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Old 01-18-2017, 06:50 PM   #2001
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A little sprinkle for sure. Every time I see rain like that I'm glad (or disappointed) it's not snow since 1" rain is 15" of snow. On the cold rolled, if it saves you enough headache its sure worth it, time is valuable.
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Old 01-18-2017, 06:54 PM   #2002
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In this case...it would have saved a backache too. I've really grown to hate that stuff.
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Old 01-19-2017, 05:35 PM   #2003
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A "Solution" for mill scale to pass along --- No really...a solution. You know, like...a mix of liquid stuff.

After bending over for half a day grinding the mill scale off couple of sides of my water tank box and going through two ceramic disks at almost $10 bucks a pop, I decided to go back to the "easy" way of doing it. As with Muriatic Acid. But, I hate that stuff almost as much as mill scale. At full strength, one good whiff can totally destroy your sense of smell and a little splash can blind you. Not the most fun stuff in the world to play with. And one of its' more annoying qualities is that because it is a really thin liquid that likes to run, it does not work worth a caca on anything but flat, horizontal surfaces so you wind up having to constantly reapply it or flip the work around thus vastly improving your chance of blindness.

Then I remembered an old artists' trick for getting water to adhere to just about any surface. Use a surfactant. More commonly called a wetting agent. And even more commonly called...soap. That's right, add a few drops of something like liquid hand soap or dish washing detergent to water, paint or, as it turns out, even acid...and it will cling. Still a little runny but nothing like without it.

So, today I mixed up a solution that was 1/3 water, 2/3's muriatic acid and added about 4 drops of liquid hand soap. When applied it hung in place and went right to work. And the dilution along with the soap greatly reduced the fumes. In fact, I didn't even notice any acid fumes except while pouring it into the mix. Excellent! It went right to work and did the job on the scale with just a couple of applications. And while I will still need to hit the metal lightly with a sander or stripping disk, 99.9% of the scale got scrubbed off with the disposable paint brush I used to apply it.

Important notes...

Never, ever pour water into acid. It can chemically boil and explode in your face. However...if you add the acid to the water...nothing happens. I know it sounds bizarre, but it just works that way. I only know this from working with cement and years ago reading a line in a 1914 or so Mason's guide. In it was a corny mnemonic device used to train apprentices in the safe handling of acid. It goes...

"Do like you oughter...add acid to water".

Maybe not poetic or even proper grammar, but hey...it stuck with me for all these years and I still use it on my students when teaching my cement sculpting classes.

Anyhow, the solution worked great and I just wanted to pass it along.


This was before rinsing. Be sure to rinse it thoroughly when done or better yet, paint on some baking soda dissolved in water as a stop bath for the acid. Note that a thin layer of flash rust will form almost immediately but, unlike the mill scale, it is easily knocked with just a lite sanding. Play safe kids.

ONWARD!
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Old 01-19-2017, 08:04 PM   #2004
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Looking good Tango and the acid sure beats all that sanding.

The complete adage goes: "If yer good an do as you oughter, add the acid to the water". The reason is that if there is splash back, it will be the water whose surface tension has been disturbed that will form the splash while the poured liquid will pass through the "opening" in the air water interface to mix with the water beneath the interface.

Doctor science signing off.
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Old 01-19-2017, 08:08 PM   #2005
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So do you offer internships on "bus building" ?
Pictures look good
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Old 01-19-2017, 08:27 PM   #2006
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I will definitely consider schooling any intern who is willing to work 12 hours a day, seven days a week...for free.

And...thank you Mr Wizard (aka; Jack) for the science lesson!
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Old 01-19-2017, 09:57 PM   #2007
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I wonder how commercial detailer's wheel acid would work, sounds like you just made a homebrew version of it.
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Old 01-19-2017, 10:29 PM   #2008
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Wheel acid? Interesting. Never heard of it before. But then I rarely even wash my car, let alone detail it.
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Old 01-20-2017, 09:27 PM   #2009
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Nasty stuff, will flash rust brake rotors, discolor paint and turn tires pink if left on long enough. It works well though, strips just about anything off of metal.
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Old 01-20-2017, 09:39 PM   #2010
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Cool...something new to check out. Thanx!
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Old 01-22-2017, 11:56 AM   #2011
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It's the "little stuff"...

Just had to rant on this one. Spent the better part of yesterday trying to find a tap or thread chaser to clean up some existing threads so I could wrap up one area. Seems all of the 1/4" bolts & screws on my bus are 1/4 x 24 thread. One that I can find bolts for but not a tap. HD...Lowes...three auto stores...two neighborhood hardware stores. Lots of 20 & 28 thread but no 24. Came down to a line from the Wizard of Oz...

"Not nobody, not no how."

Have to wait until Monday and hit one of the local Chinese tool megastores or a specialty machine supply.

Grrrrrrrr...
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Old 01-22-2017, 03:27 PM   #2012
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Hey Tango. I went right out and looked at my taps. Lots of 1/4 20 and 28's but no 24. What is being held together by 1/4 24 s?

When I was building the Morris which uses Wentworth fasteners I just re tapped all the nuts with metric taps of a similar thread count and diameter--worked fine and I'm too cheap to deal with buying a Wentworth tap and die set along with the wrenches. Jack
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Old 01-22-2017, 03:44 PM   #2013
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Tango,

Try the store on Normandy just south of I 10. I've had excellent luck finding what I need there. They're just across the railroad tracks on the left if you're going south from the interstate. Wonderful people to work with and find odd ball stuff like that. In addition, they know EVERYONE that might have something like that IF they don't. I got a bunch of stuff from them this past August when I was working on the antenna array.

M
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Old 01-22-2017, 06:58 PM   #2014
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Jack --- I guess "standards" have apparently changed since WWII.

M --- Do you know the name of the place on Normandy? Sounds like a spot I need to get familiar with.
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Old 01-22-2017, 10:01 PM   #2015
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I will check at Oday's Hardware tomorrow for you Tango. When I can't find something out of the ordinary, Suzie always seems to come through. I will PM you tomorrow morning when I find out.
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Old 01-23-2017, 06:45 AM   #2016
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https://www.amazon.com/Hanson-1521-2...H4AM74JY2PYNH6
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Old 01-23-2017, 08:42 AM   #2017
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Thanks guys.

Not at all familiar with O'Days but will look them up.

And while you can get just about anything online, there is no substitute for being able to drive a few blocks and pick something up when you need it.
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Old 01-23-2017, 08:52 AM   #2018
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I found it Tango. Odays Hardware would have to order it from C W Rod in south Houston. CW Rod said they could not get it until 12:30 today. If you want to call CW Rod, their # is 713-944-4210. Talk to Mark. If they only wholesale, call Gordon @ Odays and ask him to order it for you. 281-485-6111.
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Old 01-23-2017, 08:58 AM   #2019
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Thanks again. I'm about to call the big Chinese tool house up on 34th St.. Actually, they carry a full range of price & quality and rarely do they NOT have just about anything I am looking for. As I recall, the name is "Empire Tools" (?). We'll see.
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Old 01-23-2017, 09:10 AM   #2020
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Roger that Tango. I've been to Empire Tools many times. Let me know if I can be of anymore help.
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