Northern US/Canada skooliers - Windows question

[N'om'ad]

Originally Posted by Twigg

There are those, however, who view any suggestion not their own to be a mortal insult.

Ha ha ha - so far off the mark.. I told you, just up there, why I have a problem with you. It's some more of that feedback you were talking about - maybe take it on board.

[Twigg]

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

Ha ha ha - so far off the mark.. I told you, just up there, why I have a problem with you. It's some more of that feedback you were talking about - maybe take it on board.

Let me try to be nice to you, despite the silly names you just called me.

I respond to threads in the "Recent" list. If it's a long thread I probably remember the gist of it, and who the main characters are. I've been here a while, I've seen folk come and go and I recognize posting styles.

However, that's not always the case, so when I choose to respond I do so based solely on what is in front of me, with little regard to what may have gone before. I may not even know what has gone before, or who has said what to whom.

In the example in this thread, I responded, in a fairly light-hearted manner to a suggestion that house windows could be used. I actually though the original remark was made in jest, but ... just in case.

Then you chimed in with your rant about house windows. Quite honestly, until you did that I didn't even realize it was your thread ... but whatever, I generally don't care whose thread it is anyway because they are all available to all of us.

Responding in the manner you did made it perfectly plain who you were replying to, and your protestations to the contrary make zero difference to that. The thing is, you didn't need to make that point, you chose to. I looked back over the thread and your position was quite clear, sensible even, but you still chose to respond in an unkind manner. No one made you do that.

So I pushed back, because sometimes, on a quiet Saturday night when my wife is watching "Desperate Something" in the bedroom, I have the time and inclination to not let things go. Mostly I let them go but tonight I didn't. My bad.

You have to understand a few things. Not everyone is you. Not everyone thinks like you, types like you or even agrees with you. Everyone's circumstances are different and my solution is based upon my priorities, not yours. That's why I frequently state that it's your bus, and you are free to do whatever you like to it. That's not me being snarky, that is me simply acknowledging difference.

Not everyone likes me. I get that. I don't much care for some folk either, but I do assume they have friends and family who love them, and that they are probably very nice people. Chemistry is like that.

I've been here a fairly decent length of time. I am a known quantity. You like what I say, find it helpful and positive, or you don't. I don't have a need to be liked by everyone and I'm fine with that. I take what I need, give where I can, and leave the rest.

Someone being mean to me on the internet is irrelevant. I'm not here to make friends or influence people. I'll give opinions and advice. I'll share my experience and experiences, and folk are free to attach whatever value to them that they like.

You have been here ten minutes. You chose to take an immediate dislike to a well-known and established member of this community. That is something you are free to do. Whether or not it reflects well on you is a matter for others.

Or you could, as I said, back up a little and look at what people say with fresh eyes. Suggesting that you are prepared to "continue to make another community member look ridiculous" is, on the face of it, faintly ridiculous.

Whatever you decide to do, I wish you well with your conversion. I can't promise to stay out of your threads because, as I said above, I won't always know the thread was started by you .... and I don't go looking.

[N'om'ad]

Originally Posted by Twigg

Let me try to be nice to you, despite the silly names you just called me.

I didn't call you 'names', I described your character as I have found you on here and elsewhere. There's a difference - one's childish, one's not. Interesting that you can't tell the difference.

Originally Posted by Twigg

Then you chimed in with your rant about house windows. Quite honestly, until you did that I didn't even realize it was your thread ... but whatever, I generally don't care whose thread it is anyway because they are all available to all of us.

You had already commented on this thread - to claim you weren't aware it was mine is disingenuous at best.

Originally Posted by Twigg

Responding in the manner you did made it perfectly plain who you were replying to, and your protestations to the contrary make zero difference to that.

Ya, you got me there, though it was to all three of you. My assertion that you simply assumed it was to you alone stands.

Originally Posted by Twigg

You have to understand a few things.

You telling me I have to do something is quite amusing after your previous comment re: telling people to do things.

Originally Posted by Twigg

Not everyone is you. Not everyone thinks like you, types like you or even agrees with you. Everyone's circumstances are different and my solution is based upon my priorities, not yours.

How useful do you think comments that are based on your priorities are to other people if you make them without considering their priorities?

Originally Posted by Twigg

That's why I frequently state that it's your bus, and you are free to do whatever you like to it. That's not me being snarky, that is me simply acknowledging difference.

If you are aware that your comment could be misconstrued as being snarky why would you use it in a text comment when the world knows that text is the worst form of communication?
You seem to have forgotten the thread elsewhere where I asked if anyone had mounted a water-tank up high in their ceiling. You suggested it was a bad idea and I questioned that. You took offense at my questioning the Venerable Sage of Skoolia and suggested indirectly that I was an idiot - your words were "Only an idiot would put a water tank, etc.."
A 100 gallon tank weights 800lbs. Would you call anyone who suggested putting a full-length steel rack on their roof an idiot? and then deck it? and then add solar panels?.. and an air-con unit?.. cos I'm pretty sure that would easily add up to 800lbs. Are they idiots, Steve?

And that's why I have a problem with you Steve. YOU are the one that takes offense when people disagree with you. YOU don't think things through very carefully before commenting. YOU make assumptions about what people want/should do. YOU are the one that starts the name-calling.

Originally Posted by Twigg

Not everyone likes me. I get that. I don't much care for some folk either, but I do assume they have friends and family who love them, and that they are probably very nice people. Chemistry is like that.

*violins* I'm sure you are a nice guy underneath and mean well but I'd suggest you have a good think about your REAL motivations for being on here like a rash (why are you even on a thread about Northern skoolies when you live in OK?) and why you take offense when your 'authority' is questioned. I can suggest some good books that would help you with self-understanding and awareness if you like.

Originally Posted by Twigg

You have been here ten minutes. You chose to take an immediate dislike to a well-known and established member of this community. That is something you are free to do. Whether or not it reflects well on you is a matter for others.

Ah, the old 'You should show me respect cos I'm old/old skool'. You already admitted that not everyone likes you you missed that out of your description there. So you mean "a well-known, partially-disliked and established member, etc". It wasn't an immediate dislike but I will admit it was quite quick.

Originally Posted by Twigg

Or you could, as I said, back up a little and look at what people say with fresh eyes. Suggesting that you are prepared to "continue to make another community member look ridiculous" is, on the face of it, faintly ridiculous.

If anyone needs to back up my friend it's not me. That was simply me sucking, as you admitted you did yourself, at just letting your comment about insisting on doing what you like, and not considering my polite request, go.

Originally Posted by Twigg

Whatever you decide to do, I wish you well with your conversion. I can't promise to stay out of your threads because, as I said above, I won't always know the thread was started by you .... and I don't go looking.

Thanks. All the best to you too.

[N'om'ad]

Now, back to the subject - windows.

I've just discovered that the 32" windows directly behind the driver are double-glazed! Not much gap but better than single. Unfortunately most of the windows in my living area are 28". Does anyone have a BB that has any 28" windows that are d/g?

[bansil]

Let's keep it on track about windows...

DG really? interesting

[Yukon Cornelius]

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

Now, back to the subject - windows.

I've just discovered that the 32" windows directly behind the driver are double-glazed! Not much gap but better than single. Unfortunately most of the windows in my living area are 28". Does anyone have a BB that has any 28" windows that are d/g?

Got a pic of them?

[Brewerbob]

Originally Posted by ThePimentals

My thermometer at chest level would read 88° and at the floor would be 35°.

Holy $hit!! Seriously? Yes, it is a big metal box and I don't expect much but that's a 50° differential. Wow.

Originally Posted by Elma

I’d say ditch’em and use house windows.

Really? No one mentioned using house windows???

I see after this that you and Twigg turned it into a pissing context. As far as I can tell you both seem ok. Twigg has been around awhile and he's a little salty. Takes some getting used to I'm sure. To continue the stereotypes, being from BC thicken your skin a bit. It's the internet, if you take ANYTHING personal from ANYONE, you are in for a life time of hurt.

Now back to the glass... I've no idea who Elma is. Who Elma isn't is the first person to suggest house windows in a bus. It comes up 3 or 4 times a year at the very least. Throw a rock thru a house window then look at the shards. Ignore the temps, vibrations, etc., do you really want big sharp triangles of glass in your bus? Parked in a field and away from trees, fine. I wouldn't want them parked under trees especially if you're keeping all of them.

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

A 100 gallon tank weights 800lbs. Would you call anyone who suggested putting a full-length steel rack on their roof an idiot? and then deck it? and then add solar panels?.. and an air-con unit?.. cos I'm pretty sure that would easily add up to 800lbs. Are they idiots, Steve?

I missed that thread. That is a terrible idea!! The roof system you are say others are doing probably does weigh more than 800lbs but what is the square footage of that system? What is the square footage of the water tank? That think WILL change the center of gravity but ignore that. It's going to transfer weight left and right, forward and backwards especially when half empty especially without baffles. I've no idea how you plan to support it but that's a whole lot of force on the ribs that were never meant to take that much on a single or even 3 sets of ribs. The roof deck has 627 contact points and connects with ALL of the ribs (or at the very least more than a water tank).

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

I've just discovered that the 32" windows directly behind the driver are double-glazed! Not much gap but better than single. Unfortunately most of the windows in my living area are 28". Does anyone have a BB that has any 28" windows that are d/g?

How do you know if they are double glazed? The 32" windows I have are not directly behind the driver's seat. The first set are 24s. I can check mine if there's a marking or something.

[o1marc]

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

I believe I was responding to suggestions from Elma and Whatthefak, not from you.

Making assumptions again Steve? Do you see the irony of accusing me of taking things personally? You ever heard that when you point a finger at someone there are 3 pointing back at you? I've asked you before - stay off my threads please. I don't appreciate your narrow-minded, assumptive, arrogant, opinionated (even when not asked for), and now unpleasant, accusatory, approach and your comments aren't welcome. Thanks

Welcome to the internet, deal with it. You don't get to make the rules.

[joeblack5]

Picture, Yes,I would some detail pictures how that looks like and see if it can be retrofitted to my bus whenI am going to hit up the BC junkyards.
I have heard that cold climate buses has double pane windows but never seen one.

Thanks J

[Brewerbob]

Originally Posted by joeblack5

I have heard that cold climate buses has double pane windows but never seen one.

I should have looked at the buses in AK and the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. I didn't see anything odd but then it would be hard to tell as they drive by at 50 mph.

I believe the heaters in my B.B. (from W. Virginia) are rated at 150,000 BTUs. There may be double paned buses out there but I have not seen one either.

[Twigg]

Originally Posted by Brewerbob

I should have looked at the buses in AK and the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. I didn't see anything odd but then it would be hard to tell as they drive by at 50 mph.

I believe the heaters in my B.B. (from W. Virginia) are rated at 150,000 BTUs. There may be double paned buses out there but I have not seen one either.

Mine are rated at 40k btu each, and there are five of them. Bus plied its trade in North West Nebraska.

[N'om'ad]

Originally Posted by Yukon Cornelius

Got a pic of them?

I do but I can't be arsed to move it somewhere I can link to it.. (why can't I just download direct from my library as i can do with my blogger blog?)


They don't look outwardly different to the regular frames but you can clearly see the separating section - 1/4" thick I'd say (which was 'confirmed' by a glass supplier I spoke to today who said standard RV units were 3/4" - 1/4 glass - 1/4 gap - 1/4 glass)



The prices they quoted were encouraging - around $50 for a 25x24 unit and they're looking into whether they can get them stamped for auto use.

[N'om'ad]

Originally Posted by Brewerbob

It's the internet, if you take ANYTHING personal from ANYONE, you are in for a life time of hurt.

I'm not taking it personally - I just don't wanna hear what he has to say anymore..

Originally Posted by Brewerbob

Throw a rock thru a house window then look at the shards. Ignore the temps, vibrations, etc., do you really want big sharp triangles of glass in your bus? Parked in a field and away from trees, fine. I wouldn't want them parked under trees especially if you're keeping all of them.

Are you serious? Do I have to say again that any units fitted would have tempered glass and be fitted to avoid damage by vibration, etc? Apparently I do..

Originally Posted by Brewerbob

I missed that thread. That is a terrible idea!! The roof system you are say others are doing probably does weigh more than 800lbs but what is the square footage of that system? What is the square footage of the water tank? That think WILL change the center of gravity but ignore that. It's going to transfer weight left and right, forward and backwards especially when half empty especially without baffles. I've no idea how you plan to support it but that's a whole lot of force on the ribs that were never meant to take that much on a single or even 3 sets of ribs. The roof deck has 627 contact points and connects with ALL of the ribs (or at the very least more than a water tank).

While I can see that the weight of a rack, etc is spread over more of the length of the bus it's the same weight, even higher up. No-one is planning on driving my bus like a race car in any case. Of course it would change the COG. How about we say that I'm happy that I could figure out how to resist forces adequately having been an architectural designer for over 10 years and now a structural timber-framer for an equal amount of time? And we could also say that it was an idea that I've since rejected because I've realised I can put tanks under the bed-area floor which I want to raise so the floor-bed height isn't extreme as it would be.

Originally Posted by Brewerbob

How do you know if they are double glazed? The 32" windows I have are not directly behind the driver's seat. The first set are 24s. I can check mine if there's a marking or something.

How do I know if they're double-glazed??!! Because I looked at them with my eyes and I saw that they are double-glazed. That's nice that your bus is different to mine. Variety is the spice of life.

[Yukon Cornelius]

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

I do but I can't be arsed to move it somewhere I can link to it.. (why can't I just download direct from my library as i can do with my blogger blog?)


They don't look outwardly different to the regular frames but you can clearly see the separating section - 1/4" thick I'd say (which was 'confirmed' by a glass supplier I spoke to today who said standard RV units were 3/4" - 1/4 glass - 1/4 gap - 1/4 glass)



The prices they quoted were encouraging - around $50 for a 25x24 unit and they're looking into whether they can get them stamped for auto use.

Nice, that's a plus on all accounts.

The only thing I know about loading photos here is they have a size limit per image. maybe you're exceeding it? I know if I take pics with my phone and I load them straight here I have to take them in auto without HDR enabled.

[N'om'ad]

I haven't even been able to log in on my phone yet - says incorrect log-in details but they're not..

[Yukon Cornelius]

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

I haven't even been able to log in on my phone yet - says incorrect log-in details but they're not..

hmm, I don't know about that. if you don't like using a pics sharing site, you can always make a private folder on facebook, and then they will already be compressed when you save them to your computer.
just a thought

[Brewerbob]

First and foremost, cool your jets man.

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

I'm not taking it personally - I just don't wanna hear what he has to say anymore..

I doubt this forum is any different than all the rest. Just block his posts then. AS it is PHP and vBulletin, it should have the same options.

Are you serious? Do I have to say again that any units fitted would have tempered glass and be fitted to avoid damage by vibration, etc? Apparently I do..

As well as mention it to Elma. Yes I saw that. Yes, the "throw a rock thru it" is within the SAME QUOTE as Elma's!! And yes, I mentioned that house windows are mentioned at least every other month. So perhaps, just maybe, that part of it was directed at someone besides you? Hmm, ... could be.

While I can see that the weight of a rack, etc is spread over more of the length of the bus it's the same weight, even higher up. No-one is planning on driving my bus like a race car in any case. Of course it would change the COG. How about we say that I'm happy that I could figure out how to resist forces adequately having been an architectural designer for over 10 years and now a structural timber-framer for an equal amount of time? And we could also say that it was an idea that I've since rejected because I've realised I can put tanks under the bed-area floor which I want to raise so the floor-bed height isn't extreme as it would be.

Same weight higher up, COG, ... I mentioned ignoring that for a moment? Why yes, yes I did. In the real world COG will make a difference but for ease I said ignore that and instead look at the forces of a 100 gallon tank of water sloshing around when hung from only a rib or 3. That alone makes it a bad idea.

So you're an architectural designer and a structural framer... and I know this because you sent me your resume before posting? Sorry, must have missed it in the emails. I'll try harder next time to keep up better.

I also missed the part about putting the water tanks under the bed IN THE POST I SAID I HAVEN'T SEEN. As soon as I catch up on your resume, I'll get started on reading that thread.

How do I know if they're double-glazed??!! Because I looked at them with my eyes and I saw that they are double-glazed. That's nice that your bus is different to mine. Variety is the spice of life.

For someone preaching reading comp, you sure suck at it. You using your eyes to look is real damn helpful in knowing what to look for and for checking other buses. I'll use smaller words this time...

What should be looked for to see if windows are double-glazed or not? Is there a marking? Perhaps knowing what other buses have will help you.

I'm aware that buses differ from manufacturer to manufacturer, model year to model year, and even VIN to VIN. Your "spice of life" comment is no less snarky than anything Twigg said. Mr. Pot paging Mr. Kettle... pick up on line 1.

Second and lastly, cool your jets man. Not taking $hit personal my a$$. Awful worked up for someone that's relaxed.

I would suggest standing back for awhile, taking a deep breath (or several), and starting over. Twigg, as far as I can tell, is an alright guy. Worse case, I'm wrong and he's a total a$shole. Even total a$sholes have good ideas once in awhile. Why not just ignore whatever advice he gives that you don't think fits your plans? HeIl, you don't even have to give him credit if you want to steal one of his ideas and not tell anyone. Pissing him off is probably the best way to get his best ideas. Oh wait,... maybe not.

[Brewerbob]

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

I do but I can't be arsed to move it somewhere I can link to it.. (why can't I just download direct from my library as i can do with my blogger blog?)

Post them on your blogger site and then copy the hyperlink.

{img}https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3a/Cat03.jpg/1024px-Cat03.jpg{/img}

Change the { to [ and } to ] and you should be good.

(which was 'confirmed' by a glass supplier I spoke to today who said standard RV units were 3/4" - 1/4 glass - 1/4 gap - 1/4 glass)

The prices they quoted were encouraging - around $50 for a 25x24 unit and they're looking into whether they can get them stamped for auto use.

Wait, do I have this right? You got a quote for $50 per window? Is that just the glass? Glass and frame? What exactly? I've only gotten one quote so it's a single data point (i.e. about worthless) but it was something like $500 a window. Needless to say, that ain't happening.

[N'om'ad]

Originally Posted by Brewerbob

Second and lastly, cool your jets man. Not taking $hit personal my a$$. Awful worked up for someone that's relaxed.

Sorry, but there's a difference between 'taking things personally' and 'losing patience/getting utterly exasperated with people who don't read, offer advice/their opinion when just real-life experience was asked for, and who make assumptions about the skill-set, experience, etc, etc of someone else they've never met, etc, etc'. If you have to offer an opinion, even if not requested, have you thought about how you could word a comment that didn't sound like you assumed the person you were talking to wasn't a clueless fool - it could start "Have you thought about, etc, etc.."

Also, if you want to know how to tell if a window/glazing is double-glazed then say that because 'How do you know they're double-glazed' is not a clear way of asking that question, having a more usual meaning that is not, apparently, what you meant.

I can counter most if not all of the stuff you've said but I just can't be bothered, you guys are utterly exhausting - but for one example, a water 'tank' (storage unit) made of 6" or larger uPVC pipe oriented fore/aft would not suffer badly from sideways sloshing, especially if they were short lengths. This wasn't even a thread about water tanks but you couldn't help putting your 2 cents in, could you?

I think you and Twigg would get on great - I think you may even be related. Now, tell me how you block people again..

[N'om'ad]

Originally Posted by N'om'ad

They don't look outwardly different to the regular frames but you can clearly see the separating section - 1/4" thick I'd say (which was 'confirmed' by a glass supplier I spoke to today who said standard RV units were 3/4" - 1/4 glass - 1/4 gap - 1/4 glass)

Correction: 1/8" glass - 1/4" gap - 1/8" glass = 1/2" unit. Gap can be whatever you want, I believe in 1/4" increments