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Old 10-04-2018, 06:15 AM   #21
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Dumping grey water out on the ground is gross. Don't do it.
Agreed! Additionally, depending on the definition of "grey water," it is illegal/against the rules in many places. I know... "illegal" doesn't matter to most these days....

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Old 10-06-2018, 05:25 PM   #22
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I think it could go either way. Single tank or dual. The one way valve looks sturdy but as with anything that moves, it can eventually fail.

As far as the whole "dumping grey water on the ground is gross" thing. Ive seen a few videos and articles that deal with it. Storing the water from shower, sinks, clothes/dish washer in a tank then using that water (after filtering out the big chunks) to keep the lawn , flowers or even a garden green. Why not use the water twice and save on the well pumping or water bill?

As far as my bus, I'll go with the "Cat-Box" and save weight by not installing plumbing, tanks and possibly hauling a hundred gal or so of fresh and dirty water.
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Old 10-06-2018, 06:38 PM   #23
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I think it could go either way. Single tank or dual. The one way valve looks sturdy but as with anything that moves, it can eventually fail.
Technically, there aren't really any "moving parts" - just flexing. But I could keep an extra on hand - they're small.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrionsComfortBus View Post
As far as the whole "dumping grey water on the ground is gross" thing. Ive seen a few videos and articles that deal with it. Storing the water from shower, sinks, clothes/dish washer in a tank then using that water (after filtering out the big chunks) to keep the lawn , flowers or even a garden green. Why not use the water twice and save on the well pumping or water bill?
I'm all for recycling water (See Earthships).

I seriously considered using the [filtered] grey water to flush the toilet. It would be a bit complicated on a bus, but feasible in theory. But, nah, too much. I'll stick with the combo tank, thank you. And you can keep your cat box, despite the pros.

I knew that someone wouldn't be able to resist bringing up the cat box.

Thanks for the [other] comments. I really went round and round about the conservation aspect in my own mind before settling where I have. (And yes, I seriously considered the composting route.)

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Old 10-06-2018, 06:41 PM   #24
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I think it could go either way. Single tank or dual. The one way valve looks sturdy but as with anything that moves, it can eventually fail.

As far as the whole "dumping grey water on the ground is gross" thing. Ive seen a few videos and articles that deal with it. Storing the water from shower, sinks, clothes/dish washer in a tank then using that water (after filtering out the big chunks) to keep the lawn , flowers or even a garden green. Why not use the water twice and save on the well pumping or water bill?

As far as my bus, I'll go with the "Cat-Box" and save weight by not installing plumbing, tanks and possibly hauling a hundred gal or so of fresh and dirty water.
Since the "cat boxes" are the cool thing now I was going to swallow the $1000 bill to be up-to-date and avoid the stigma of a black-water Luddite.

However, video convinced me that old tech is often also proven tech. The idea of having to head for the bushes with diarrhea, having to clean skid-marks by hand with a paper towel (instead of using a brush and a pint of water), and stealth dumping the urine container and poop-bag several times a week is just too "modern" for me.

If you have limited space for tanks, like the couple in the video with their Sprinter, a cat box is better than no toilet at all. But since I have the space and weight capacity for tanks, I am going to install an RV toilet. How much water does that need anyways? A gallon every two days maybe? Which would be insignificant compared to shower, cooking, drinking, etc.
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Old 10-06-2018, 06:45 PM   #25
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My only concern would be the diameter of the valve. Most black water tanks have a 3” inlet to allow for the solid wastes to pass through without clogging. If that valve is small in diameter it would without question create some messy problems.
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Old 10-06-2018, 07:06 PM   #26
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I have hepvo traps and am installing them for grey water. If plumbing to grey ilwater into black tank, i don’t see a problem. Too small to use for poo though
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Old 10-06-2018, 07:09 PM   #27
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My only concern would be the diameter of the valve. Most black water tanks have a 3” inlet to allow for the solid wastes to pass through without clogging. If that valve is small in diameter it would without question create some messy problems.
The valve is for the sinks, shower and laundry (grey water), not the toilet. RV toilets have a spring-loaded opening/closing valve (with a foot pedal to activate it). I wouldn't let any big chunks go down the galley sink either.
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Old 10-06-2018, 07:13 PM   #28
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My only concern would be the diameter of the valve. Most black water tanks have a 3” inlet to allow for the solid wastes to pass through without clogging. If that valve is small in diameter it would without question create some messy problems.
Marine toilet squeeze "solids" through smaller pipes but they use either a macerator or manual "turd masher" in the pump.

The correct use of the HepVo valve would be in the grey water piping. RV toilets have a ball or gate valve to prevent the odors of the black tank from entering the interior.
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Old 10-06-2018, 07:18 PM   #29
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Since the "cat boxes" are the cool thing now I was going to swallow the $1000 bill to be up-to-date and avoid the stigma of a black-water Luddite.

However, [this] video convinced me that old tech is often also proven tech. The idea of having to head for the bushes with diarrhea, having to clean skid-marks by hand with a paper towel (instead of using a brush and a pint of water), and stealth dumping the urine container and poop-bag several times a week is just too "modern" for me.

If you have limited space for tanks, like the couple in the video with their Sprinter, a cat box is better than no toilet at all. But since I have the space and weight capacity for tanks, I am going to install an RV toilet. How much water does that need anyways? A gallon every two days maybe? Which would be insignificant compared to shower, cooking, drinking, etc.
That very video (and the thought of puking) helped me back off from cat boxes as well. But let's not open that debate here.
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Old 10-08-2018, 07:29 AM   #30
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Interesting idea, but how to facilitate.

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I'd like to see a discussion on these relatively new valves that allow a one-way flow of fluid through the plumbing. It seems to me that in using these valves one could combine the grey and black water tanks into a single combo tank that holds both grey and black waste water.



When I think about the advantages of a single combo waste water tank, I see how solids would no longer be able to build up as they do in a black water tank. The water from the faucets and shower would work to break up the solid matter. This would mean fewer erroneous readings from the black water tank on your tank level meter.

I think this is a win-win. What do you think?

Please do NOT post about cat boxes (composting toilets). This post is about using water in the plumbing.

Thanks

I would be interested to know this could be facilitated. It seems to me that a fair amount of tank relocation and plumbing would be required. I can’t speak for everyone’s set up, but on my rig the tanks sit parallel to each other and the black tank has a direct line in from toilet. The only way to get waste into the black tank ilwould be to lower both tanks and “T off with a sweeping “Y” and because it all has to be plumbed at a relatively steep angle, I see issues. But if you could make it work, I would add in some water jet tank cleaners and it should work nicely!
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Old 10-10-2018, 07:57 PM   #31
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I would be interested to know this could be facilitated. It seems to me that a fair amount of tank relocation and plumbing would be required. I can’t speak for everyone’s set up, but on my rig the tanks sit parallel to each other and the black tank has a direct line in from toilet. The only way to get waste into the black tank ilwould be to lower both tanks and “T off with a sweeping “Y” and because it all has to be plumbed at a relatively steep angle, I see issues. But if you could make it work, I would add in some water jet tank cleaners and it should work nicely!
So you are asking about how the combo tank could be achieved (not the one-way valves) with minimal effort and fiddling.

Let me start with your last point first. It may not be necessary to install a jet wash inside the combo tank in my setup, since it will have an abundance of water already (that's kinda the point, in part). But there would be nothing wrong with having one. Heck, one could put jets all around the darn thing.

As to relocating your tanks on your rig, I obviously haven't seen them so this advice is predicated on that. I know that grey water will move from tank to tank so long as there is a way for it to flow. Maybe you could install a good sized pipe between the two (2" or 3" in diameter?), even if it's just a "U" connection at the end that you can easily reach (so you don't have to drop them). I would connect the two with the pipe toward the bottom of the tanks, just to get the water going back and forth as soon as possible. Keep the connecting pipe level from tank to tank (no dips). I would think that the shorter it is, the better. Maybe even a direct line between tanks, straight across?

Of course, just to state the obvious, install the HepVo valves first where you currently have traps - or at least before you use any water. BTW, the valves work whether you have a combo tank or not.

When you dump, I would still follow old tried and true practice and pull the "black valve" first. Then, while it's still open, pull the "grey".

I see no reason why you couldn't make your setup a combo tank, so long as you use the HepVo valves. Send pics if you need further input. Just think of the grey flowing into the black as freely as possible, without any low spots in between.

Good luck.

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Old 10-10-2018, 10:35 PM   #32
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Works best when the gray is a tad higher than the black. Doesn't take much.
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Old 10-11-2018, 08:00 AM   #33
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I like your logic but my only concern (if it was me) is the increased need for a dump station.
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Old 10-11-2018, 09:34 PM   #34
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I like your logic but my only concern (if it was me) is the increased need for a dump station.
Thanks but you don't really have to dump more. Think about it. In the scenario above, we have existing black and grey tanks. I'll just say 50 gallons each for example (and simple math). When we combine them that's 100 gallons total of grey water potential with some floaties thrown in when full. If they were separated still, you'd only have 50 gallons of grey, plus whatever small amount goes into the black from the toilet (plus the age-old problem of too much solid material and not enough water to break it up). Combining them should actually increase your capacity, not decrease it. Increase in capacity = decrease in number of dumps. Remember, the grey always fills up first (in a normal situation).

And for a new build, you should be able to make your combo tank whatever size you can fit and/or afford. I'm thinking of shooting for about 200 gallons in mine.

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Old 10-11-2018, 09:36 PM   #35
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Works best when the gray is a tad higher than the black. Doesn't take much.
Meh.

He may not want to work that hard for no real gain.
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Old 10-12-2018, 12:40 PM   #36
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The HEPvO valve is an alternative to a standard, water-filled trap. It takes up less space than a trap and does not dry out over time. Both prevent waste water odors from getting into your living space.

Separating grey and black water is a different issue. In a pinch, grey water could be drained without using a an RV dump station that is designed to treat black water.
Unless things have changed in the last few years if your on national & even state forest land as long as your ( I believe it's 75ft, have to go back & check) away from a water source you can dig a hole & bury grey & black waste.
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Old 10-12-2018, 03:10 PM   #37
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Unless things have changed in the last few years if your on national & even state forest land as long as your ( I believe it's 75ft, have to go back & check) away from a water source you can dig a hole & bury grey & black waste.
Things haven't changed much in the last few decades. Anything I say from this point forward will excite controversy so I'd suggest a bit of research before responding (please).

In the scope of this discussion (dumping holding tanks) it is generally illegal/against regulation on all NFS/BLM land. Of course, some areas define "grey" water differently (think bathroom sink water vs kitchen sink water (with food particulates)), some may look at "volume" differently (an individual taking a poo under a tree vs a bus/rv dumping a 40 gallon black tank). Even dumping your sack of poo into a trash bin is generally illegal (human waste) - and that raises the whole baby diaper debate. Nobody wants to hear any of that so it is preferable to argue that the statements are wrong. I think, with a bit of research - even asking the local forest/BLM ranger, you will find that this (dumping any holding tank anywhere but at a dump site) is not acceptable.

As someone who has found a really nice boondocking site and had to move elsewhere due to smell, I would plead with people not to do this because it is just plain yucky.
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Old 10-13-2018, 07:28 AM   #38
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Things haven't changed much in the last few decades. Anything I say from this point forward will excite controversy so I'd suggest a bit of research before responding (please).

In the scope of this discussion (dumping holding tanks) it is generally illegal/against regulation on all NFS/BLM land. Of course, some areas define "grey" water differently (think bathroom sink water vs kitchen sink water (with food particulates)), some may look at "volume" differently (an individual taking a poo under a tree vs a bus/rv dumping a 40 gallon black tank). Even dumping your sack of poo into a trash bin is generally illegal (human waste) - and that raises the whole baby diaper debate. Nobody wants to hear any of that so it is preferable to argue that the statements are wrong. I think, with a bit of research - even asking the local forest/BLM ranger, you will find that this (dumping any holding tank anywhere but at a dump site) is not acceptable.

As someone who has found a really nice boondocking site and had to move elsewhere due to smell, I would plead with people not to do this because it is just plain yucky.
Here, here! Wholehearted agreement.

Perhaps we need a(nother?) thread about this separate issue?
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Old 10-13-2018, 07:36 AM   #39
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Unless things have changed in the last few years if your on national & even state forest land as long as your ( I believe it's 75ft, have to go back & check) away from a water source you can dig a hole & bury grey & black waste.


Thanks for participating, but let's keep this topic a bit more in focus please. Although a Hepvo valve and a combo tank are two different things, they do have a connection (pun intended). And although dumping waste tanks has a connection to the topic as well, this discussion is about the differences between standard waste handling versus the method in question - NOT how to dump that waste.

Thanks for cooperating.
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Old 10-13-2018, 08:11 AM   #40
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I think it's a solid plan. One tank for both black and grey water. Using the Hepvo trap for the grey drains will prevent the smell from coming back and alleviate the need for p-traps. You may have to dump the tank a tad more often but I don't think it would be that noticeable.
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