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Old 12-02-2020, 10:04 PM   #1
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Exclamation Roof raise with all-thread, help please!

Hey I have a 2008 international 72 pass and we're doing a raise for 18" with the all-thread method

I attached photos of the raise Wes did from transcend existence (on youtube/skoolie.net) its the one with the circular tube and beefy all-thread

also is a photo I found on a blogbut forgot to bookmark it (sorry!), they use thinner all-thread and square tubing and mount it with bolts, the thread seems to bend and warp f you look at the top

Wes used 7/8 rods and made 4 mechanisms

however, all I can find in my area is 5/8 zinc plated thread from home depot
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Everbilt...0837/204325653

my plan is to cut them in half (36") and do 6 mechanisms instead of just 4, 3 on each side. Also I would have to use square tube probably in 1".

https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/l...ds-d_1341.html

on this website it says 5/8 threaded rod can hold 1800 lbs before failure, does anyone know if my idea will work or if i need to find bigger rods?? thanks in advance
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File Type: jpg Bus43 (1).jpg (304.8 KB, 36 views)
File Type: jpg wes.jpg (105.5 KB, 29 views)
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Old 12-03-2020, 09:49 PM   #2
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Keep in mind that the 1800-pound rating is for a rod under tension...hanging/pulling. The ability to support weight is a completely different matter and would be subject to several factors...how well supported is the rod, how much lateral/side load is there, and how long the rod is extended between the supports. So...unfortunately...I can't tell you if those are strong enough. But don't get lulled by that 1800-pound figure.
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Old 12-03-2020, 09:55 PM   #3
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Go to Lowes. They should have 3/4" Threaded rod. If you buy the 36" and do not cut or remove the tags, you can return them when you're done. (This is the NY'er in me talking!)
I did three on each side too which made dialing in the raise much more accurate.
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Old 12-03-2020, 11:09 PM   #4
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What would be wrong with a method like this:

roofraise.png

(Orange is the bus rib; red is a piece of square steel tubing, say 1", welded to the rib above the cut line; blue is a collar of slightly larger square steel tubing with a 1" inner dimension that the red piece fits through and welded to the rib below the cut line; green is a bottle jack or floor jack)

It would work on basically the same principal, require the same amount of welding, and use easier-to-find (and cheaper? not sure) materials, and the bending resistance of 1" square tube (or even larger, pretty easily) is going to be greater than 3/4" all-thread.
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Old 12-04-2020, 01:13 AM   #5
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If I recall, Wes only uses the rods to adjust the height to level things, he has two jacks front and back that are used to lift the roof and provides a backup support, or you can say the threaded rods are backups if a jack fails. In any case, you want some support if something breaks, the roof won't crash down on you inside.
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Old 12-04-2020, 06:16 AM   #6
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you all are making too much work of it. if it were to start leaning and falling what you going to do to stop it as you might be inside ? make sure the welds are good then all that grinding off? we made large 2x8 saw horses and used a 12 ton hydraulic jack with blocks so if it got suddenly windy and it fell it would be supported by the sawhorses. the tall sawhorses helped with the outside work also when it was done.
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Old 12-04-2020, 07:47 AM   #7
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The threaded rods do two things. 1) provide a means of leveling and added securement as you use bottle jacks and posts at two ends, and 2) keep the roof aligned while avoiding twisting where it would fall down. (Provided you keep the nuts adjusted as you go up. I secured my posts to the ceiling ribs by screwing in a cross piece of 2x3 with the post attached to it. I drilled a slight recess at the bottom of the post for the jack's round pad to fit in.
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Old 12-04-2020, 07:55 AM   #8
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I used a floor jack for like a hot second when doing our raise.... I got really pissed off after every time you jack up the front one a few inches it takes enough tension out of the back on to fall out and slap the ground and scare you or hit you in the head. just as easy to literally lift the rough by hand while someone snuggs up the jamb nuts. repeat on rear
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Old 12-04-2020, 08:03 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rochey6957 View Post
I used a floor jack for like a hot second when doing our raise.... I got really pissed off after every time you jack up the front one a few inches it takes enough tension out of the back on to fall out and slap the ground and scare you or hit you in the head. just as easy to literally lift the rough by hand while someone snuggs up the jamb nuts. repeat on rear
I had no choice but to do the roof raise myself. Much like everything else on my bus! That said, I saw the potential of what was happening to you which is why I secured the posts to the ceiling. When the rods or jack reached their limit, I would pull the jack out and the posts would hang there. Added some wood blocks under the jack and kept going.
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Old 12-04-2020, 09:43 AM   #10
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1800 psi under tension.... not compression

The 1800 psi load number is for all thread under a tension load. You would be using that short section under a compression load.

The failure mode is not likely to be the threads of the rod or nut failing.

The failure mode is likely to be the rod itself folding like a Z from little tiny side to side loads.

I think on a short bus, like twenty feet or so.. I would have four on each side.

Another way of putting it... one rod for every five or six feet for each wall.

Forty foot of roof would get eight. Yup more work. More cost.

If using 1/2 inch one every eight feet.

I use a rod of some sort as a gauge for checking total height. tape measures move around, a precut gauge for total height is going to be the same every where.

My thoughts.

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Old 12-05-2020, 09:24 AM   #11
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Just did my roof raise last week and had the same issue finding anything larger than 5/8 all thread. I ordered 36” pieces of 1” all thread from Amazon along with nuts and washers. Used floor jacks until the jacks reached their travel limit and found it was easier to use the all thread to raise the roof the last few inches. Did a total of ~18” raise on a 40’ bus.

I don’t have a need for the all thread any longer and would be happy to sell it at a very reasonable price but shipping would probably make that prohibitive, cheaper to just buy from Amazon I suspect.
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Old 12-06-2020, 01:40 AM   #12
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I did my 12 inch raise using the all thread method, 7/8 I believe, with 1 inch tubing. The only problem I had was I was scared so I decided to use 6 instead of 4 and found out I could actually teeter totter the whole roof (35ft) on the 2 center jacks. After that I just used the 4 others to lift and the center ones as safeties by keeping them hand tight.
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Old 12-06-2020, 03:12 PM   #13
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All I used was 4 pieces of all thread. easy peasy. No add'l stuff to lift needed.
I used 3/4 but would probably use 7/8 if I did it again.
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Old 12-10-2020, 01:50 PM   #14
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Okay so thank you to everyone for your comments, I have been doing a lot of research and talking to people trying to get this all set up.

I'm thinking about changing gears and using my old seat brackets that I just found, I saw someone do it once with the brackets attached to square tubes which were welded to the channel. He used 1/2 rod which I agree is a little weak.

So I'm thinking of using 6 3/4 rods, with seat brackets bolted and welded straight to the channel. With the rod drilled through the brackets and nuts holding them in place. I plan to use 2 floor jacks to push the roof up and just tighten the nuts as we go up. The guy who did the bracket raise (on facebook btw) said he just used the extra square tubes for alignment and seems to think my idea will work, my biggest worry is attaching the brackets to the channel.

If anybody out there knows what seat brackets I'm talking about, mine were rusty and I cleaned them up on the wire brush but they seem to be sturdy still very thick metal. Should I give it a go or should I make a "mechanism" like in the photos, would the square tube around the thread really make a difference? keep in mind 6 pieces of 3/4 rod this time around
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Old 12-10-2020, 08:57 PM   #15
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I use all thread and unistrut for 4" emt racks. Often in layers, where I must drive the nuts up several feet. I use this hollow shaft "deep well" socket on an impact driver. Its made by Rack-A-Tiers. Maybe useful on a roof raise.
https://www.skoolie.net/forums/membe...cture25219.jpg
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Old 12-10-2020, 11:49 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeMac View Post
I use all thread and unistrut for 4" emt racks. Often in layers, where I must drive the nuts up several feet. I use this hollow shaft "deep well" socket on an impact driver. Its made by Rack-A-Tiers. Maybe useful on a roof raise.
https://www.skoolie.net/forums/membe...cture25219.jpg
the guy i mentioned on facebook did that i think, the thread ran through angle brackets and he just used a drill to tighten the nut and raise the roof as well. I looked up unistrut but how do you use it? like the square/circular tubing in the photos at top?
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Old 12-11-2020, 07:52 AM   #17
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This is all 5/8". I use it for load support in hospital energy production. I haven't done a roof raise. If I did, I'd use P1001

& square washers, but I have it in stock.
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