Single Super Tires

[IWC Bus]

Greetings everyone,

Sorry it has been so long since I charmed in on any subjects.
Has anyone played with the idea of Super Single Tires on a skoolie? I have seen one bus with them but I was unable to speak with the owner to fine out how they preformed.

I.W.C. Bus

So I thought I was going to retire!

[peteg59]

Would the stock width rim work reliably with those?

[Brad_SwiftFur]

Originally Posted by peteg59

Would the stock width rim work reliably with those?

No, you'd need a correspondingly wide rim.

[gotjuice?]

I have them on mine.

[tugboater]

I noticed most of the tractor trailer sets in Europe run on similar rims and tires rather than a dually setup. I wonder what is better?

[peteg59]

Assume better fuel mileage over running "duals"...?

[o1marc]

Less rubber and metal in SS over dually, fuel saving. They are less likely to blow out than a dually, but if you do, you probably won't have a spare with you and a road service tire might run as high as $1k. They tend to wander on rutted roads. Traction in snow will be diminished with SS.

[Elliot Naess]

I was behind a set of pups running super-singles on a shoulder-less two-lane north of Sacramento when his right-side rearmost tire blew out. And for a moment I was CERTAIN... that pup was going over and down the ditch.

The inertia of the trailer and cargo dropping to the right, then suddenly stopping on the rim... lifted the left tire off the ground for a while.
Somehow... it settled back down on the pavement. ...And constituted a major hazard for the heavy traffic on that narrow road until road service got him rolling again.

Dual tires may have been a "desperate" necessity when first invented, but they just happened to invent an important safety feature in the bargain.

On a lighter note... I have some "super singles" for sale.

[o1marc]

That ain't no asphalt tread on them SS's.
What is that contraption your building in the background?

[Elliot Naess]

Correct.
Dirt Track Sprint Car.
The tires I use are all the right rear. Then I build wider rims.






Pedal car, but I didn’t built it. I’m only adapting it to various uses. It was originally built for Kinetic Sculpture Racing with four golf cart tires. Then I somehow "inherited" it.
Here it is a taxi -- note "driver's" uniform.

[o1marc]

Originally Posted by Elliot Naess

Correct.
Dirt Track Sprint Car.
The tires I use are all the right rear. Then I build wider rims.






Pedal car, but I didn’t built it. I’m only adapting it to various uses. It was originally built for Kinetic Sculpture Racing with four golf cart tires. Then I somehow "inherited" it.
Here it is a taxi -- note "driver's" uniform.

Is that your car? Mine was 01. I still have stacks of used tires in the basement I have no idea what I'm going to do with them. Probably 40-50 tires.

[Elliot Naess]

CAUTION; Thread drift in progress.

CAUTION; Thread drift in progress.

Alas, no, I never raced. “I only played one in the movies.”
Actually, I used to write for a car magazine, and I did a story on Sprint Car Hall-Of-Famer Jimmy Sills, when he was operating his racing school. That’s a school car he let me drive a few laps for a taste of it. Great fun!

Thus… Jimmy introduced me to Sprint Cars and those meaty right rears, and I introduced those tires to Kinetic Sculpture Racing – which is a human-powered sport.
Here is one I built and did pretty well with.

Two versions of it.
The four-seat four-wheel-drive version was close to unstoppable.
(I steered from the back seat, yes.)

[Elliot Naess]

I really must stop posting on this forum. Every time I do, it kills the thread -- no-one wants to risk more of my drivel.

o1marc... I would like to talk Sprint Car with you, but I can never figure out how the PM system works on this board. (Or it doesn't work very well.)
If you don't mind a little Sprint Car talk... would you please send me an e-mail to...

agatonburn@outlook.com

(That's an address I can throw away if anybody abuses it.)

[Dirtdoctor]

I’ve talked to truckers that used them. They found the hassles of down time with a flat the biggest issue. Bad off road capabilities and they follow ruts like a ten speed in a storm drain. Damage a rim and you are out good $$$$ and someWait
Time if your in a area that doesn’t have lots of S.S. rigs. For me and my fleet we stuck with quality tires and duals.


Dirtdoctor

[shorthair]

How do you limp down the road to the tire shop on a blowout on a super single ? Or will you get to pay for road service.

[Elliot Naess]

If I may refer you to post #8 in this thread.

[Sehnsucht]

I've run them on OTR semis and would rather have a set of duals any day. Besides the 'limp' capability, they do wander more, grip less, and in the case of semi trailers they offer a narrower stance which makes trailers even more prone to cross winds.

I cannot confirm this but I've also heard that you have to confirm that your axle is capable of using super singles - something about the wheel bearings may wear unevenly due to the altered rim offset. May be true, may not, I'm unsure but I didn't need any more reason to be dissuaded so I never looked into it.

[CHEESE_WAGON]

I initially sent this as a private message reply, but thought better of it, apparently I didn't send it to the OP anyway LOL. The info here would be beneficial to anyone considering this...

DON'T. For the love of God and all that is holy, DON'T.

As a trucker, I can tell you that these things are not all they're cracked up to be. Sehnsucht is right, but not just from a bearing wear standpoint. If not shimmed / spaced properly, they actually decrease stability, the whole reason for having duals in the first place. You actually need spacers or a wider axle in the first place, otherwise they give up a lot of stability, and you might tip it over before you have a chance to destroy the wheel bearings...

For example, I drove a 2016 Freightliner that had Stupid Singles when I got it at 4500 miles. But I can almost guarantee this was not a factory install. When hooked to a trailer, I could visibly see that the outer sidewalls were a good six inches in from where the outer dual's outer sidewall would have been -- PER SIDE.

Giving up a foot of width greatly decreases stability when the bulk of the vehicle's weight rides above the tires, and curved exit ramps at perfectly legal speeds that would have been no problem with duals, scared the hell out of me with the Stupid Singles. The narrower the wheel track, and the more top-heavy the vehicle is, the more easily the vehicle will roll over, and I can tell you from experience, switching from duals to Stupid Singles is not a good idea.

If you do, make sure that the proper size shims and spacers are used to maintain sufficient wheel track. Stupid Singles have less traction in certain situations as well. Reason being that a dual setup can simply push loose stuff out between them instead of spinning a single surface above it.

Another benefit of having duals is that if you blow one tire, you can limp on what's left to have it repaired. Can't do that with Stupid Singles, and every minute you wait for a road service to repair/replace your tire is a minute you're at risk for someone running off the road and crashing into you.

They have been said to increase fuel mileage, but I'm not seeing it. I managed 7.5-8.1 in a dual-wheel Peterbilt 386, that Stupid-Single Freightliner managed 6.6-7.0. Another Cascadia with dual-wheel managed 6.4-6.8.

To compare...

The 386 - 10L, 10-speed, 3.42 gearing, 7.5-8.1 with 46k loads
SS Cascadia - 15L, 10-speed 3.23 gearing, 6.6-7.0 with 38k loads
Dual Cascadia - 15L, 10-speed, 2.94 gearing, 6.4-6.8 with 44k loads

The first two were pulling 38k-46k on average, both had fairly level roads for the most part. The third one did far more mountain driving and had an average 44k load to boot. So as you can see, have not seen where Stupid Singles help fuel economy that much, if at all. New Stupid Singles cost anywhere from $550 to $1400 or more each, you can get duals for around $250 each.

As you can tell, not a fan, mostly from a safety standpoint. Wide singles are okay for heavy-haul trucks that need more weight distribution on the front tires, but I haven't seen where they're beneficial as drive or trailer tires.

[Sehnsucht]

I think the fuel economy argument is only going to apply to someone who's driving 100K or more a year because the difference is only about one-tenth of a mile per gallon. For an over-the-road truck driver that adds up but for a skoolie I don't see that they're worth the cost.