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Old 01-21-2021, 04:15 AM   #1
Skoolie
 
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Year: 1998
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Allison MD 3060 Stranded Mode?

Our international Amtrans bus ha a 7.3 with allison md 3060 granny. A few days ago after changing the radiator as I was slowing down for a cattle guard, she downshifts all the way to first gear then stopped with a clunk. That was it no forward progress. She would go in reverse but not forward.

The back of the bus was covered with tyranny fluid. I had sprung a bad leak in the cooling line going to the radiator. I reversed off the road and fixed the line the next day. Took 20 quarts to bring it up to level.

She still didn't want to go forward. So I attached a tow bar to the front, started her up. Put her in neutral, and tried to tow her with my 3/4 ton truck. Whe I pulled it seemed like the bus pulled back. If I got in the bus and gave it throttle it went nowhere. Put it in reverse and it locked in and was ready to drag the truck.

So, I shut her off and she was able to be towed. I got about 1/4 mile and had to turn into a side road. The bus pushed my rear end into a ditch. I hot in the bus and started it in order to drag the truck out of the ditch. In reverse she did the job fine. Then I shifted to neutral. It made a clunk/ting.

Somthing told me to try drive. It went and has been working fine since. It seems like maybe the tyranny locked me out of forward gear till it was sure it had enough fluid. Ut the stop with a clunk and the eventual start with a clunk/ting are a bit unnerving. Anyone else ever expieanced any thing like that?
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Old 01-21-2021, 07:49 AM   #2
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Wow. That is not a good adventure. Good on you that your pickup and emergency pull stuff paid of. When you pulled did you have the engine running? Were you pushed in the ditch because the bus wheels dis not turn? Any pics in this stress full time?
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Old 01-21-2021, 07:52 AM   #3
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When you came to a stop with a cluck was that the transmission locking up? Did it feel similar to switching a car tranny in park while still moving?

Johan
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Old 01-21-2021, 08:04 AM   #4
Skoolie
 
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This reply is to Joeblack5.
No, I could not run the engine because even in neutral, the transmission resistance resisted forward motion. Being pushed I to the ditch was the result of the bus wheels not turning enough to make the corner. Sorry no pictures. I was pretty busy trying to get my crippled bus home so taking pictures was not even a concern.
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Old 01-21-2021, 08:06 AM   #5
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If the engine could not run in neutral.. how did you get it started to get in reverse?
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Old 01-21-2021, 08:10 AM   #6
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Year: 1998
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblack5 View Post
When you came to a stop with a cluck was that the transmission locking up? Did it feel similar to switching a car tranny in park while still moving?

Johan
It did. I was off of the throttle and allowing the bus to slow to a creep when it happened. My back was out of whack and the cattle guard was one that had a bit of a bump to it, so we were only traveling a few miles an hour when it shifted into first gear then just stopped. Our bus does not have park, but that is what it felt like. Very solid.
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Old 01-21-2021, 08:11 AM   #7
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Sorry, had to re read it a couple of times. Got it now. So the tranny got stuck in neutral.. as in locked up but with the engine off the transmission got unlocked.
Johan
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Old 01-21-2021, 08:15 AM   #8
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Year: 1998
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblack5 View Post
If the engine could not run in neutral.. how did you get it started to get in reverse?
The engine ran just fine in neutral. It just would not allow me to pull or push the bus while the engine was running. The engine continued to idle. The wheels would not roll. With the engine off then it rolled freely.
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Old 01-21-2021, 08:19 AM   #9
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Sorry, had to re read it a couple of times. Got it now. So the tranny got stuck in neutral.. as in locked up but with the engine off the transmission got unlocked.
Johan
No. I could shift into reverse and drive as far as I wanted to. I could shift into neutral or any drive gear. When I did that the bus was stationary. It would not move under it's own power or allow itself to be pulled or pushed.
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Old 01-21-2021, 08:36 AM   #10
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in case you do not have this.


https://cdn.mpparts.com/pdfs/Trans%20Codes.pdf


Johan
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Old 01-21-2021, 08:47 AM   #11
Skoolie
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblack5 View Post
in case you do not have this.


https://cdn.mpparts.com/pdfs/Trans%20Codes.pdf


Johan
Thanks Joe. My shift selector does not have a readout on it. Perhaps it is not the 3060. I have not tried to identify it any further than what the sēler posted in the auction when I bought it. The shift selector is a t handle r n d 3 2 1.

I'll download and read the whole pdf when i am not on my phone. Tiny letters, 59 year old eyes.
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Old 01-21-2021, 10:36 AM   #12
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It's likely not an MD3060 if it has a T-handle shifter. My limited knowledge tells me its probably an Allison MT643 or 2000 series. Some of the others will chime in and likely know the answer.
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Old 01-21-2021, 10:36 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblack5 View Post
in case you do not have this.


https://cdn.mpparts.com/pdfs/Trans%20Codes.pdf


Johan
Just saved that to my google drive. Learn something new everyday.
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Old 01-21-2021, 10:59 AM   #14
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If you could take a picture of the data plate on the side of the transmission it would help all parties concerned to help identify it. When an automatic transmission looses the oil like that a lot of foam is created and it is hard to get clutch apply pressure. Reverse has double the line pressure so some times you will have reverse but no forward. After you refill the transmission the dipstick will read incorrectly due to the aerated transmission fluid (read to high) and then after over night the foam will disappear and your level will be too low. If you over fill it it will also cause aerated fluid. If you are back home with it just let it sit for a couple of hours and re check the fluid levels. I think you may have a mechanical Allison by your description.
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Old 01-21-2021, 11:12 AM   #15
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The plate you're looking for will look something like this one. And, if it helps, here are book images of a couple different Allison models - if you can't find the data plate, these might be of assistance in identifying the series. Note on the AT model there's not rear bolted case seam.

Screen Shot 2021-01-21 at 9.09.17 AM.png
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Old 01-21-2021, 01:28 PM   #16
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My best guess is you had a clutch that wasn't engaging / disengaging due to either damage from being low on fluid or you had an air bubble in the hydraulic valving that controls the shifting.

It might not hurt to have a tranmission shop drop the pan, inspect for damage and change the filter / fluid.

Ted
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Old 01-21-2021, 03:12 PM   #17
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Sounds like you have transmission damage, likely from running it out of fluid.

Drop the pan and inspect, but I wouldn't count on everything being a-okay just because it works now.

Also, anytime your bus is towed or pulled, you either need to have the engine running, lubricating the transmission innards, or pull the driveshaft. You can tow it a little bit without doing that, but transmission damage can occur if the bushings/bearings aren't lubed while the output shaft is spinning. That's why most tow companies pull the driveshaft as standard procedure.
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Old 01-21-2021, 03:27 PM   #18
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Engine: 6.9 International
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With an rnd321 shifter I'd bet that you have a mechanical allison vs any of the electronics.

An md3060 will have either push-button or t-handle, but will always have a display of some sort.

The 1000/2000 will have a rn(D)d21 or a rn(D)421

whereas the mechanical came with rnd321

Some have swapped shifters between the 1000/2000 and mechanicals. But I've never seen them swapped like that from the factory.
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Old 01-22-2021, 10:31 PM   #19
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I had a water truck with a at 545 that failed exactly the same way, including the resistance to towing with the engine running. The reverse clutch was stuck on, maybe from a bad valve or stuck plunger? so when you put it in forward gear the trans is putting pressure to both clutches and locks up. I never fixed it though so canít help there
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Old 01-23-2021, 03:53 AM   #20
Skoolie
 
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Location: Freedom Field, New Mexico
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Year: 1998
Coachwork: International
Chassis: Amtrans
Engine: 444E
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FAC View Post
I had a water truck with a at 545 that failed exactly the same way, including the resistance to towing with the engine running. The reverse clutch was stuck on, maybe from a bad valve or stuck plunger? so when you put it in forward gear the trans is putting pressure to both clutches and locks up. I never fixed it though so canít help there
That is a pretty reasonable explanation for the way it behaved. Being 5 gallons low on fluid could certainly have caused that to happen. Drained the pan. Took it off and looked for apparent signs of damage. All clean. Granny is working fine with the leak fixed and the right fluid level. Thank you for your analogy. Makes a lot of sense.
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