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Old 04-02-2015, 08:34 PM   #1
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99 International Thomas 7.3 Allison MT 643

Cool thing about this Bus is that it does have a rear axle ratio of 3.21........and it's also in pretty damn nice condition.......It is mine so no disclaimer I do intend to make a profit for the time and energy and research so let's not get bent about that.........priced it well I think.

Pretty Nice little Bus cruises right in the sweet spot at 75 and beyond.......thanks to that sweet little axle ratio.............. hope someone likes it. Have a feeling it will go away pretty quick.

1999 Thomas 7 3 Liter International Allison MT643 Trans Extra Nice | eBay
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File Type: jpg thomas..........JPG (107.2 KB, 21 views)
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Old 04-02-2015, 10:00 PM   #2
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Oh yes.. Those pug-nose buses are so strange, yet awkwardly cute!
It looks like the dash cluster has some dead instruments. Not too surprising, really. That IH cluster is plagued with issues. I'm looking for a new board for mine.

I have to ask, though, is this really a mechanical 7.3l? Firstly, I would be surprised if it was able to 75 or 80mph if it were a 7.3l IDI. I'd be even more surprised if it were a 7.3l IDI with a turbo. Secondly, most any International 7.3l engine from 1994 upwards is likely to be the HEUI driven 7.3l, also known as the T444e. A good engine (I like mine), but far from a pure mechanical creature.
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Old 04-02-2015, 10:01 PM   #3
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Also, what are the tire sizes? From the pictures it appears that the rear tires are smaller than the front.
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Old 04-02-2015, 10:31 PM   #4
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Good observations from every one. Tires are the same front and back. I believe those are 19.5 inch rims as to leave interior floor absent the wheel well humps.

As to the accuracy of speed. I believe speed and ease of obtaining it and sustain it is attributable to the ale ratio. 3.21

As to the instrument panel. I am told that once the ignition is on the gauges go to where they belong.

As to the T444 being mechanical, turbo charged or computer controlled. I based my observation to that the result of the MT643 transmission. My experience, which for sure is not inclusive of all things BUS: But in my experience I have had mechanical engines mated with a trans with an ECU... (C.8.3L to a BR-400). But not the other way around. And electronic engine to a mechanical trans. Di feel free to correct or amend my observations as you see fit.
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Old 04-04-2015, 03:48 PM   #5
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Just to follow up on this..............this is NOT a 99 ............but in fact it is a 96. Every thing I have read suggests it IS a computerized engine. And also suggests that by this year it would also be turbo charged.....The Allison MT643 IS a mechanical Transmission. I have zero experience with an electronic engine, if that is what this 7.3 is, mated to a mechanical transmission. I DO have experience with a mechanical engine mated to a electronic transmission so I don't preclude the possibility. I JUST DON'T KNOW.........So if any of you guys want to educate me to the 1996 7.3 and its various permutations I'm all ears. I simply have zero experience with these engines.

As to speed and the legitimacy of my claim of 80 mph. I owned a TC1000 same length as this bus though a transit style. That bus had the Cummins 5.9L rated at 160HP.........it had a final drive ratio of 1:1 and that ran through an axle ratio of 3.24.........that Blue Bird would run out quietly at 75MPH on the flats...........by my reading these 7.3 were pretty much standard at 190 HP in school buses of this ERA....so would 80 mph be a stretch? Not even...


The 7.3L is one engine I know very little about. I don't have the VIN or I would have done a conversion of that VIN to find out exactly what engine is in that bus.............Any help at knowing what's in this bus is appreciated.......
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Old 04-04-2015, 05:15 PM   #6
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7.3 is a good engine, MT 643 is a great transmission
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Old 04-04-2015, 05:28 PM   #7
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yeah Kubla i've read enough to know the 7.3 is a revered engine that played into the purchase of this bus.........most importantly to me was the low (numerically) axle ratio.

BUT. and it's a big BUT the whole International/Ford collaboration.........the Ford rebranding of this engine and as well some changes they made, wrist pins, modified pistons.......hardened valves when they added the turbo different cranks for the Mechanical different cranks for the electronic...........and of course the T444E and the Navistar tweaks and different electronics used and the in the Mythology both engines Powerstroke and the Navistar being discussed in the same breath as the same engine when in fact they are not. Basically the same is not the Same..............So it's confusing to me first to fine information about a T444E and finding it in a discussion as a PowerStroke.........I just want to glean information on the engine in this bus. Know being the operative word. Not speculate, not appears to be or could be. I will simply put it on the back burner snag the VIN and find out exactly what is in this 96 and take my exploration and learning from there. A lot of folks like these engines for the most part..........but there were glitches along the way. I simply want to know what I have.
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Old 04-04-2015, 06:34 PM   #8
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All this talk about MPH inspired me. On my glampout return trip I decided to "see what she'll do".
I had forgotten to unplug the GPS while camped for quite a while so the
averages are way low.

2000 BB TC1000 5.9 with 3.54 diff.
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Old 04-05-2015, 03:14 PM   #9
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84MPH.........with a 5.9 with 160 HP is just fine isn't it? Really don't understand why your fuel mileage is below 10 to 12 though..............I was regularly seeing 12 MPG in my TC1000 while cruising at 67 MPH
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Old 04-05-2015, 03:36 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mokibrabrant View Post
84MPH.........with a 5.9 with 160 HP is just fine isn't it? Really don't understand why your fuel mileage is below 10 to 12 though..............I was regularly seeing 12 MPG in my TC1000 while cruising at 67 MPH
The mpg info is left over from my old gasser. Since I took the pic, I have entered the new info of 12 mpg for the 5.9 and lower fuel prices too.
When I set that, diesel was about $4 and gas was about 3.50.
My 5.9 is tagged as 185 hp.
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Old 04-05-2015, 03:44 PM   #11
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Yeah I saw yours is a 2000 model..........so they specified some more hp and yours also has the 24 Valve..........my understanding is you can pick up another 20+ HP by simply removing the muffler. I liked mind a lot.............It was like a very spacious stationwagon to drive, since I drive mostly full sized Coaches..............I love the aspect of not being terribly concerned with where to park, where to go and always having to require an entry exit strategy..........that just went away with this little bird...........Cool little Coach as far as I'm concerned.
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Old 04-05-2015, 09:12 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mokibrabrant View Post
84MPH.........with a 5.9 with 160 HP is just fine isn't it? Really don't understand why your fuel mileage is below 10 to 12 though..............I was regularly seeing 12 MPG in my TC1000 while cruising at 67 MPH
Every bus with a 5.9 Cummins here is 190hp with a p injection pump..

Only Dodge trucks from 89 to 93 had the 160hp 5.9 Cummins with the VE injection pump.

Nat
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Old 04-29-2015, 07:31 AM   #13
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is it still available? quite a drive for me if i were to come get it, and im interested (im in n wi). i see the ebay ended, doesnt say it sold....
nathan pm me
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Old 04-29-2015, 01:56 PM   #14
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Quote:
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Every bus with a 5.9 Cummins here is 190hp with a p injection pump..

Only Dodge trucks from 89 to 93 had the 160hp 5.9 Cummins with the VE injection pump.

Nat
What is every bus here? And your head is where the sun doesn't shine............I owned the TC1000 and it was at 160HP.......... "Every bus here"...........just an asinine statement. go outside and play or something. Living in your own private Idaho isn't getting it done............
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Old 04-29-2015, 04:32 PM   #15
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come on ya'll play nice in public, if folks need to go "behind a door" or "out back by the wood shed" maybe PM'ing each other might work

No need to hijack a thread, for it...and I am not calling anyone an instigator, a rioter or thug, everyone just seems to be mis-understood ;)

So maybe we need a place to hash it all out?
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Old 04-29-2015, 05:58 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mokibrabrant View Post
What is every bus here? And your head is where the sun doesn't shine............I owned the TC1000 and it was at 160HP.......... "Every bus here"...........just an asinine statement. go outside and play or something. Living in your own private Idaho isn't getting it done............

I have done and said nothing unprofessional.

My comment about Cummins engines was to try to help people with a common misunderstanding. 99% of the older 12 valve 5.9 cummins engines in buses start at 190 hp. Sometimes people misunderstand the difference between what is used in buses and dodge trucks.

I call no one a here lire. I simply add info anywhere I feel it might help.

I am human, and therefore sometimes wrong. You have a detuned 5.9 due to how small the bus is. It's to my understanding that buses are powered according to the GVW of the bus. This little TC1000 therefor only got 160hp.

I don't take kindly to name calling, bashing, and all the other stuff mokibrabrant has done that breaks the rules of this site. If you disagree, disagree and leave it at that. Move on.

Janet must be away from her desk. When she returns, she will clean the crap out of this thread, and place disciplinary action on the member that insists on braking the site rules.

We have rules on this site for a reason, learn to follow them.

Edit, I see mokibrabrant has deleted the worst of his two posts. Trying to hide what he did from Janet. I should have quoted them to lock the wording for all to see.

Nat
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Old 04-29-2015, 06:07 PM   #17
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NC is the only state I have seen the pug noses (not in VA, TN or SC)

Anyone have a good reason why they went that route? Do they have a removable dog house also?
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Old 04-29-2015, 06:13 PM   #18
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i looked at one and did some research,there noisy , have a bad ride because of the placement of the engine and eat front end parts.98 i believe was the last model
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Old 04-29-2015, 06:33 PM   #19
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i looked at one and did some research,there noisy , have a bad ride because of the placement of the engine and eat front end parts.98 i believe was the last model

These were nice little Buses and were extremely quiet: I was concerned with that also prior to driving it for the first time: I already had sourced the latest damping materials and was prepared for just what you say..........

Here's the significant difference The front end was completely re-engineered for the TC1000 and typically, as was mine, it had a 3.24 rear axle. I also looked at a lot of different methods to get more HP out of the 160HP 5.9L Turbo, again that research took place prior to my first drive. It cruised at 70 very quietly. The only time it labored was climbing the Siskisyou's it still maintained 55 at the highest altitude there, the air was heavy with rain and I could hear it was starved for oxygen; Kind of sounded the way a bus sounds when it's up against the governor: I attribute to just not enough available HP exacerbated by breathing problems. Just like Humans

I put more than 2500 miles on this TC in about a two week period, using it as a service vehicle to resurrect one of my Crowns. I DO regret selling it. It was a dependable nice handling little bus. And the gearing was perfect...........My understanding with these last 12 valves in this bus just by removing the muffler and running straight pipe was good for another 25HP and of course one always had the option of adjusting the fuel plate. This engine could have been taken to 225HP.........but I totally understand why you or anyone would think it would be noisy and that noise is directly attributable to extremely high gearing (numerically) typically found on most transit style school buses. 5.54 and 5.58 or very very common.......so at highway speeds and/or an attempt to get there. Yeah. Stuff gets loud
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Old 04-29-2015, 07:32 PM   #20
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I straight piped my FE 12v, 5 ft of pipe out of turbo...the loud part is the intake suck resonating off the steel perferasted noise dampening ceiling

I do want to cover ceiling and do Kore insulating to dog house etc....she is loud...but! Its a big jazz bus do that makes it cool when I pop in ear plugs ;) reminds me or 2-1/2 ton trucks in army
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