Projekt: Freedom Panda begins!

[FreedomPanda]

Brand new, first post, super excited to go through the whole process and document it here for myself & others!

A little about myself:

45, live on the Central Coast of California. CA native, born & raised in Santa Barbara.

One huge reason I'm going to build out a skoolie is money and the overall practicality of building a tiny home I can live out of and travel with if necessary. I've started a non profit that helps victims & survivors of human trafficking, and anyone who knows what it's like to start a business, whether it be for or non profit status, knows money can be an issue. I'll be able to drive to nearby conferences & speaking engagements in the bus when appropriate, and sleeping in my own bed

Another huge reason is I'm single, no kids, and living in a little place that's your own without a massive mortgage/homeowners fees/taxes/etc etc just sounds so good.

My design idea is to keep the bus airy & open feeling, with a wood trim theme. My first choice would be to go with bamboo. (Hence the 'Freedom Panda' name...) Dark stain for the floor, lighter almost natural stain for the walls/ceiling. Layout hasn't been set in stone, but looking at a minimalist theme. Kitchen sink, shower, queen bed in back, wood burning stove, outlets, composting toilet, small water heater assisted by stove that has attachment for that purpose (Nectre Bakers Oven). Non profit workspace (computer/printer, etc.). No flat screen, don't watch much TV, but I do love movies so I'll have a drop down screen & video projector & BluRay player that I use in my current place. Cozy, homey, functional, rent-almost-free.

So there's my idea...I've never done anything like this before, so it'll be a very fresh experience for me. I've started the search process, in fact stopped by a local church that has an old but sturdy International dognose that I'd heard they were selling. Unfortunately, they aren't, it would have been perfect.

So the search will continue, and I'll update as I go along. It's good to be here, and this community has already caused me to cut into my nights sleep several times already

Blessings,

Dug

[bansil]

welcome
where is home base incase people know of buses near by?

[FreedomPanda]

I'm based in Paso Robles, California, right on the 101 freeway directly between San Francisco & Los Angeles. Located right next to the 46 E. highway, which leads 110 miles to Fresno or Bakersfield.

Dug

[cowlitzcoach]

Knowing what the final version will look like is pretty important.

Any idea as to which bus you would like to purchase to make your dream come true?

[FreedomPanda]

Bansil, posted a reply earlier, but didn't take...I'm right on the 101 freeway directly between San Francisco & Los Angeles, in a little wine country town called Paso Robles.

Cowlick, I have my eyes on a 1973 Gillig schoolbus, V8 diesel, 5-speed standard, air brakes & power steering. It has a horizontal 1/2 emergency exit in back, and storage lockers underneath. (That's big for me, since that will save lots of hours fabricating my own). The layout inside won't be drastically affected by adding or subtracting 5 feet either way, so I have a general-yet-solid idea of what the interior will look like and include...that being said, there's tons of details that will spring up from inspiration here, or necessity once I actually have THE bus

[Tango]

A Big Skoolie Welcome! --- Just take the time to figger out what/which unit is right to fit your dream and go for it. And don't forget to take & share lots of pix along the way.

[FreedomPanda]

Won the auction today that the 1973 Gillig was listed in...really happy, because looks-wise & size-wise it's what I was looking for. Side storage, 5 speed manual, v8 diesel. Love the oldschool lines & style.
Price: $2,200. Heading up to pick it up & drive it the 2.5 hours back on Tuesday, so I'll post up some pics then. Really can't wait to tear out the seats & floor & start measuring.

So stoked, this came together faster than I'd anticipated, but thankful it did!

[EastCoastCB]

Congrats. Be glad I won my auction in Ky or I was going to bid on that Gillig and try driving it back to Fl. I also saw the pair of 1983 Crowns in Washington state! You folks out West get all the great buses!
Pics!!!!!!

[cowlitzcoach]

Gillig was considered to be on par with the Crown, both of which were reffered to as the Cadillac and LIncoln of school buses.

In a world of low bids and less than 20-year life cycles they couldn't compete.

Your bus will most likely have a Cat 1160/3208 engine. They are okay engines. If it still has a Cummins 555 (highly doubtful at this late date), good luck. The triple nickle was a very poor choice for an automotive application. It might have a Detroit Diesel 8.2L 4-cycle diesel that replaced the 555. It was sort of okay but parts and service for them is pretty much non-existent these days. In case someone can't count it may have a Detroit Diesel 6V-53 2-cycle diesel. That is a good engine but defined the "screamin' Jimmy" moniker. In case someone doesn't know the difference between gas and diesel it may have a Ford 534 gas V-8. If you don't mind less than 3 MPG it isn't a bad engine. And for most RV purposes, unless you intend to travel 10,000 miles per month, it wouldn't be a bad choice.

The challenges with a Gillig has to do with rust. For whatever reason Gillig used a lower quality steel in their drip rails. I have seen more than a few Gilligs that were no better than scrap because rust in the drip rail was not addressed in a timely fashion and the rust eventually got into the roof panels and rood bows. They also tended to rust around the fenders and along the lower rub rail that was required in WA state. Since your bus is from CA the fender and rub rail rust most likely will not be a problem. But the drip rail might be.

Your bus will be heavy. Our church has a 1979 Gillig that has a DT466, automatic, and is a 12-row in a 13-row bus (maximum knee spacing). It weighs just less than 26,000 lbs. Our church also has a 1986 Crown that has the DD 6-71TAC, automatic, and is the same length as the Gillig. The Crown weighs just over 18,000 lbs. The difference is all of the body panels in the Crown are aluminum and all of the body panels in the Gillig are steel.

Because your bus is heavy don't expect it to be a speedy bus. If it has a Cat 1160/3208 it most likely does not have a turbo which means it most likely has a HP rating of 210 HP. Due to vintage it most likely has a top speed in the 55-65 MPH range. It will cruise easily on flat ground at that speed all day long at about 7 MPG. When it comes to a hill it will slow down with a one gear drop on anything more than 3%. On anything more than 5% a two gear drop. On anything more than 7% you will be in 2nd gear. If you get a run at a hill it is doubtful you will ever need to drop into the lowest gear.

Since you do not have the 6-speed with the deep low first gear you will have some challenges starting on steep hills, particularly if you tow a car behind. If it is really steep it is possible to burn up your clutch. Plan ahead and don't get yourself in a position where that might be possible. Once started you won't have a problem but getting started without slipping the clutch or stalling the engine will be the challenge.

Good luck and keep us posted as to your progress.

[FreedomPanda]

EastCoast, you saw the same auction eh? It was sitting at a ridiculous $500 for too long, I knew there would be watchers & a flurry would break out at some point. I haven't seen the bus in person, but the description says it runs & tranny is fair. By the looks of the photos, rust is minimal, I'll know more Tuesday when I pick her up.

Cowlitz, wow...I really appreciate your write-up on details regarding Gilligs. I had no idea! I did notice the weight if the bus was ridiculously tank-like. Here's the specs via the auction site, and I looked a few things up specific to the year/model...

Year: 1973
Make: GILLIG
Model: SCHOOL BUS
Mileage: 117,988
Running Condition: RUNS
Engine: V8 DIESEL
Transmission: FUNCTIONAL
Tires: FAIR

1973 GILLIG 79 PASSENGER SCHOOL BUS. 1160 CATERPILLAR V-8 DIESEL ENGINE, 5-SPEED STANDARD TRANSMISSION, TIRES: 11.00-20, 32,340 GVRW, AIR BRAKES, POWER STEERING.

It looks like from the photos that the ceiling is what it is, nothing to tear out. I could be wrong. Ceiling height seems decent, wasn't really looking at the prospect if a raise with much excitement

I will get some photos up soon. I'm right in the middle of my work week, and my days are long with little opportunity but eat, sleep, work. ~...

Looking forward to learning more about this bus!

[EastCoastCB]

I ended up winning a 1992 Ward Senator in Kentucky. The weather looks like its gonna be shite, but I'm headed out tomoorow morning to pick it up monday morning.
Yeah, I saw that Gillig hanging out at the 500 dollar range! THe last I saw on the Washington Crowns was about 2600 for the nicer one.
Congrats again, be safe and have fun!
Cheers!

[FreedomPanda]

So today was the pick up day...get to meet the Gillig Monster for the for the first time. Woke up early for the 3 hour trip to Merced, CA, and had a fun ride up with friends. Random banter about all sorts of inane and important stuff, like who was in the old 80's band Asia, the bands that the members of Led Zeppelin were in first, Ralph Macchio is almost 60, and the characters & cast of 'The Outsiders' and 'Lost Boys.'

We finally made it up to the yard, and I was just hoping it would start, run, and make it home without blowing a tire or breaking a belt. When I finally got to see her...yeah. I am was STOKED!



These are some shots from the auction website...

[FreedomPanda]

The bus hadn't been started up in about 2 years, and they were charging the batteries when we got there. She started right up, the batteries were progressively gaining a charge, and she was blowing off some pent up smoke. The tires were full, and in pretty decent shape. It was just as described...only better. Absolutely beautiful, and the engine ran like diesel infused butter. The last trip it took was 2 years ago, a full load of student going to Los Angeles.

The "Merced County Sheriff" had been scraped off the side, so that saved some time. It didn't have plates, nor did I have air brake certification. There was a quick discussion of whether or not to swing by the DMV before the 175 mile trip home...nope. I'd drive her home, and cross my fingers!





Saw this great sign on the way out of the yard...


First stop before hitting the highway was gas. The gas gauge read 'empty' so I filled her up...and she still read empty. The first fix is identified!

[FreedomPanda]

Once on the road, she ran beautifully. There was very little rattle, and what little there was was easy to identify: the driver window, the random seats thrown everywhere, and a latch on a cabinet door.






The Gillig, my two friends and me...selfie.

[FreedomPanda]

The trip back was great. Really enjoyed driving such a beast. I used to drive for a trolley company, and we had one trolley almost this long...but not this beastly or heavy. From what I understand, this is about 16 tons of California made metal muscle machinery. But she drove straight & smooth, it was almost like I was just along for the ride. I kept glancing back at the bus interior, and felt like getting up and starting to measure things out...then the autopilot scene from 'Anchorman 2' popped into my head. Better keep driving, I guess....

Got home, it was dark, and decided to start by taking out the seat cushions & backings. Quick trip to OSH and my niece's 16th birthday party, then to work!






Found a magnet that was right above the driver seat on the ceiling. I approve. It will stay.


And one final shot from Day 1:



One thing that was funny was how many people had plans for the bus! Wine tasting tour...football game party bus...I'm trying to explain, "But...this is going to be my HOME!"

My favorite though, and the one I totally agreed to:
My niece asked if I'd drive her and her friends to her prom in about 18 months. I melted. Of course. I would have LOVED to go to prom with a group of friends in a decked out monster bus. So, they'll be decorating it for the night with lava lamps, disco ball, and 'groovy' carpets, pillows, lights, and beads. I'm a sucker for my nieces...fell in love with her little face 16 years ago, and am more so today. So prom it is.

There's day one...I'm exhausted. Apologies for the photos not showing immediately, they're all links...this is my first time posting photos and I created a photobucket just to upload photos here.

Dug

[bansil]

looks great, I edited your pictures, not sure why the links were dead, I normally pic the bottom "tag" in the link window, they look like what I fixed yours to

again welcome and great bus!

[EastCoastCB]

OH WOW!!
Excellent pics, man. I just got in from Kentucky to Orlando area with the Ward yesterday, had a very similar experience to yours. I'll post it here in a bit, although it won't be as nice as yours! VERY nice, good work sir.
I'm still beat from the 800 mile trip. The mountains in Tn were an experience for sure.
btw- Bansil, your sig line is so true!!!

[The Nebuchadnezzar]

Welcome! What a great looking bus. I'm in CT I'm so jealous of for well vehicles age in CA, I was in the Anaheim area this summer and couldn't believe the condition of the older vehicles, if that bus was here in the Northeast there would be little left by now. I'm just starting work on my newly purchased 2003 Amtran too. Good luck, keep us posted.

[FreedomPanda]

Thank you, Bansil. I pressed the "Img" button above, and then copied the Photobucket images. I'll try another way next time, maybe URL?

EastCoastCB, looks like you had a longer trip than I did, but we got in on the same day! Looking forward to your pictures!

Nebadchunezzer, thank you! Yes, the west coast is easier on metals than the easy coast for sure. There's a little bit of rust but really nothing some sanding & Rustoleum won't fix.

I crawled around the bus today a little more in the daylight. Very little underbody rust. There are 3 undercarriage storage compartment doors. One actually runs from one side to the other, both accessed through 2 of the doors, pretty roomy and floored with both metal bracing and wood panels. The other, on the driver's side just below & behind the driver, is just metal braces, pretty sturdy looking.

I'll spend some time today, work willing, taking out some seat frames. I work 11:00am until 2:15am, and the bus is parked in our work lot, so I'll be able to jump out throughout the day when it's not busy and chip away here and there.

I measured the entire bus & am going to start fleshing out the interior. Does anyone have a good program they've used to do that? I have a very basic program on my tablet that works great, but it's just a CAD drafting style.

[cowlitzcoach]

If you were able to get it home without any issues it most likely means you got a really good bus.

In regards to tires, it would appear as if you have tube type tires all the way around.

You will hear all sorts of horror stories about how dangerous split rims are and how hard it is to get anyone to work on them.

For your purposes, when it finally comes time to get new rubber spend the extra and get tubeless wheels. The cost of the rim and the lower cost of the tire will end up costing less than getting tubes and tube type tires to fit. If you upgrade to 24.5 tires you will also get a few more MPH at the top end over what you can do now.

In regards to the prom, make sure you do not have any more than seven couples on board. If you go over 15 passengers your RV insurance will be void and you could be facing some serious fines and penalties if you should get caught--serious as in multi-thousands of dollars.

Good luck and happy trails.