Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 01-23-2012, 09:36 PM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 61
Year: 1993
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: Genesis
Engine: Dt40
My plan to lock our air door

I need to find a way to install a door lock on the front door of our 1993 Amtran Genesis with air door.

The photo is terrible, I took it last night in the dark, but you can see that there is an air cylinder that opens and closes the door.


So, my plan is to restrict air flow at the base of the cylinder, and thus lock the door. There is a valve that opens and closes the door already, but this second valve would be installed directly at the base of the cylinder and just be a single action valve. Since it would need to be open in order to allow the door to operate, I would wire it to an ignition power source so that it was on (or open) anytime the bus key was in the on position. Then, I would install a second key switch on the outside of the bus that could supply power when switched to on, thus allowing you to push the door open from outside.

Has anyone done something similar? Suggestions?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg busdoor.jpg (108.4 KB, 363 views)
bhays is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2012, 11:04 PM   #2
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Oregon/Philippines
Posts: 1,660
Re: My plan to lock our air door

the thomas bus that i am working on now has a key switch by the passenger headlight that shuts the door and locks it. However, it is an air switch, and when the air bleeds down it allows the door to be manually opened.
__________________
Jesus Christ... Conversion in progress.
chev49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2012, 07:57 AM   #3
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 61
Year: 1993
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: Genesis
Engine: Dt40
Re: My plan to lock our air door

Quote:
Originally Posted by chev49
the thomas bus that i am working on now has a key switch by the passenger headlight that shuts the door and locks it. However, it is an air switch, and when the air bleeds down it allows the door to be manually opened.
That's the problem I was expecting if I tried to use positive air pressure. This way, with the valve directly at the base of the cylinder. It should be solid. If the air can't exhaust out of the cylinder; the ram can't retract whether there is pressure or not.
bhays is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2012, 09:28 AM   #4
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Oregon/Philippines
Posts: 1,660
Re: My plan to lock our air door

you could easily use an electric solinoid to keep your door locked. One of the good ones i use from autoloc would work well with a remote...
__________________
Jesus Christ... Conversion in progress.
chev49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2012, 09:45 AM   #5
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 61
Year: 1993
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: Genesis
Engine: Dt40
Re: My plan to lock our air door

Quote:
Originally Posted by chev49
you could easily use an electric solinoid to keep your door locked. One of the good ones i use from autoloc would work well with a remote...
The way the door folds, I wouldn't know where to put it. A pin won't work as with a standard door. Only real way to secure it other than the cylinder would seem to be a bar all the way across or a hook of some sort.
bhays is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2012, 06:29 PM   #6
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Oregon/Philippines
Posts: 1,660
Re: My plan to lock our air door

My front door still opens in the middle, although i removed the steps and welded up a box for the generator. I have not put an electric solenoid to lock the doors together, although i have been looking around my stuff for one, because if the air shuts the door tight, then a normally open solenoid would easily keep it shut as the air was let down, because the pin would be out, and the release of air would create tension against the latching part. Then when the bus had air, it of course keeps itself shut. I looked in my street rod stuff probably 3 days ago, to do that to the inside of my door, with a switch by my key operated air switch by my pass headlamps.
This will only be temporary, as i will build an upper and lower generator door, and make them only hinge on the front hinges. I did this in my last bus and it worked out very well.
So thats how i am going to do mine for now.
__________________
Jesus Christ... Conversion in progress.
chev49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2019, 01:23 PM   #7
New Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Annapolis, Maryland
Posts: 3
Year: 2007
Coachwork: Thomas Built
Chassis: School Bus
Same Issues

I am having the same issues with my 2007 Thomas Built School Bus, air operated main doors, that swing open outwards, split in the middle, and full glass. I'm currently researching to replace the doors with an RV door, as I have not found a sustainable solution to locking it up! Here is the picture of my doors. Has anyone else found an easier solution without replacing the doors?

Thanks,

Eric
Attached Images
File Type: jpg STEM Bus.jpg (209.8 KB, 19 views)
STEMbus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2019, 01:29 PM   #8
Bus Geek
 
Tango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 8,462
Year: 1946
Coachwork: Chevrolet/Wayne
Chassis: 1- 1/2 ton
Engine: Cummins 4BT
Rated Cap: 15
If you go with an RV type door you can use an RV door latch & lock. Below is one like what I am using...


https://www.etrailer.com/RV-Locks/Gl...SABEgJAj_D_BwE
Tango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2020, 11:00 PM   #9
Skoolie
 
sepudo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Socal and Vegas
Posts: 128
Year: 2003
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: fs65
Engine: 7.2 catapillar 3126
Rated Cap: 41 students
just kicking this thread up to see if anyone can offer new insight on locking an air door.

picture for context.

2003 thomas with air; door, seat, stop sign and parking brake
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 20200203_165737.jpg (437.5 KB, 22 views)
__________________
@drivingdharma
sepudo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2020, 07:30 PM   #10
Skoolie
 
Meathead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 110
Year: 2001
Coachwork: Thomas
Engine: 3126b 210hp
Rated Cap: 66
IMG_0993.jpg

I put a maglock on mine. And a cable for good measure while she is at the storage facility. I currently have a magnet only on the right door(second to close), but I have already purchased another magnet for the left side which should eliminate the play in that door.
Oh - magnets are at the top.
__________________
Dave

“Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right.” -Robert Hunter
Meathead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2020, 12:23 AM   #11
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,878
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Thomas Built Bus
Chassis: Freightliner FS65
Engine: Caterpillar 3126E Diesel
Rated Cap: 71 Passenger- 30,000 lbs.
For what it is worth, our bus has a key'd lock which locks a handle. The handle drives a metal bar across the middle of the door, securing it closed. Perhaps something like this could be fashioned on your door.
Native is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2020, 12:27 AM   #12
Skoolie
 
sepudo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Socal and Vegas
Posts: 128
Year: 2003
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: fs65
Engine: 7.2 catapillar 3126
Rated Cap: 41 students
I was reading the manual for my specific Thomas bus and noticed there is apparently an accessory key switch (like those used to override an elevator) available for the bus. It would allow a key to control the air doors essentially locking them from the outside!

I wonder if it's something I can order from Thomas?

Will follow-up
__________________
@drivingdharma
sepudo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2020, 06:30 AM   #13
Bus Crazy
 
musigenesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 2,306
Year: 2003
Coachwork: International
Chassis: CE 300
Engine: DT466e
Rated Cap: 65C-43A
Quote:
Originally Posted by sepudo View Post
I was reading the manual for my specific Thomas bus and noticed there is apparently an accessory key switch (like those used to override an elevator) available for the bus. It would allow a key to control the air doors essentially locking them from the outside!

I wonder if it's something I can order from Thomas?

Will follow-up
I don't know if this is what you're talking about, but my bus (an IC) has a keyed vandal lock that allows you to lock the air doors from the outside. Unfortunately, it's pretty much worthless as far as security is concerned, since my bus was robbed twice when I was relying on it (I was technically robbed three times but the third time was them taking my seats and ceiling panels from the pile behind my bus). I'm not exactly sure how they got in through the door - I think they either used a jiggler to pick the lock, or else I think you can just pry the doors open even with the lock (which only locks at the top) activated.

My doors are the middle-opening kind, so I just screwed on a hasp and I use a padlock now.
__________________
Rusty 87 build thread
musigenesis is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2020, 10:12 AM   #14
Skoolie
 
sepudo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Socal and Vegas
Posts: 128
Year: 2003
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: fs65
Engine: 7.2 catapillar 3126
Rated Cap: 41 students
^ I don't think my Thomas air doors operate like your IC... At least not in the way they lock.

If my air doors are closed with the systems switch inside and I shut the bus off there is no way to get in... Or in my case out. I'd have to push pull extremely hard. About as hard as I'd have to to rip off a latch and lock.

If I can simply get the doors to activate and disactivate from the outside I'd be happy for my needs.

Of course someone breaking in depends on many factors including where it's parked but I'm mindful on that part.

Will follow-up on what I find
__________________
@drivingdharma
sepudo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2020, 12:23 PM   #15
Bus Nut
 
Truthseeker4449's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 295
Year: 2001
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: HDX
Engine: CAT 3126
Quote:
Originally Posted by sepudo View Post
I was reading the manual for my specific Thomas bus and noticed there is apparently an accessory key switch (like those used to override an elevator) available for the bus. It would allow a key to control the air doors essentially locking them from the outside!

I wonder if it's something I can order from Thomas?

Will follow-up
I've found with my dealings with my Thomas dealer that you can get quicker results by bringing them the vin/body number of a bus that already has what you want. It looks like your door is identical to the doors of some Thomas MVPs that have locks in the doors themselves. I don't have a good picture of the locking mechanism itself but it shoves a bar across the doors and is actuated by a lockable handle like on a service truck.



Truthseeker4449 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2020, 12:47 PM   #16
Bus Geek
 
ol trunt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: So Cal
Posts: 2,526
Year: 1935
Coachwork: Superior
Chassis: Chevy
Engine: 317 ci/tid / Isuzu
Lots of ways to skin a cat. I used a pair of SPDT (single pole double throw) switches and a pair of relays wired like a household hallway switch. The switch on the outside is keyed and the switch on the inside is a "bat" switch. The relays keep the power switches from incurring high amps as well as directing power to the open/close circuit for the door. In the first photo there are two keyed switches seen. The top one works the door actuator and the bottom one powers the electric air compressor. In the case of my bus the door won't open from the outside unless there is air pressure in the air tank.
Jack

.

.
ol trunt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2020, 09:52 PM   #17
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,878
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Thomas Built Bus
Chassis: Freightliner FS65
Engine: Caterpillar 3126E Diesel
Rated Cap: 71 Passenger- 30,000 lbs.
That's a quite nifty way to handle the problem.
Native is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2020, 08:49 PM   #18
Skoolie
 
sepudo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Socal and Vegas
Posts: 128
Year: 2003
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: fs65
Engine: 7.2 catapillar 3126
Rated Cap: 41 students
Sooo, I really have to come up with a alternative for locking the service door other than with a padlock.
I had a sturdy lock on the latch that came with it when I bought it from the school and it got broken into and vandalized recently. Looks like they used a crowbar.

Mainly took my tool bag full of tools that I was using for the build and some odds and ends laying around inside.

At least they didn't break any glass.

I reeeally need to find a way to get the air doors to activate from the outside.

Sadly the damage to the doors is probably not enough to justify filing an insurance claim 20200317_114754.jpg20200323_183647.jpg20200323_183703.jpg20200317_114801.jpg
__________________
@drivingdharma
sepudo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2020, 09:04 PM   #19
Bus Crazy
 
musigenesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 2,306
Year: 2003
Coachwork: International
Chassis: CE 300
Engine: DT466e
Rated Cap: 65C-43A
Quote:
Originally Posted by sepudo View Post
Sooo, I really have to come up with a alternative for locking the service door other than with a padlock.
I had a sturdy lock on the latch that came with it when I bought it from the school and it got broken into and vandalized recently. Looks like they used a crowbar.

Mainly took my tool bag full of tools that I was using for the build and some odds and ends laying around inside.

At least they didn't break any glass.

I reeeally need to find a way to get the air doors to activate from the outside.

Sadly the damage to the doors is probably not enough to justify filing an insurance claim
Heeey, break-in buddies! My bus was robbed three times when I had it stored in a bad part of Philly, but not since I installed a latch ... just like yours.

Fortunately my bus is now in a lot with a bunch of RVs and security cameras and I don't keep anything of value in it any more, but I'll still eventually need to find something more secure. I'm going to be building a bulkhead wall behind the driver's seat with its own secure door, but I'll still want the outer doors well locked since my bicycles will be outside the bulkhead.
__________________
Rusty 87 build thread
musigenesis is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2020, 12:03 AM   #20
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,878
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Thomas Built Bus
Chassis: Freightliner FS65
Engine: Caterpillar 3126E Diesel
Rated Cap: 71 Passenger- 30,000 lbs.
With all the windows in a school bus, it is difficult to have decent physical security of the vehicle.
Native is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Electric door lock somewhereinusa Conversion General Discussions 6 10-27-2011 08:19 AM
this is how I lock my door on the bus lornaschinske Conversion General Discussions 5 12-26-2010 02:20 PM
door lock needed keith Classifieds | Buy, Sell, Swap 0 01-04-2009 11:23 AM
Rear door lock Kirbystud Conversion General Discussions 22 08-16-2005 03:47 AM
Door lock ideas Branden Conversion General Discussions 12 05-02-2005 06:47 PM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:01 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×