Pusher or Puller...PROS & CONS

[aswallie]

Originally Posted by lawdog71

So I decided go thru with a pusher. Perfect timing because my local school district just but a few of theirs up for auction. I'm bidding on a 2006 A3 RE 3904.


~Scott

Watch out for the EPA regulations on those engines. I'm not familiar with that make or model but anything after '04 is going to have some form of EPA emissions regulations.

[o1marc]

Originally Posted by aswallie

I've heard people talk about the towing issue but i don't think i fully understand the problem. My current plan is to flat tow an old 4x4, maybe a Jeep. I'll have a bumper mounted hitch receiver i can swing down onto the bus hitch, then flip it up and strap it to the hood when I'm driving around. Is there issues with this style?

Some steep angle transitions may have your rear bus bumper 4' in the air, where is the front of your toad when this happens?

[o1marc]

Originally Posted by aswallie

Watch out for the EPA regulations on those engines. I'm not familiar with that make or model but anything after '04 is going to have some form of EPA emissions regulations.

It's not the EPA regulations that are the issue, but more the issues with the equipment itself failing.

[aswallie]

Originally Posted by o1marc

Some steep angle transitions may have your rear bus bumper 4' in the air, where is the front of your toad when this happens?

A fair point, i guess the answer to that would be the wife following along driving behind me when it gets a little tricky.

[lawdog71]

Originally Posted by aswallie

Watch out for the EPA regulations on those engines. I'm not familiar with that make or model but anything after '04 is going to have some form of EPA emissions regulations.

To correct you, being that it is still registered as an active school bus, it actually falls under FMCSA regulations which means all DOT inspections should be up to date. So I'm not concerned with this.


~ Scott

[bp1791-unleashed]

Originally Posted by aswallie

I've heard people talk about the towing issue but i don't think i fully understand the problem. My current plan is to flat tow an old 4x4, maybe a Jeep. I'll have a bumper mounted hitch receiver i can swing down onto the bus hitch, then flip it up and strap it to the hood when I'm driving around. Is there issues with this style?

Well, the issue is that the engine and transmission are mounted on a subframe that is attached to the primary bus frame (hangs from it on my first RE, haven't looked that closely on this one yet). That means that the primary frame doesn't necessarily extend all the way to the back of the vehicle.

Additionally, at least on my current RE bus, the bumper is bolted to the power plant subframe with a single bolt through a rubber bushing on either side. For pulling a vehicle 4 wheels down, it is probably adequate, but for towing a trailer, it completely crushed the bushings. I ended up having a 3/4" thick steel plate attached and the hitch is bolted to that behind the bumper, and a hole is cut in the bumper.

The only thing you have to ask yourself with your plan, is do you trust those 2 bolts to keep the bumper attached to the bus. If so, then you're golden. If it were me, I would inspect them for rust and replace if needed, but I think it'd be fine to flat-tow a jeep.

Hope this helps,
Jim

[aswallie]

Originally Posted by bp1791-unleashed

Well, the issue is that the engine and transmission are mounted on a subframe that is attached to the primary bus frame (hangs from it on my first RE, haven't looked that closely on this one yet). That means that the primary frame doesn't necessarily extend all the way to the back of the vehicle.



Additionally, at least on my current RE bus, the bumper is bolted to the power plant subframe with a single bolt through a rubber bushing on either side. For pulling a vehicle 4 wheels down, it is probably adequate, but for towing a trailer, it completely crushed the bushings. I ended up having a 3/4" thick steel plate attached and the hitch is bolted to that behind the bumper, and a hole is cut in the bumper.



The only thing you have to ask yourself with your plan, is do you trust those 2 bolts to keep the bumper attached to the bus. If so, then you're golden. If it were me, I would inspect them for rust and replace if needed, but I think it'd be fine to flat-tow a jeep.



Hope this helps,

Jim

My set up is similar to yours in some ways but different in others. In my case the transmission is on the main frame the the engine on a subframe. My bus has tow hooks mounted into the engine frame and the bumper is held on by no fewer than 8 bolts at any connecting points. I've got a lot of rust to address but it sounds like i could manage a hitch on this bus.

[tlzimmerman]

06 engines should just be EGR or exhaust gas recirc. The easiest to disable by someone in the know. 07 normally starts with the particulate filters......and the final interactions is when they added def.

With a little know how and elbow grease a guy can keep pre def stuff running pretty easily in my experience .

[lawdog71]

Originally Posted by tlzimmerman

06 engines should just be EGR or exhaust gas recirc. The easiest to disable by someone in the know. 07 normally starts with the particulate filters......and the final interactions is when they added def.

With a little know how and elbow grease a guy can keep pre def stuff running pretty easily in my experience .

I don't think the buses in my county use DEF. If the bus I'm trying to get does, I'll just delete it.



~Scott

[lawdog71]

So I didn't win the last bid, but now I'm bidding on 2009 AE RE 3904. I'm currently on the road so I have a friend who will be picking it up for me and putting it in storage till I can retrieve it. Been looking and looking, but cant seem find the bus length bumper-to-bumper, im assuming it is 40'?


Also, DPF system is installed and want to delete it. Has anyone deleted DPF system?


~scott

[dzl_]

Originally Posted by lawdog71

Also, DPF system is installed and want to delete it. Has anyone deleted DPF system?

Is this legal?

[CHEESE_WAGON]

Originally Posted by lawdog71

Also, DPF system is installed and want to delete it. Has anyone deleted DPF system?

Originally Posted by dzl_

Is this legal?

Nope, and it's a $50,000 fine if caught, plus you have to restore it to working order. Exactly the reason I won't touch a DPF or DEF equipped diesel. I might consider a Detroit DD series platform, as I had good luck with those driving OTR, but there are no DD5 or DD8 skoolies on the market just yet, and not likely to be anytime soon.

OP's question...

Pusher - Cooler, quieter, better drive traction. Cooling issues, compromised bad weather steer traction and can wander on bumps at speed.

Puller - Hotter, noisier, reduced drive traction, better steer traction, better cooling.

[cadillackid]

Register in a state with no inspection delete and send it.. on navistar it’s pretty easy to do never tried on a cat.
Never drive to the tree hugger state of California unless you at least have a visual of a dpf still there

[lawdog71]

How ya doing Cadillac? I just left OH, picked up in West Chester.


~Scott

[WIbluebird]

Originally Posted by CHEESE_WAGON

Nope, and it's a $50,000 fine if caught, plus you have to restore it to working order. Exactly the reason I won't touch a DPF or DEF equipped diesel. I might consider a Detroit DD series platform, as I had good luck with those driving OTR, but there are no DD5 or DD8 skoolies on the market just yet, and not likely to be anytime soon.

They don't enforce emissions requirements on motorhome-plated vehicles. Not even in CA (yet).



Lots of truckers in my area delete their newer trucks but it's typically local guys that stay in the tri state area.

[dzl_]

Originally Posted by WIbluebird

They don't enforce emissions requirements on motorhome-plated vehicles. Not even in CA (yet).

Lots of truckers in my area delete their newer trucks but it's typically local guys that stay in the tri state area.

I'm speculating (and going off a vague recollection), but I think there may be a big difference between not enforcing commercial (or maybe non-commercial?) emissions/smog requirements on motorhomes, and allowing pre-existing emissions equipment to be tampered with or disabled.

[CHEESE_WAGON]

Originally Posted by dzl_

I'm speculating (and going off a vague recollection), but I think there may be a big difference between not enforcing commercial (or maybe non-commercial?) emissions/smog requirements on motorhomes, and allowing pre-existing emissions equipment to be tampered with or disabled.

Yup, and even private / recreational motor vehicle codes stipulate that emission equipment cannot be tampered with or removed, at least as long as functionality is intact and can be maintained. Most states have a vehicle inspection process that considers emissions equipment as part of the inspection, whether a smog test applies or not.

[Bus'n it]

Our motor vehicle inspection stations put a mirror under the vehicles to check for emissions equipment.

[WIbluebird]

Private vehicles and motorhomes are NOT subject to inspection in Wisconsin...the only "inspection" is a required smog one that is only done if you live in a handful of counties around Milwaukee.



Even then all they do is check for CELs and that's it

[cadillackid]

Nada in Ohio except may they still have e check in NE Ohio but I think it’s gone too.. but a car from out of state they verify the vin matches the title, go get a tag and drive.
Renew online.
Only commercial vehicles get real inspections

There’s some awesome bad ass rides in this state...
unlike California where everything has to be a Prius putter

But there’s all kinds of ways to delete and fool the states that do inspect. Visual is easy
Computer part can be some with a couple extra modules on the network or custom firmware
I have no idea how it works if you use the Vermont method of registration I’m guessing that since people 1000s of miles away register that they don’t require inspections to renew?