to withstand 80 psi. I'd put that down and then put 1/2" plywood over it. Any thoughts about this?

Alright, let's get down to business. I'm going to rip those seats out, take all the panels off and dispose of the old insulation, take all the windows out, and then raise the roof. I'm thinking 12-16" but I'll have to think about that a little bit more. Would it be possible to use the steel from the seats to do the roof raising, or is that not advisable?
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Old 03-13-2009, 01:19 PM   #12
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Quote:
Originally Posted by mightybus
I would avoid marriage like the plague in modern America. Go to http://www.nomarriage.com.
Sad, but when fathers and their children have their constitutional rights restored, Then heck yeah get married. But don't worry, nobody in love listens to the reality. Judges, lawyers, psychologists and the women folk know this.
That's an interesting site. My brother was once into that. He's now paying child support on two kids, has been divorced twice, and has been engaged I don't even know how many times. Perhaps the smart ones are those who understand what they're getting into, and don't put themselves first in the picture.

So, when I picked up the bus I was told that the title was in a vault in the bank, and the service records were neededing to be printed off of a computer. Today I received a title for a 77 passenger 1991 Blue Bird, complete with a lien. My bill of sale simply says "one used school bus." I'm pretty sure I now legally own this blue bird bus, but I'd rather have the Thomas I paid for. To make things even more jank, I received a packet of service records for a Thomas 3600, which isn't the bus the title was for, or the bus that I have... Oh how I love Bernard bus sales!

I'm working on getting those seats out, and will hopefully get the roof raised this week. I got a good deal on the steel, but I don't have any sheet metal yet, and I need to secure a welder. I'm thinking about siding it with plywood for now, and then putting two layers of fibreboard on, and the sandwiching it all with another sheet of plywood. That should help when it comes to constructing the inside of the bus, and then I can always cover the outside with sheetmetal if I get some.

I'm still working out the details for the floor plan, but I think the back access door will open into the ceramic shop. There's a guy here who said he'd help me build the kiln. I think that since there'll be clay on the floor all the time, I'll seal it up and then put linoleum down. For the rest of the bus I plan to seal it, put slates down, foam insulation board between the slates, and then 3/4" plywood over that as a surface.

Well, I'm gonna go work on it some more. Keep on Skoolin it up everyone!
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Old 04-09-2009, 12:20 PM   #13
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

I apologize for not having pictures up yet. That's something I need to work on.

I have class in 15 minutes, so I'm just gonna give a quick update.

We have half of the seats removed, but they're all stripped to bare metal. I've been srounging sheet metal to prepare for the roof detachment, but man is that stuff hard to find. Any thoughts as to where I could look besides university dumpsters?

I've gotten a lot of supplies from dumpster diving. Among them is a like-new stainless steel kitchen faucet, and various things of that nature. And of course a lot of lumber. Actually, my dorm is full of lumber right now! Oh, and I found this huge plastic gas tank from a car, and a metal bed frame.

I want to do an 18" roof raise, and was wondering how long my posts should be. I was thinking 24" which left 3 inches on either side to be welded to, but now I'm thinking that's not enough. What would you guys suggest? And does the 1x1 steel actually slip into the old posts, or do I attach it to the outside?

Josh
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Old 04-23-2009, 02:05 PM   #14
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus



Above should be a picture of my bus plans.

I've been debating as to whether I wanted to raise the roof still or weld some old VW vans on top. My fiance has been busy trying to graduate, so we haven't been able to put together any concrete plans yet.

I got all the steel I needed for the roof raise today. I was going to purchase it, but then the theatre department decided to throw it all out, so I got it for free! That's pretty much made me think it would be a good idea to just raise the roof. And now that I've got a welder secured, I'm anxious to get on that.

I got an undercargo storage box today, and all kinds of sheet metal. I've also gotten my hands on 200 pine boards, 8 inches wide by 9 foot 9 inches long. And I think I mentioned before that I got all the insulation foam I needed from a dumpster. Now all I gotta do is get the stove, toilet, holding tanks, sink, and some various little articles.


I've got all kinds of stuff now. I even found pipe sealant tape in some bushes, fancy that. I haven't gotten any pictures in the daytime yet, so I don't have any decent enough to post yet. More to come later
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:27 AM   #15
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

i think id be checking out the lein issue before i went much further.....whats up with that bus dealer?wrong records also? i hate crap like that.....hope you get that worked out!
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Old 04-27-2009, 12:25 PM   #16
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Quote:
Originally Posted by timbuk
i think id be checking out the lein issue before i went much further.....whats up with that bus dealer?wrong records also? i hate crap like that.....hope you get that worked out!

That's the thing I forgot to update about. The vendor said they had the right title, and I had them read the VIN number off of it to verify. They wanted me to send back the title that they sent me in error before sending me the correct one... I do have all the legal documentation saying I own the bus, meaning the EBAY page, and my sales slip. The slip doesn't say anything except "Bernarnd Bus Sales...Sold 'One used school bus, $2150'" but that matches up with the EBAY page, so legally I can do quite a bit with that.

I agree though, that kind of stuff shouldn't happen. As a business major, I always want to go to those companies and improve their systems.

It's supposed to rain this weekend, so I guess there'll be no raising of the roof just yet. That's good since I don't have everything planned out yet, but it'd be nice to of gotten that done. The two things everyone keeps telling me is not to rush it, and to have all my ducks in a row. My fiance said she'd have time to work on it after graduation, but I'm just concerned about our lack of welding experience. I did fins a stove today though, and need to go see if it still works and if I can have it. I'm finding all kinds of things in the dumpsters! And this afternoon I'm going to go talk with some individuals about getting a free camper to strip out, and a woodshop to work in. That's be nice. In case I forgot to mention it, my dorm is so full of bus stuff that I have to sleep in the University lounge!
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Old 05-06-2009, 02:16 AM   #17
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Fellow Bus-Hippies

Actually, I know that all of you are respectable women and men, and I hold all of you in the highest regard. It has been my hope to get some feedback from you guys to help me better plan for and construct this bus that is to be me and my fiance's new home.

So good news and bad news. The good news is, life is hilarious! I've been doing so much dumpster diving that my room is now completely full of lumber and stuff. And then my biulding supervisor said I can't sleep in the lounge anymore. I'm pretty sure that university lounges are there for people to use for whatever they feel like using them for, but I'm not going to fight it. Actually, I'm ust gonna go sleep at the security office instead.

I've been scrounging all kinds of stuff. The other day I got a fridge, and I got a guy who has a couple of campers he's been parting out, and said that I could go strip them if I wanted. Hopefully I can get what I need. And then I'm having a hard time finding a clawfoot bathtub for the misses I had one I found for free, but we didn't get to it fast enough and it was gone

Progress is both slow and fast. We're getting all kinds of supplies, but work hasn't "officially" started yet. We're gonna try to work on it a bunch before we go to Europe on the 25th, and then we'll finish it after we get back on the 22nd of June. THe bad news is, I'm moving onto the bus as my home on May 12th. Hopefully that'll go over well.

I've learned as of late that grocery stores throw out all kinds fo food that's prefectly good... Dumpster diving! Oh yeah, the university students haven't started throwing stuff out, but I'll be busy scrounging in between my finals. Hope all is well with all of y'alls.
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Old 06-08-2009, 11:53 AM   #18
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

I've been living quite comfortably in the bus lately. I came home early from Europe and have been trying to work odd jobs and prepare the bus for construction.

My parents are bringing a stove down for me on July 6th, and I'm picking up a clawfoot bathtub either tonight or tomorrow (it's 4 foot long and 2 feet wide. Perfect for a bus). I still gotta get the fridge from the guy who's giving it to me. I've also tracked down a wood burning stove for free, but I'm not sure if I want it or not. I guess I'll see if the electric one works out first (it's a full sized kithen stove).

The batttery bank is looking mighty scary to invest in. I decided that I needed 6 gold cart batteris ($360), a power inverter that is capable of running 29 amps comfortably ($384), a gernator to charge the batteries ($200), and a battery charger to transfer power from the generator to the battery bank (haven't checked on prices yet). Then I should have a good supply of 110v power on the bus.

I'm scheduled for a roof raise (18") after I get back from canoeing the Ozarks on July 10th, and have some plans for the undrcarriage. I'm also gonna put a rack on top, and deck out the cockpit like a space ship.

I'm still tracking down an RV toilet, and holding tanks. That's not working out so well, but Every now and then I find a good toilet on Ebay real cheap.

I'm not sure if I like the muffler sticking out on the side like that, so I've been contemplating rearranging it.
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Old 06-12-2009, 11:47 AM   #19
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

Haha, thanks.

I got a visit from the cops last night. They thought it was funny I was living in the bus, but the guy who owns the lot says I need to think of something else. I don't want to move it, because that's the perfect place to work on it, and I have a job within 5 minutes walk. I'm not sure what's gonna happen there, but anyways. I remember people talking about tons of rivets they had to grind out of their buses, but mine is full of screws. I thought I still had to grind them, but I discovered last night that I can remove them quite easily by hand. 'm gonna see about getting a drill and taking off all the wall and ceiling panels this weekend.

Any thoughts on how to get rid of poison ivy? I got paid $45 to pull a whole ton of it off a building, and careful as I was that stuff protested wuite meanly

I'll eventually get pics up, I hope...
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The absence of the presence of skoolies on American roads is an unfortunate predicament for all peoples, its one which I intend to change by doing my part in promoting skoolie awareness!

Joshua D. Harris
Business Management Major
Gypsy_Kid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2009, 12:08 PM   #20
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Join Date: Feb 2008
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Re: Gypsy Ceramic Shop Bus

for the poison ivy, a topical benedryl lotion is the best thing for dealing with the itch. For trying to dry out the poisonous oils from the wounds, try soaking in a nice hot bath with lots of starch. The starch will help pull the oils out, and it is quite a relief.

Don't ask me how I know...
jim
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